Aug. 15, 2025

Royce D'Orazio - Content Creation, Media, and Scandals

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Royce is a well known and famous TikTok star who has many connections and stories to tell. Royce's career extends beyond TikTok and has roots in radio and film. Royce and I discuss Content creation, Hollywood Scandals, and the existing political landscape.

https://roycedorazio.substack.com/

Watch the Video Episode:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvNd2me9y-8&t=2070s



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WEBVTT

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All right, we're going hoys, got it going after your

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technical difficulties, so we're fine.

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This is the thing.

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This is the thing for me. I don't I don't

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do the typical interview question answer thing. I like to

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I like to do a little background and eventually, in

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our conversation your background comes out in terms of your

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experiences and whatnot. So yeah, welcome to the show.

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It's the way we do it.

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The one thing I got to ask, though, is I'm

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not going to pronounce your last name because I'm gonna

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not do any justice. So if you could possibly do

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that for me, I'm horrible, I really am.

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Well, first of all, thank you for having me. I

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appreciate that here well, and you can butcher it however

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you'd like. But my full name is Royce Durazzio. That's

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just the cleanest, easiest way to say it.

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You just way to do it, all right, Royce, Well,

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thanks for being here. Now going through, I'm gonna be

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honest with you. I've been listening to a lot of

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your podcasts lately and it's not bad, no, but it

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seems like we have a little bit of a similarities

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in terms of what we have done. Possibly in some backgrounds,

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and then I was looking through your blog and I

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see that you do. You know, you write a little

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bit on some politics, but you're also just about, hey,

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what's happening, current events, et cetera. And I did hear

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one podcast that you did where you were talking about

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streaming and content creation. So I mean, there's a lot

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of ways we can go here, because I think all

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of those things are good topics to have, especially since

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everybody is trying to get into the podcast base. Everyone

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wants to be a content creator, et cetera, and I

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think they have a lot as a big false sense

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of what it takes to do this. You know, and

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your son's been doing this longer than me, so I'm

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sure you have a lot more stories. But I know

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you were doing the TikTok thing for quite a bit.

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Don't know if you still do. That's something I never

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got into. But you know, let's start with where you

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came from with your content creation and why. I mean, honestly,

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you can tell me why.

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You know, as you asked that, I think it goes

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further back than I realize, because I had an internet

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radio show before podcasting was a term, and we were

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in a guesthouse in Beverly Hills and we had four

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phone lines trunked like real phone lines trunked into each

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other and we would go live on RANT Radio and

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we did this underground show for like two years every Sunday.

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Podcasting came out and I didn't understand it at first.

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Turns out it just means recorded, so it goes that

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far back. The TikTok thing is a whole other ride.

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I fell into that during the pandemic, and that was

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based in a lot of irl stuff, but mostly Disney parks.

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And now I'm trying to break that whole thing.

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Okay, Well, what attracted you to do in the underground radio?

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I've always loved radio. I grew up listening to Stern.

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I'm from the Philly suburbs and I just love talk.

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You know, I've got a face for radio, the gift

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of gaps. What's a good combination, And I think that

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especially in a day's world. And one of the reasons

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I'm loving substack so much is it's like perfect for

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audio and people are always looking and I love radio

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because it just forces you to listen. So I've just

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always loved radio. And one of the things that Stern

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did for me growing up was I felt like I

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was sitting in a room with contemporaries hanging out, and

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that added value, especially when you get to a point

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when you're growing up where you feel like you're all alone, right,

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So to have those familiar voices that would maybe inform

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me a little bit, make me laugh, there's value to that,

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you know.

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Yeah, I've always been more on the audio side personally

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as well. There's something about hearing a conversation without the

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distraction of visuals. But with this big push lately with

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all the podcast aggregators, hosts, everybody wants to go to viato.

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They think it's the thing.

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But you know, when I look at what's going on

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as statistics like, I still have more downloads, more and

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more interaction on my audio side than I do on

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the video side. Regardless, it's just two different worlds, two

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different ways of consuming it, two different people that want

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to want to go ahead and consume it a certain way. Really, so,

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I like audio. It allows you to focus and really

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hit the conversation. Now, with that being said, let's talk

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about your podcasts, because there's a few episodes I don't

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even know if we can talk about this. But one

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thing that drew my interest. I don't know how far

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you want to go because you're geting at vague about it. Anyway,

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it was kind of a shorter one is when you

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were talking about James Gunn a little bit. I really

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wasn't sure the whole story on that. Yeah, you know,

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given the nature of my podcast, by the way, it's

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it's pretty much current advanced politics geopolitics.

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Now, I'm not sure how political.

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We're going to get, but this is something that really

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caught my attention given the Superman movie. And there's a

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few things that you said in terms of like, you know,

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maybe he stepped on people to get where he got,

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and you know, you didn't say exactly like that. I

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am that's just kind of how I heard it. But

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the reality is, can can you get more background on

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that situation and what you know and kind of what

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you heard secondhand? Because I wanted to get more detail

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on that. If you're okay talking about.

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It, I'm happy to talk about it, and I love

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that's what you chose. Uh So let me start with this.

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I grew up with some guys that wound up becoming

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close to and working with James. So what I have

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to say comes through those accounts, not through you know,

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reading things online. It's not even secondhand. I guess technically

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it's secondhand, but it's really it's firsthand. Right. So at

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the time that well, let me let me start with

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James as a as a person and as a writer.

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I personally, and this is just a personal opinion that

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he's a horrible writer. And if you want proof, go

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back to those Scooby Doo movies where he made scrappy

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do the villain? I mean, who does that? Right? Like?

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Who does that? Just so that's bizarre. So, but the

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first Guardians of the Galaxy was developed by a woman

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named Nicole Pearlman. I think it was about a decade

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in development. So he plucked it and she got some

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benefits off of it. I don't know if it was

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a producer credit or what. But he took everything with

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it and and he from what I heard through the

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people that I know, is that he kicked and screamed.

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He had a web series at the time, uh with

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with a raccoon puppet, I believe, and he got that

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going enough that he was able to say, I know

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how to do this. I know how to do this,

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and he's so, but what I what? I what I

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know that's more important and we're relevant to where you're

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going with this, is they went to those parties. I

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saw the photos from those the parties that my quote

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unquote former Well now they're former friends, so I can

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say that former friends went to where the uh priest

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and uh child party. I don't remember exactly what they

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called it, but it was either you you dressed up

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as a child or you dressed up as an abus

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or a priest. That was the premise, right, their premise,

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not mine. So it was I don't know if they

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called it priest and pedophiles, and you could go, well,

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that doesn't even make sense, but like, who really needs

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to waste that much time thinking about logic, right? And

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the kind of people they hang out with. Some of

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them are self proclaimed there's a band that they hang

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out with. So it was this type of group of people,

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and there's a lot of familiar names that you would

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know that we're at these parties that I was told

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was at these parties. But moreover, when the whole thing

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broke with Disney, I had already seen those photos on

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the person's cell phone, who went to the party. The

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article that you may be referring to that I wrote

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about with the individual in it is somebody that I

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grew up with, and when I went to source the

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photos for my sub stack, I didn't realize that he

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would be in the in the picture, and it jarred me.

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And this is somebody, I mean, I grew up with

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someone who correct to the extent that I have IMDb

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credits with them. Okay, yeah, I'm sure that was a shock.

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The photo was a shock. I knew he was there,

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and I knew he was part of it, and I'm

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privy to a lot more than what I just said.

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But that's that's me laying the tracks for you, and

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so take it where you'd like. Well, you know, it's it's.

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Really really really getting down to I'm sure you can

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only say so much without getting in trouble, right, James

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gunn Is, He's he's a fairly powerful figure, I guess.

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In terms of with somebody for the truth, can you.

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Well, here's you want to know what I believe. I

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really don't give a damn who they are. If they

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did it, in my opinion, fuck him, I don't really care.

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I don't care how powerful they think. They are not

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gonna affect me personally, honestly, they're just not. They don't

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control my income. So you know, as far as as

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far as you're concerned, you mean, be as open as

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you want to be. But the reality is I personally

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didn't know about these parties that if he's involved in,

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and the tie to Disney, like, I didn't understand everything

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that was going on. I just I just know that

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all of a sudden he just started coming up. Not

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sure why. I know that the movies he's been involved

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with where yeah, they're kind of like okay, but yet

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everybody's praising this guy. And so when I heard your

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podcast you're talking about this, you know, these allegations or

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whatever was going on with these parties kitty parties or

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pedophile parties if we want to call it that, I

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really really just caught my attention. I really was like, WHOA,

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what the hell's going on with this? And it really

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really raised the question because it sounds like you know

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a lot of people in that world right just from

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growing up with people, you have associations, and it's really

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like the stories that we always hear about this, I mean,

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are they really true? Is there a lot of that

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going on in Hollywood in general?

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Yes, really, there's a lot of that goes on in

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the world period. And not that I'm trying to flip

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it into a plug, but I literally just wrote an

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article that was really more of an info dump. It

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wasn't even really an article. It's literally an info dump.

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But when you stop and you look at that level

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of power and those people, it transcends party politics, it

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transcends religion and any other ideology, and at that point

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it becomes about nothing other than more power and more money.

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So that's why you'll never see the Epstein files, you know,

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because everybody is involved at that level.

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Well yeah, and that we can absolutely assume. And then

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since you brought that up, you know, also the other

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tie that everyone can see if you're actually just connecting

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the dots, even at a third grade level. Did he

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how was that not related?

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You know who?

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Everyone saw it? And then suddenly he gets off, you know,

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slap on the wrist. Really and as far as the

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Epstein files go, it's very evident that look, if there

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was nothing that was going on there, why was Jill

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saying Maxwell arrested?

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Why for what being a pimp only Well, I don't

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know how you. I mean, I think it's indisputable there

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was something going on, right.

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Yeah, so she was arrested for being a pimp. There's

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no list, but somehow they had to hold her. Now

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she's trying to negotiate, saying she's going to release names

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in the list. If Epstein wasn't who he was and

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didn't have the connections he did, why would he kill

226
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or not kill himself? However you want to coin that one.

227
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So there was a lot going on here that everyone's

228
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trying to hide and cover up. Obviously, to me, what

229
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I thought in the beginning, because I was looking at

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it from the geopolitical point of view, was they didn't

231
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want to release the list because I think personally, I

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don't know for sure, this is all conjecture, but I

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think that there was ties to world leaders that would

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really up to end everybody's world, and at the moment,

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they couldn't just release all these names because it would

236
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just be a shift form.

237
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So I think that's what.

238
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Was really going on in the beginning, But now I'm

239
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not really sure what's going on. So they have evidence,

240
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then they don't have evidence, Then they do have evidence.

241
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I mean, they had about two decade investigation into everything

242
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was doing, but somehow they don't have anything at all now,

243
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like it all just disappeared.

244
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Well, so I think what it really And it's interesting

245
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to talk about the idea that, oh, it'll bring down

246
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power structures and industries and all these things. But I

247
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think more importantly, it's just because Epstein is out of

248
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the picture doesn't mean that the leverage that he had,

249
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much like Diddy, doesn't hold value. So I think it's

250
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more about we don't want to release these things because

251
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we give away all the leverage we have on all

252
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these people. Why would we do that?

253
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That could be that could be the case. And while

254
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we may have leverage, it also sets the precedent so

255
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far that it's okay to get away with doing those

256
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heinous things. Though, I mean, if there's never gonna be

257
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accountability and they just keep getting away with it, so

258
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what does that say to the rest of the world.

259
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But I think that's the that's the raw truth. I

260
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think that And look, I mean Superman, so just let's

261
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bring this all up. And because it does so, Superman

262
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just opens up right, Superman is being produced. First of all,

263
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it's wild to me that he's directing the movie and

264
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the CEO at the same time. That should be considered

265
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a conflict of interest in Anythingeah, I heard you talk

266
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about that. Okay. So then on top of that, you

267
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have the whole politicization of the Superman movie. You have

268
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the James gun pedophilia accusations over the years and all

269
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of that michigas to use some Yiddish, and then you

270
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have the Trump of it all and the EPs. I mean,

271
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it's all so murky, and then you have people arguing

272
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like in ways that are just completely hypocritical because they

273
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can't see it for what it is. We live in

274
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a world where people at this level are not held

275
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accountable for their actions period. Has nothing to do with party.

276
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Yeah, well, and that's true, But when did I mean,

277
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will we ever be able to hold anyone accountable in

278
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your in your opinion? And do you think it is

279
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ever gonna happen or is it just because they are

280
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in a powerful position that's just going to constantly be

281
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able to get away with the lifestyle they live.

282
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Well, I think Trump is like the velociraptor in the

283
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first Drassic Park, testing the weaknesses. So what Trump has

284
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done in as they like to call it, one point

285
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zero and now is continue to test the weaknesses in

286
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the system, which only opens it up for somebody who's smarter, sharper,

287
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and more able to do more damage. You know. That's

288
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I think the problem is that we're headed in that

289
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wrong direction. That's kind of one of the reasons that

290
00:14:12.720 --> 00:14:15.399
I think we need to start having more open conversation

291
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from the middle and really get back to like, I'm

292
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not here to persuade, and I don't mean literally with you,

293
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but like, I'm not here in the conversations I have

294
00:14:23.759 --> 00:14:27.279
with my audience or anybody or even you to persuade.

295
00:14:27.799 --> 00:14:29.759
I'm actually here to pick up something that I might

296
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not have thought of. And I think people need to

297
00:14:31.799 --> 00:14:33.799
get out of their silos. I see a lot of

298
00:14:33.840 --> 00:14:37.440
the same faces talking to the same people. It's like

299
00:14:38.279 --> 00:14:40.399
to make another James Gun reference, and I'll let the

300
00:14:40.440 --> 00:14:42.240
nerds pick this up on their own. But it's like

301
00:14:42.440 --> 00:14:45.919
the Toxic Avengers. When I see you know, the same

302
00:14:46.080 --> 00:14:49.879
six people you know circulating on the same podcast, I'm like,

303
00:14:49.919 --> 00:14:52.639
you guys are just yelling at the same audience. You're

304
00:14:52.639 --> 00:14:57.360
not producing any new conversation because that's too much work.

305
00:14:58.240 --> 00:15:01.399
That that's that's another conversation, and that's something I agree

306
00:15:01.440 --> 00:15:02.519
with me with you on.

307
00:15:03.919 --> 00:15:06.960
Now, Okay, we'll get to that.

308
00:15:07.200 --> 00:15:10.519
As far as far as the James Gun thing, I mean, Epstein,

309
00:15:10.600 --> 00:15:11.919
it is what it is. We know it's out there.

310
00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:15.200
It's unfortunate what's happening. But as far as James Gun

311
00:15:15.240 --> 00:15:18.639
is concerned, I don't even know how many I mean,

312
00:15:18.919 --> 00:15:21.240
how deep does this go with him? How long has

313
00:15:21.279 --> 00:15:22.960
this been going on with all these allegations, because I

314
00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:25.279
literally don't know. I never paid attention to the guy,

315
00:15:25.360 --> 00:15:27.720
to be quite honest, and I'm so engrossed with so

316
00:15:27.720 --> 00:15:29.600
many other things that I do on the podcast that

317
00:15:29.639 --> 00:15:31.840
I really if you only take so much in right,

318
00:15:31.879 --> 00:15:33.799
it's a crazy world right now, there's so much happening.

319
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How deep does that go that you know of? So

320
00:15:37.279 --> 00:15:40.279
the whole thing that happened with Disney in a nutshell

321
00:15:40.440 --> 00:15:44.399
was they started unearthing old tweets. This guy comes from

322
00:15:44.399 --> 00:15:47.320
the Troma world, so he's always sort of been the

323
00:15:47.480 --> 00:15:52.039
alternate guy, right, So he's always considered himself to be

324
00:15:52.159 --> 00:15:55.639
sort of a you know, I don't know what you

325
00:15:55.679 --> 00:15:58.480
want to use. A provocateur is the word he would use.

326
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I don't quite think. I don't think he's that witty.

327
00:16:01.679 --> 00:16:04.159
I think he wishes he was a provocateur. But he

328
00:16:04.200 --> 00:16:07.039
would say these outlandish things over the years on Twitter.

329
00:16:07.240 --> 00:16:09.360
He had relationships I cannot remember the name of the

330
00:16:09.399 --> 00:16:12.720
band where they're self proclaimed pedophiles. They just go after

331
00:16:12.799 --> 00:16:16.399
They would talk about going after young underage girls. Right,

332
00:16:16.559 --> 00:16:21.200
So he surrounded himself with these type types of people. Well,

333
00:16:21.240 --> 00:16:23.480
all I can tell you is that at the time

334
00:16:23.559 --> 00:16:29.279
that this happened, at the time that he was being fired. Okay,

335
00:16:29.360 --> 00:16:32.399
at the time he was working for Disney prior to

336
00:16:32.440 --> 00:16:35.720
being fired, he was having these parties because I know

337
00:16:35.799 --> 00:16:40.960
people that went there. And my one former friend came

338
00:16:41.080 --> 00:16:43.279
up to me and goes, look at what I wore,

339
00:16:43.399 --> 00:16:46.759
and he shows me his selfie where he dressed up

340
00:16:46.759 --> 00:16:49.200
like a child with a propeller hat on at the party.

341
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And I looked at him like, what is what is

342
00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:54.720
wrong with you? Like what part of you thinks this

343
00:16:54.799 --> 00:16:58.759
is something that I this is not entertaining. And then again,

344
00:16:59.519 --> 00:17:03.080
if you are suggesting you're a provocateur, there's no audience here.

345
00:17:03.120 --> 00:17:07.160
This is behind closed doors. So what I can verify,

346
00:17:07.480 --> 00:17:11.240
or what I can say verifiably is that those parties

347
00:17:11.279 --> 00:17:14.799
happened during that time. One of the people I know

348
00:17:16.039 --> 00:17:21.960
worked one of the people I knowed. I'm deciding if

349
00:17:21.960 --> 00:17:23.920
i want to say what I want to say, because

350
00:17:24.039 --> 00:17:26.319
somebody who's really sharp can put all the dots together.

351
00:17:26.720 --> 00:17:32.200
But one of the two people I'm talking about spent

352
00:17:32.279 --> 00:17:35.240
a long time getting close to James because it benefited

353
00:17:35.279 --> 00:17:38.799
their career, and it has to the extent that you'll

354
00:17:38.799 --> 00:17:43.680
find James has producer credits on all of their projects.

355
00:17:44.400 --> 00:17:46.319
So it's kind of one of those things where it's like,

356
00:17:46.440 --> 00:17:49.039
and that's the industry, right. I mean, I don't want

357
00:17:49.079 --> 00:17:51.759
to totally derail it, but I could tell you other

358
00:17:51.839 --> 00:17:55.200
stories of other situations, public stuff that you would know

359
00:17:55.279 --> 00:18:01.200
about where I've worked with people who openly talked about

360
00:18:01.240 --> 00:18:04.319
these things as if they were okay. And these are

361
00:18:04.359 --> 00:18:09.519
people who on paper should be speaking out against these things,

362
00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:11.599
but they turned a blind eye because of their career.

363
00:18:11.880 --> 00:18:13.759
And I'm talking about people that work with Cosby by

364
00:18:13.759 --> 00:18:15.839
the way, So it just it's sort of like one

365
00:18:15.880 --> 00:18:17.920
of these things where again and no, there's no party

366
00:18:17.960 --> 00:18:20.319
lines anymore. I could tell you that I'm a Democrat,

367
00:18:20.559 --> 00:18:23.119
I could tell you I'm a Republican, it doesn't really matter.

368
00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:25.599
I'm making a ton of money. I'm turning a blind

369
00:18:25.599 --> 00:18:30.720
eye to your transgressions. Right, that's Hollywood. That's that's really everything.

370
00:18:30.720 --> 00:18:32.839
I shouldn't it's not fair to just pick on Hollywood.

371
00:18:32.920 --> 00:18:35.880
No, no, no no, but it's we're talking about Hollywood since

372
00:18:35.960 --> 00:18:38.400
we well I brought up the James Gunn thing. Yeah,

373
00:18:38.440 --> 00:18:41.160
so that's why we're discussing it. But you know it

374
00:18:41.200 --> 00:18:43.519
gets me, is I don't I don't have that mindset,

375
00:18:43.680 --> 00:18:47.359
like why what is attractive about a child? Like what

376
00:18:47.440 --> 00:18:49.880
is it about that type of person or people like

377
00:18:49.920 --> 00:18:54.519
that that they need to abuse and destroy children?

378
00:18:55.279 --> 00:18:57.480
Like why? I mean, I don't even want to have

379
00:18:57.519 --> 00:18:59.880
that conversation because then you're asking me to get inside

380
00:18:59.920 --> 00:19:02.359
that mindset. And I can only tell you because I

381
00:19:02.400 --> 00:19:06.000
know you listened to that particular episode that I've seen

382
00:19:06.640 --> 00:19:10.359
throughout my life a lot of this stuff firsthand, and

383
00:19:10.400 --> 00:19:12.319
I think it always comes back to the same thing.

384
00:19:13.160 --> 00:19:14.799
People like to see what they can get away with.

385
00:19:16.039 --> 00:19:19.759
I know it goes deeper, but generally speaking, when it

386
00:19:19.799 --> 00:19:23.279
comes to power and abuse, people like to see what

387
00:19:23.319 --> 00:19:27.079
they can get away with. Can I say anything on

388
00:19:27.119 --> 00:19:32.079
this podcast? Yeah? So I worked with a woman who

389
00:19:33.640 --> 00:19:42.160
at the time was over at NBC. Now, she said

390
00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:44.759
to us at lunch one day before this Bill Cosby

391
00:19:44.759 --> 00:19:48.839
stuff ever broke when Hannibalbarris broke it. She because she

392
00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:51.000
was a producer on The Cosby Show as a young woman,

393
00:19:51.799 --> 00:19:54.799
she said, very flippantly over lunch, as if it was

394
00:19:54.839 --> 00:19:57.839
about running an errand Bill Cosby used to force the

395
00:19:57.880 --> 00:20:02.319
pas to give him blowjobs, as if she said, Bill

396
00:20:02.359 --> 00:20:04.160
Cosby used to force the pas to pick up his

397
00:20:04.240 --> 00:20:08.480
dry cleaning. You know, it's just like what you do

398
00:20:08.599 --> 00:20:16.000
just part of your day. Now that woman has an oscar.

399
00:20:18.079 --> 00:20:21.000
She's I don't want to make this issue that it's

400
00:20:21.039 --> 00:20:26.839
not but on paper, you know, Democrat, Democrat supporter. And

401
00:20:26.880 --> 00:20:29.960
I know these things firsthand because I worked on campaigns

402
00:20:29.960 --> 00:20:32.960
by happenstance that she was on. And it's just the

403
00:20:32.960 --> 00:20:36.240
small world that way, uh, and went on to produce

404
00:20:36.279 --> 00:20:41.519
other people and you know, beyond Cosby and so so

405
00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:45.200
saw it for what it was back then, right, went

406
00:20:45.359 --> 00:20:49.559
on to trade off of other plights and get an oscar.

407
00:20:50.240 --> 00:20:53.319
I'm trying to be a little vague there. And you

408
00:20:53.359 --> 00:20:55.240
know again you go, you look at this person, you go, well,

409
00:20:55.279 --> 00:20:56.920
I think that I thought you were like a liberal,

410
00:20:57.000 --> 00:20:59.720
and I thought you were like, these are the issues

411
00:20:59.759 --> 00:21:02.880
and and this is like you know me too, and

412
00:21:02.920 --> 00:21:04.920
all these things, but not when it not when it

413
00:21:04.960 --> 00:21:08.720
comes to self interest, right, But you have to ask

414
00:21:08.759 --> 00:21:10.559
yourself if you were in that situation, what would you

415
00:21:10.599 --> 00:21:14.039
really do? I'm not really sure.

416
00:21:14.079 --> 00:21:16.640
I mean, that's that's the thing I've I've brought up

417
00:21:18.000 --> 00:21:22.880
and other other conversations is like, for example, if we're

418
00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:25.240
talking about someone who's corrupt, right, we we think, we

419
00:21:25.279 --> 00:21:27.599
think we want our politicians and everybody that all of

420
00:21:27.640 --> 00:21:30.319
our heroes are infallible. Someone waves a hundred million dollars

421
00:21:30.359 --> 00:21:32.400
in your face. How infalliable? Fallible you're gonna be? You're

422
00:21:32.400 --> 00:21:34.160
gonna turn it down? Are you really gonna say no?

423
00:21:35.079 --> 00:21:35.279
Are you?

424
00:21:35.480 --> 00:21:36.680
Are you to say no if someone gives you a

425
00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:37.319
hundred million?

426
00:21:38.200 --> 00:21:39.839
But can we bring that back? Can we bring that

427
00:21:39.880 --> 00:21:42.240
back to the Epstein thing for a minute. Yep, And

428
00:21:42.319 --> 00:21:46.839
let's just trade that money, uh formula there for power formula.

429
00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:51.839
You're you're any of these people, your cash Betel, your

430
00:21:51.920 --> 00:21:56.640
Dan Bongino. Right, And you're brought into an admin right,

431
00:21:56.720 --> 00:21:59.119
and you get a look behind the curtain and you

432
00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:02.200
realize that you know you were manipulated to the extent

433
00:22:02.279 --> 00:22:04.079
that you know, Trump knew he was never going to

434
00:22:04.160 --> 00:22:08.039
release these Epstein files. Right, But now you're in a

435
00:22:08.039 --> 00:22:10.880
position of power and you're and you're being given the

436
00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:14.240
ultimate option. Do you give up your power or do

437
00:22:14.279 --> 00:22:17.039
you are you silence in exchange to keep it? Or

438
00:22:17.079 --> 00:22:19.839
do you choose to speak up and then become ostracized

439
00:22:19.880 --> 00:22:23.079
and become the enemy. And you can already see that

440
00:22:23.119 --> 00:22:25.400
Trump is taking the if you're not with me, you're

441
00:22:25.440 --> 00:22:28.960
against me approach by immediately turning anybody that doesn't agree

442
00:22:29.000 --> 00:22:34.720
with him, meaning his supporters, into the enemy to nullify

443
00:22:34.799 --> 00:22:37.519
this story. So it's just one of those things where

444
00:22:37.559 --> 00:22:40.440
you're like, you're you're trapped. Like I mean, imagine those

445
00:22:40.480 --> 00:22:42.400
guys coming in there and thinking that they were going

446
00:22:42.440 --> 00:22:44.720
to shed light on something and now that they're like, oh,

447
00:22:46.400 --> 00:22:50.559
we were stuck. I mean, it's like the ultimate chess move, right, Yeah.

448
00:22:50.799 --> 00:22:53.359
I mean, you're you're as stuck as you want to be.

449
00:22:53.440 --> 00:22:54.279
I mean, if you.

450
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:58.759
This is just really the moral argument, right, the argument

451
00:22:58.799 --> 00:23:01.599
the morality of the situation and the reality. And to me,

452
00:23:01.720 --> 00:23:04.720
it's you're going to have to make that choice. I mean,

453
00:23:04.839 --> 00:23:08.279
you don't want to destroy yourself, but at the same time,

454
00:23:08.400 --> 00:23:10.720
truth has to be told to make sure that we

455
00:23:10.799 --> 00:23:14.160
can you know, decapitate this power structure. And that's where

456
00:23:14.200 --> 00:23:16.920
that's really you know, what it comes down to. I mean, sure,

457
00:23:17.119 --> 00:23:19.680
do you want to be beholding held hostage by by

458
00:23:19.799 --> 00:23:23.960
some you know, greasy asshole who's who's literally just you know,

459
00:23:24.039 --> 00:23:26.799
has no moral compass whatsoever. It's taking advantage of the

460
00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:30.319
people in the system. I mean, I don't think most

461
00:23:30.359 --> 00:23:34.000
people would now. I think where people do not want

462
00:23:34.039 --> 00:23:36.960
to step out and where they don't want to bring down,

463
00:23:37.279 --> 00:23:40.559
you know, the kingdom, so to speak, is when their

464
00:23:40.559 --> 00:23:42.920
family is threatened. I think most people on the personal

465
00:23:43.000 --> 00:23:45.839
level can care less, but they don't want to sacrifice

466
00:23:45.839 --> 00:23:47.759
their family or the loved ones. And if that's just

467
00:23:47.799 --> 00:23:49.920
being held over the heads, and that's where the issue is.

468
00:23:49.960 --> 00:23:52.200
I believe someone like Dan Bongino, I mean, if you

469
00:23:52.200 --> 00:23:55.400
want to talk about that, everyone has their opinion on

470
00:23:55.680 --> 00:23:57.359
this whole thing that's going on with this MAGA movement

471
00:23:57.359 --> 00:24:00.720
and all these individuals and you know, self reclining influencers

472
00:24:00.720 --> 00:24:02.960
and whatnot. But you know, he gave up millions of

473
00:24:03.000 --> 00:24:07.799
dollars as a podcaster and wants to go ahead and

474
00:24:07.799 --> 00:24:10.359
now become you know, part of the FBI deputy director

475
00:24:10.559 --> 00:24:13.880
used to be a secret service agent. Great, he wanted

476
00:24:13.880 --> 00:24:16.039
to uncover things, so did Cash Mattel. The whole reason

477
00:24:16.079 --> 00:24:17.960
these guys, or at least Cash was even you know,

478
00:24:17.960 --> 00:24:21.079
GANI supporters, because he was supposed to expose bring things down.

479
00:24:21.440 --> 00:24:23.920
Then we can also have the conversation as to why

480
00:24:23.960 --> 00:24:26.680
the hell was Pambondi even put into the position she was.

481
00:24:27.960 --> 00:24:30.119
You know, as far as I was concerned, I didn't

482
00:24:30.119 --> 00:24:32.240
really see much of what she did anything in Florida.

483
00:24:32.839 --> 00:24:34.640
Sure she talked tough, but I mean.

484
00:24:35.160 --> 00:24:37.079
But maybe maybe she was put there to make sure

485
00:24:37.119 --> 00:24:39.720
that the files never get released. Maybe that's why those

486
00:24:39.759 --> 00:24:42.599
binders came out. And then they realized that we thought

487
00:24:42.640 --> 00:24:45.359
we could pull a fast one that didn't work, kick

488
00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:47.160
the can that didn't work.

489
00:24:47.200 --> 00:24:49.759
Here we are, yeah, exactly, And that was that was

490
00:24:49.880 --> 00:24:53.039
just that was it was hilarious.

491
00:24:53.039 --> 00:24:54.240
Well, it wasn't beyond hilarious.

492
00:24:54.279 --> 00:24:55.960
That was the stupidest thing I've ever seen here to

493
00:24:56.000 --> 00:24:56.279
give you that.

494
00:24:56.319 --> 00:24:58.640
Would you take a picture with a binder celebrating that

495
00:24:58.680 --> 00:25:01.799
you that you've got pedophile documents? Like even if you were.

496
00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:04.920
It's not even just about that, whereas it's to me,

497
00:25:04.960 --> 00:25:06.599
it's it's it's you're the White House.

498
00:25:07.279 --> 00:25:08.000
You're the White House.

499
00:25:08.000 --> 00:25:09.839
You're supposed to be held to a higher standard, and

500
00:25:09.880 --> 00:25:13.559
you're gonna use influencers and give them this access that

501
00:25:13.599 --> 00:25:16.920
you won't give anybody else. Right, Well, that's say about

502
00:25:16.960 --> 00:25:17.759
your administration.

503
00:25:18.359 --> 00:25:20.880
But that's why Dan Bongino got the job, right, because

504
00:25:20.920 --> 00:25:23.279
the whole idea is that these people, this goes back

505
00:25:23.319 --> 00:25:25.920
to what you were saying about like family and doing

506
00:25:25.960 --> 00:25:28.799
things for the right reason. The problem is these folks

507
00:25:28.880 --> 00:25:33.119
are there for fame and power, and now a guy

508
00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:36.319
like Bongino is in the ultimate situation. And by the way,

509
00:25:36.359 --> 00:25:38.440
I was just kind of laughing more at the influencers

510
00:25:38.440 --> 00:25:42.880
holding the binders celebrating pedophilia. Even though they're anti pedophilia,

511
00:25:43.000 --> 00:25:46.519
they're still holding those binders and celebrating it. Oh yeah,

512
00:25:46.880 --> 00:25:48.920
I get it, I get it. But but but so,

513
00:25:49.319 --> 00:25:52.039
But Bongino isn't like the ultimate like lose lose, win

514
00:25:52.160 --> 00:25:55.119
win scenario because he's got he gets to choose power

515
00:25:55.279 --> 00:25:57.720
or go back to his audience. But neither one of

516
00:25:57.720 --> 00:26:01.839
those are predicated on doing what's right. No, it's all

517
00:26:01.839 --> 00:26:03.000
about self interest, and I.

518
00:26:02.960 --> 00:26:04.680
Don't know him personally, so I mean we can only

519
00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:08.799
assume what he's thinking. But just from how he has

520
00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:11.839
carried himself and what he's done in media, I think

521
00:26:11.880 --> 00:26:14.839
he would have loved to have stayed on his podcast,

522
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:17.359
you know. I think sometimes it's better to be on

523
00:26:17.400 --> 00:26:19.240
the outside. Once you're on the inside, you don't like

524
00:26:19.279 --> 00:26:19.920
what you see.

525
00:26:20.680 --> 00:26:21.079
I can't.

526
00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:22.960
I can't necessarily say I can put any blame on

527
00:26:23.039 --> 00:26:25.680
him because he's not really in charge. He's he's debut director.

528
00:26:25.680 --> 00:26:27.839
I mean, at this point, he's towing the line. He's

529
00:26:27.880 --> 00:26:30.240
trying to be careful what he says in light of

530
00:26:30.279 --> 00:26:32.799
representing the FBI and also being you know, one of

531
00:26:32.839 --> 00:26:35.960
the prime picks by President Trump, right, he had Trump

532
00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:38.799
support himself. So I get where he's coming from. So

533
00:26:38.880 --> 00:26:41.279
I can't fault him. But the problem is is we're

534
00:26:41.279 --> 00:26:44.400
seeing an FBI that is really a repeat of what

535
00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:47.359
everybody else said was wrong about the previous administration's FBI.

536
00:26:48.000 --> 00:26:50.559
What's the damn difference at this point, There's never going

537
00:26:50.599 --> 00:26:52.519
to be a difference. That's that's why they call it

538
00:26:52.519 --> 00:26:56.240
the deep state. Well exactly, so, Litsten, here, here's what happens.

539
00:26:56.240 --> 00:26:58.440
You know, we just we mentioned Stern earlier. Yeah, and

540
00:26:58.480 --> 00:27:01.720
I always used Stern as the analogy. Okay, Stern railed

541
00:27:01.720 --> 00:27:05.960
on iMOS his entire early career, Okay, and then Stern

542
00:27:06.039 --> 00:27:13.880
became Imus. Because it's inevitable no matter what your genre is, Okay,

543
00:27:14.759 --> 00:27:18.079
when you hit success, it's inevitable that you become the

544
00:27:18.160 --> 00:27:22.440
very thing you were railing against. So Bongino will probably

545
00:27:22.720 --> 00:27:24.920
leave at some point because he's better off being on

546
00:27:24.960 --> 00:27:28.519
the outside making money yelling at a boogeyman. And maybe

547
00:27:28.920 --> 00:27:31.400
maybe the boogeyman will become Trump, or maybe he'll find

548
00:27:31.400 --> 00:27:34.559
a new boogeyman. But once you're on the inside, now

549
00:27:34.599 --> 00:27:36.960
you're accountable for the things you were railing against. And

550
00:27:36.960 --> 00:27:39.680
then there's that reality check like, oh, we don't get

551
00:27:39.680 --> 00:27:42.400
to make these decisions, they're made at a higher level. Oh,

552
00:27:42.559 --> 00:27:44.559
we're never going to release any of this stuff because

553
00:27:44.599 --> 00:27:46.920
it's going to ruin all the power structures in the world.

554
00:27:47.240 --> 00:27:51.119
And welcome to the club. But you're indoctrinated now, and

555
00:27:51.160 --> 00:27:52.160
you're like, well, I don't want to be in this

556
00:27:52.200 --> 00:27:52.880
club anymore.

557
00:27:53.160 --> 00:27:55.960
Well, yeah, I'm unfortunately the guy who says let it

558
00:27:56.039 --> 00:27:57.799
all fucking burn. I don't really care I mean I

559
00:27:58.559 --> 00:27:59.839
think the world needs a reset.

560
00:28:00.319 --> 00:28:00.759
Yes.

561
00:28:01.319 --> 00:28:04.720
Now, as as far as you know Bonginos just as

562
00:28:04.759 --> 00:28:07.759
the example, I don't want to get stuck on just him.

563
00:28:07.039 --> 00:28:09.440
But no, but it's a very good example because it's

564
00:28:09.480 --> 00:28:11.279
a guy. It is like why did he get the job?

565
00:28:11.400 --> 00:28:12.680
It absolutely is a good example.

566
00:28:13.119 --> 00:28:16.279
But this really brings brings the old saying home, you know,

567
00:28:16.359 --> 00:28:17.680
like you don't know what you don't know?

568
00:28:18.000 --> 00:28:18.160
Right?

569
00:28:19.400 --> 00:28:23.359
And the thing about power, it does corrupt, Like let's

570
00:28:23.400 --> 00:28:26.119
let's let's take me you it doesn't even matter. You know,

571
00:28:26.160 --> 00:28:28.200
let's say one day we we don't know, what if

572
00:28:28.240 --> 00:28:30.000
we became a Joe Rogan one day? Right, what if

573
00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:33.480
that even happened. Could you imagine the pressures and and

574
00:28:33.480 --> 00:28:36.200
and everything that would be waved in front of you,

575
00:28:36.200 --> 00:28:39.319
you know, to tempt you to try to mold and

576
00:28:39.319 --> 00:28:41.160
shape you. I mean, once you get to a certain level,

577
00:28:41.160 --> 00:28:42.920
you don't want to let go of that. And I

578
00:28:43.000 --> 00:28:43.680
understand that.

579
00:28:44.160 --> 00:28:44.279
Uh.

580
00:28:44.519 --> 00:28:46.759
But you know, as far as Bongina goes, I think

581
00:28:46.759 --> 00:28:51.359
he has enough. I think he has enough strength and

582
00:28:51.519 --> 00:28:54.400
enough of a moral backbone that I don't think he

583
00:28:54.440 --> 00:28:54.799
wants to.

584
00:28:54.720 --> 00:28:55.319
Be where he's at.

585
00:28:55.519 --> 00:28:59.160
I I think that he thought that he was getting

586
00:28:59.160 --> 00:29:01.160
into one situation where he was going to be able

587
00:29:01.160 --> 00:29:04.839
to make a difference, and now he's doing the Oh shit,

588
00:29:05.519 --> 00:29:06.039
what did I do?

589
00:29:06.759 --> 00:29:07.400
What did I do?

590
00:29:08.640 --> 00:29:10.519
Not that I was ever to be honest, you know,

591
00:29:10.559 --> 00:29:12.640
I was never a diehard fan. I respected who he

592
00:29:12.720 --> 00:29:15.480
was and what he did. Didn't agree with everything he said,

593
00:29:15.480 --> 00:29:19.440
but at least he had he stood for something. You know,

594
00:29:19.680 --> 00:29:23.119
he definitely wanted to expose, wanted to make sure that,

595
00:29:23.599 --> 00:29:26.640
you know, whatever was wrong was righted, and that's what

596
00:29:26.680 --> 00:29:29.200
he said. I mean, whether you're like you know, whether

597
00:29:29.200 --> 00:29:32.119
you're into being a Republican Democrat, mag to me, that

598
00:29:32.119 --> 00:29:34.079
doesn't matter. For the most part, a lot of his

599
00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:37.640
messaging was really about trying to right the wrongs. And

600
00:29:37.720 --> 00:29:39.200
now he's on the other side of it, and he's

601
00:29:39.240 --> 00:29:43.640
looking like a jackass. You know, not his fault. He

602
00:29:43.680 --> 00:29:45.000
didn't know what he was walking into.

603
00:29:45.480 --> 00:29:48.119
So well, that's that's exactly what I think it is.

604
00:29:48.279 --> 00:29:51.440
And I think, you know, now he's in a he's

605
00:29:51.519 --> 00:29:54.039
caught in a catch twenty two because he's really damn

606
00:29:54.079 --> 00:29:58.960
no matter what he does, but his choices are power

607
00:29:58.960 --> 00:30:02.559
and money. I mean, he's gonna be fine either way,

608
00:30:02.839 --> 00:30:06.000
right and as long as he doesn't totally bite the hand,

609
00:30:06.039 --> 00:30:08.200
which is why if he does leave and go back

610
00:30:08.240 --> 00:30:11.119
to podcasting, that's going to be a tough nut to crack,

611
00:30:11.240 --> 00:30:13.079
because what are you gonna do. You're gonna start railing

612
00:30:13.079 --> 00:30:17.039
against Trump in the deep state. No, he won't do that.

613
00:30:17.160 --> 00:30:19.720
I mean he's but then what do you do? That's

614
00:30:19.759 --> 00:30:22.720
like there's a larger question there. If you want to

615
00:30:22.759 --> 00:30:24.119
go a little bit wider with this.

616
00:30:24.319 --> 00:30:27.440
Well, we can go wider, but at some point he's

617
00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:29.400
going to have to try to save face, just as

618
00:30:29.440 --> 00:30:30.119
anybody would.

619
00:30:30.680 --> 00:30:32.839
How does he do that? If you're in him right now?

620
00:30:32.839 --> 00:30:33.519
How do you play this?

621
00:30:34.039 --> 00:30:36.319
There's well, the only way to play it is to

622
00:30:36.759 --> 00:30:39.920
kind of go against your own laurels. To be quite honest,

623
00:30:40.680 --> 00:30:44.680
you would have to drum up the story that look,

624
00:30:44.920 --> 00:30:48.720
I got inside, it's so dirty, I can't clean it up.

625
00:30:49.160 --> 00:30:52.400
And you know, no matter what I did, I was

626
00:30:52.519 --> 00:30:55.640
under threat, I was under durest. I couldn't act out,

627
00:30:55.759 --> 00:30:58.200
and here I am. And while you're on the other side,

628
00:30:58.240 --> 00:31:00.680
there's no way that you would be able to say, Look,

629
00:31:00.720 --> 00:31:03.960
everything was Trump's fault. The Trump administration is filthy. He's

630
00:31:03.960 --> 00:31:06.440
not going to say that he is the setting president. Now,

631
00:31:06.480 --> 00:31:08.640
he's not going to lose his connections and his access,

632
00:31:09.119 --> 00:31:11.880
but he can spin it if he wanted to, just

633
00:31:11.920 --> 00:31:14.920
like most everybody could spin this, and anybody who's really

634
00:31:14.960 --> 00:31:17.440
savvy and media can spin this story and come out

635
00:31:17.440 --> 00:31:19.559
the other side not necessarily clean, but maybe you won't

636
00:31:19.559 --> 00:31:23.079
look so bad. And let's just not let's not go

637
00:31:23.079 --> 00:31:25.279
ahead and dismiss the fact that people have short memories.

638
00:31:25.559 --> 00:31:27.279
There's so much has gone on in the world that

639
00:31:27.319 --> 00:31:30.759
people forgot in three days. You know, I have his

640
00:31:30.839 --> 00:31:32.640
conversation with people all the time when we're talking about

641
00:31:33.000 --> 00:31:35.640
presidents and deportations and things like that. I'm like, wow, great,

642
00:31:35.640 --> 00:31:37.440
did you know that Bill Clinton deported twelve million?

643
00:31:37.480 --> 00:31:39.519
Did you know that Obama.

644
00:31:39.079 --> 00:31:41.359
Took seven hundred and fifty billion dollars away from Medicaid

645
00:31:41.400 --> 00:31:45.000
and raise taxes by one trillion? They go, No, this

646
00:31:45.160 --> 00:31:47.359
was your era. You worked in the administration at that time.

647
00:31:47.400 --> 00:31:51.559
You don't remember this, you know. So it's it's it's

648
00:31:51.599 --> 00:31:55.119
the news cycle, right. There's the trick is this and

649
00:31:55.160 --> 00:31:57.200
you you probably know this way better than I. The

650
00:31:57.200 --> 00:31:59.519
trick is to overwhelm the public. You want to keep

651
00:31:59.519 --> 00:32:01.720
the new cycle spinning as fast as you can with

652
00:32:01.920 --> 00:32:06.079
enough flashy headlines that you can drum up to guide

653
00:32:06.200 --> 00:32:09.559
and misdirect people. It doesn't matter what happens. You know,

654
00:32:10.039 --> 00:32:12.200
if you're able to move quick enough in media and

655
00:32:12.440 --> 00:32:15.720
you've moved the new cycle fast enough, people forget. Because

656
00:32:15.799 --> 00:32:19.960
our attention spans today are so short that nobody really

657
00:32:20.119 --> 00:32:22.200
is going to clamp down on it like a bulldog

658
00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:25.519
and not let go of it. They're eventually just going like, well,

659
00:32:25.559 --> 00:32:28.200
hold on, what did Elon Musk just say? You know

660
00:32:28.640 --> 00:32:32.839
what happened? What a putin do? Their attention span is

661
00:32:32.880 --> 00:32:36.400
so short that I know. For fact, politicians and people

662
00:32:36.480 --> 00:32:38.319
that have the power, as you say, and the money,

663
00:32:38.559 --> 00:32:39.079
they know this.

664
00:32:39.359 --> 00:32:41.480
They know this. That's why there's always.

665
00:32:41.160 --> 00:32:43.720
The adage that, oh, they're rich and they're powerful, they're

666
00:32:43.720 --> 00:32:44.920
just going to get away with it because they know

667
00:32:44.960 --> 00:32:47.359
they will. If you could delay it long enough, if

668
00:32:47.400 --> 00:32:50.759
you could belay and delay the investigations, the prosecutions, et cetera,

669
00:32:51.039 --> 00:32:53.000
you're going to get away with it. People lose interests,

670
00:32:53.000 --> 00:32:55.160
and people are going to forget about it. And that's

671
00:32:55.200 --> 00:32:56.960
just a fact. It's just the reality of the world

672
00:32:57.000 --> 00:32:59.759
we live in. So it's unfortunate, but it's true.

673
00:33:00.160 --> 00:33:03.839
It's really true. That's that's the Steve Bannon strategy, flood

674
00:33:03.839 --> 00:33:06.640
the zone with shit. I mean, that is why he

675
00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:09.559
you know, Trump says I'm going to deport Rosie O'Donnell

676
00:33:09.680 --> 00:33:12.799
because he's trying to distract from the Epstein conversation. Yeah,

677
00:33:13.759 --> 00:33:16.240
you know, but you'll see it through now here. Here's

678
00:33:16.279 --> 00:33:17.960
the thing, because you brought up a lot there that

679
00:33:18.119 --> 00:33:20.759
that I and I'm going to try to comment on

680
00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:23.839
all of it at once here. But you know, he's

681
00:33:23.880 --> 00:33:26.200
a show biz guy, for better or worse, and he

682
00:33:26.359 --> 00:33:29.079
fancies himself a show biz guy. So I could see

683
00:33:29.640 --> 00:33:34.079
a Bongino exit being like, listen, I know you're gonna

684
00:33:34.079 --> 00:33:35.799
have to go out there and you're gonna have to

685
00:33:35.839 --> 00:33:38.000
say what you need to say for your audience to

686
00:33:38.119 --> 00:33:40.519
save face. And I know you're gonna have to rail

687
00:33:40.559 --> 00:33:43.640
against me. But like we're good, you know what I mean, Like,

688
00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:46.480
I know that Trump knows that the game is played

689
00:33:46.519 --> 00:33:49.759
that way. I actually think not to derail this, but

690
00:33:49.839 --> 00:33:54.680
I think Trump and newsomer type I think so too. Well,

691
00:33:54.720 --> 00:33:57.240
they're they're pretty much family, you know that, right? Well?

692
00:33:57.480 --> 00:33:59.400
How many how often do you do you always see

693
00:33:59.440 --> 00:34:01.319
them at But you know when you can see footage

694
00:34:01.319 --> 00:34:02.720
of them at partis and whatnot. They're not They're not

695
00:34:02.759 --> 00:34:04.400
sitting there stabbing each other in the back. They're shaking

696
00:34:04.440 --> 00:34:07.200
hands or smiling, they're cracking jokes. They all know each other.

697
00:34:07.240 --> 00:34:11.800
I'm sure there's there's there's definitely animosity between some absolutely,

698
00:34:12.280 --> 00:34:14.920
but they're all part of the same team.

699
00:34:15.320 --> 00:34:18.360
Realistically, they're all part of the same team. They're all politicians.

700
00:34:18.440 --> 00:34:21.599
They're all playing everybody for as you said, power and money,

701
00:34:22.280 --> 00:34:25.960
and it's all about manipulation, you know, it's misdirection, slight

702
00:34:26.000 --> 00:34:28.119
of hand, it's all that's exactly what we're dealing with.

703
00:34:28.920 --> 00:34:29.079
You know.

704
00:34:29.559 --> 00:34:33.960
It's like it's like when we're the discussion came up about, uh,

705
00:34:34.280 --> 00:34:36.119
what Elon Musk wants to do, and I know you

706
00:34:36.199 --> 00:34:38.320
had an opinion on this with this whole third party thing.

707
00:34:39.840 --> 00:34:42.880
Great idea, it's not gonna happen and it's not gonna work.

708
00:34:43.079 --> 00:34:46.199
But we do need more diversity in our choices, we

709
00:34:46.320 --> 00:34:48.639
absolutely do. But there's just too much money and as

710
00:34:48.679 --> 00:34:50.800
you said, power within the two parties that it's never

711
00:34:50.880 --> 00:34:53.199
gonna come to light. It's just not gonna happen. As

712
00:34:53.320 --> 00:34:55.719
rich as Elon Musk is, he's not as rich as

713
00:34:55.800 --> 00:34:59.039
every single donor combined in the two parties. He's not

714
00:34:59.159 --> 00:35:00.880
gonna he's not gonna to break the surface. It's just

715
00:35:00.920 --> 00:35:01.440
not gonna happen.

716
00:35:01.800 --> 00:35:03.719
Well, I don't think a third party is enough to

717
00:35:03.840 --> 00:35:06.119
break the surface anymore. No, it really won't.

718
00:35:06.360 --> 00:35:08.519
They've tried with a tea party they I mean, remember,

719
00:35:08.599 --> 00:35:11.119
Ross Perot was probably the only one back in the

720
00:35:11.199 --> 00:35:13.639
day with enough money to get enough attention. And he

721
00:35:13.800 --> 00:35:16.639
you know, he bumped it. He did, he did well,

722
00:35:17.079 --> 00:35:19.760
but still it just was not enough. And it's not

723
00:35:19.880 --> 00:35:21.840
saying that he was the perfect candidate to be a president,

724
00:35:21.880 --> 00:35:24.239
but it was a good example of what could be done.

725
00:35:24.280 --> 00:35:29.320
But in today's times, with the amount of bombardment of

726
00:35:29.400 --> 00:35:32.199
information and social media that everybody wakes up to and

727
00:35:32.280 --> 00:35:34.960
you just can't get away from it, good luck fighting that.

728
00:35:35.079 --> 00:35:36.679
You're just not going to be able to keep up

729
00:35:36.800 --> 00:35:38.800
with everybody else is going to just becoming at you

730
00:35:38.960 --> 00:35:40.639
from all these other angles. So I don't think the

731
00:35:40.679 --> 00:35:42.320
third party is going to work out. It's a great idea,

732
00:35:42.599 --> 00:35:45.079
does it need to happen? Sure we have the Libertarian Party,

733
00:35:45.159 --> 00:35:46.880
good luck with that too. They can't even decide whether

734
00:35:46.960 --> 00:35:49.039
or not they even want to be a political party.

735
00:35:49.119 --> 00:35:51.719
They have so much infighting because they can't agree on

736
00:35:51.800 --> 00:35:53.079
what they want to do, and they can't even agree

737
00:35:53.079 --> 00:35:54.760
on who's going to lead the damn Libertarian Party.

738
00:35:55.000 --> 00:35:59.559
It's just a shit show. Our choices and the independent

739
00:35:59.599 --> 00:36:03.039
parties come a workaround for anybody that needs to circumvent

740
00:36:03.920 --> 00:36:06.719
the rules. So you know, Andrew Cuomo is going to

741
00:36:06.840 --> 00:36:09.159
use it right now. But either party will use the

742
00:36:09.239 --> 00:36:11.280
independent ticket to play.

743
00:36:11.119 --> 00:36:13.800
People will they will? I think the independent ticket is

744
00:36:14.599 --> 00:36:18.840
is really coming down to the fact that people are

745
00:36:19.039 --> 00:36:21.400
just over it, but they they don't seem to.

746
00:36:21.440 --> 00:36:25.480
Know where to turn. Running Is Cuomo running is? Excuse me,

747
00:36:25.480 --> 00:36:28.840
I'm sorry, Cuomo running is an independent? That that just

748
00:36:28.960 --> 00:36:32.599
further proves how broken the Democrat Party is, absolutely because

749
00:36:32.639 --> 00:36:35.760
here's no room for a real independent if you're basically

750
00:36:35.880 --> 00:36:39.079
trying to flip the script and make and make the

751
00:36:39.159 --> 00:36:42.199
nominee of the Democrat Party the independent candidate, that's what

752
00:36:42.280 --> 00:36:42.880
he's trying to do.

753
00:36:43.400 --> 00:36:47.039
No, completely under I completely understand. I get what he's doing,

754
00:36:47.119 --> 00:36:50.159
and he is sending a clear message. You know, look,

755
00:36:50.199 --> 00:36:52.599
if we want to talk about parties, great, let's let's

756
00:36:52.639 --> 00:36:57.639
talk about parties. They both suck honestly, they both got

757
00:36:57.679 --> 00:37:01.079
their issues. The Democrat Party is probably the most broken

758
00:37:01.119 --> 00:37:03.599
at this point because there isn't a clear leader. There

759
00:37:03.639 --> 00:37:08.559
really is not, sadly, I mean, years ago, a lot

760
00:37:08.599 --> 00:37:12.079
of people, including like me, would we were Democrat, voted Democrat,

761
00:37:12.119 --> 00:37:13.960
you know, but there were a different party back then

762
00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:16.679
in the day. They've morphed into something else that nobody recognizes,

763
00:37:17.480 --> 00:37:22.119
and they do not seem to be able to get

764
00:37:22.159 --> 00:37:25.639
a pulse on what the people are really wanting and

765
00:37:25.880 --> 00:37:29.480
what is actually needed. It's they're too busy putting themselves first.

766
00:37:29.559 --> 00:37:32.679
Now that can also be argued Trump's doing the same

767
00:37:32.760 --> 00:37:38.280
damn thing. Sure, but he won on the message of

768
00:37:38.400 --> 00:37:41.440
putting America first. That's what everybody wanted. We can argue

769
00:37:41.480 --> 00:37:43.280
whether or not, and he's coming through in US promises.

770
00:37:43.679 --> 00:37:46.480
I'm sure we could. But the Democrat Party right now

771
00:37:46.559 --> 00:37:48.920
does not have a leader. Who's next? Who's the rising star?

772
00:37:49.039 --> 00:37:52.719
AOC police not going to happen, Crockett.

773
00:37:52.800 --> 00:37:56.800
No Buddha jet like. Who is going to step up

774
00:37:56.840 --> 00:37:59.920
and actually be the leader of that party? I hope

775
00:38:00.039 --> 00:38:02.840
it's somebody whose name we do not know at the moment.

776
00:38:03.280 --> 00:38:08.440
I agree it would be great to suddenly like if

777
00:38:08.480 --> 00:38:10.280
there was some dark horse that just all of a

778
00:38:10.280 --> 00:38:13.760
sudden popped up and was able to move the needle

779
00:38:13.840 --> 00:38:16.480
and you're like, oh wow, okay, this is what I've

780
00:38:16.480 --> 00:38:16.920
been looking for.

781
00:38:17.159 --> 00:38:17.840
This makes sense.

782
00:38:18.079 --> 00:38:19.960
But it's not even just about that anyone could tell

783
00:38:20.000 --> 00:38:22.199
the story and get the votes. It's really about are

784
00:38:22.239 --> 00:38:25.119
you going to actually do what you say? Or once

785
00:38:25.400 --> 00:38:27.800
you're in there, are you going to let like you said,

786
00:38:27.880 --> 00:38:31.119
the deep state takeover and you just become that damn

787
00:38:31.159 --> 00:38:32.000
puppet on a string.

788
00:38:32.599 --> 00:38:34.239
Well, they're never going to get the chance. That's the

789
00:38:34.320 --> 00:38:37.679
real issue because somebody, because if somebody did rise up,

790
00:38:37.800 --> 00:38:43.440
if this mythical creature rose up, okay, that they would

791
00:38:43.440 --> 00:38:47.079
be squashed by the establishment. That's the problem is that

792
00:38:47.199 --> 00:38:51.679
the Democrat Party is run like a high school click

793
00:38:52.679 --> 00:38:57.159
and everything comes from the DNC and is dictated outward

794
00:38:57.920 --> 00:38:59.360
and until that could be I mean, look at what

795
00:38:59.400 --> 00:39:01.679
happened with Dave. I don't even like the guy, but

796
00:39:01.800 --> 00:39:03.320
look at what happened with David Hogg.

797
00:39:03.840 --> 00:39:06.960
Yeah, he was supposed to be the face of the DNC.

798
00:39:07.679 --> 00:39:12.039
He was supposed to be the the that's very I mean, listen,

799
00:39:12.360 --> 00:39:16.880
I'm sure him, I'm sure him and Dan Bongino could

800
00:39:16.880 --> 00:39:21.039
have a really good conversation over a beer. Oh, I'm

801
00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:24.719
sure about getting too close to the sun. I'm very sure.

802
00:39:25.079 --> 00:39:28.840
You know, I'm gonna Okay, let's do this because I

803
00:39:28.920 --> 00:39:30.840
want to move into different directions. But before we do,

804
00:39:30.960 --> 00:39:35.440
let me ask your opinion on Trump. What's your thoughts?

805
00:39:37.880 --> 00:39:40.800
I think Trump Trump is oddly one of the most

806
00:39:40.960 --> 00:39:44.840
consistent politicians we have ever had. And if you go

807
00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:46.840
back and you look at that interview he did in

808
00:39:46.920 --> 00:39:50.880
his thirties, and I never remember who the woman was

809
00:39:50.960 --> 00:39:53.280
the interviewed him. I always forget her name. I want

810
00:39:53.280 --> 00:39:59.079
to say it was Ronna Barrett. But he he is

811
00:39:59.199 --> 00:40:01.920
somebody that every but he loved because he said really

812
00:40:02.079 --> 00:40:07.719
shocking stuff. And at the same time, people on all

813
00:40:08.000 --> 00:40:12.079
sides were asking him his entire life to consider running

814
00:40:12.119 --> 00:40:15.440
for office. It wasn't until he chose to come down

815
00:40:15.519 --> 00:40:19.519
the escalator and play the playbook that I guess he

816
00:40:19.599 --> 00:40:22.039
inevitably was always going to play a La roy Cone

817
00:40:22.840 --> 00:40:26.440
that he started, you know, pissing people off. But I

818
00:40:26.519 --> 00:40:31.000
think Trump is is not a product of our culture.

819
00:40:32.239 --> 00:40:36.239
I think that like we we just caught up. Like

820
00:40:36.320 --> 00:40:39.039
I think we just caught up. I mean he's consistent.

821
00:40:39.679 --> 00:40:42.239
I don't think we bred him. I think that he's

822
00:40:42.320 --> 00:40:46.599
always been there. He's been in rap songs, he's he's

823
00:40:46.719 --> 00:40:52.199
been in movies. Yeah, he's he's iconic. And it was

824
00:40:52.280 --> 00:40:56.239
only until he got into politics and showed people how

825
00:40:56.360 --> 00:40:59.519
he would actually do things, despite what he said all along,

826
00:41:00.000 --> 00:41:02.119
despite all the wild things he would say on The

827
00:41:02.199 --> 00:41:05.360
Stern Show, And then people are like, well, wait a second,

828
00:41:05.440 --> 00:41:07.000
we don't actually think if this is the way you're

829
00:41:07.039 --> 00:41:08.519
going to lead, that you should be a leader. Like

830
00:41:08.760 --> 00:41:12.880
it's buyer's remorse. It's buyer's remorse.

831
00:41:12.960 --> 00:41:17.119
Ye, good way to put it. Yeah, he's he's he's

832
00:41:17.199 --> 00:41:19.840
not presidential. That's that's the thing about him. He's not

833
00:41:20.039 --> 00:41:24.400
hilarious absolutely. I mean I like that he has no filter,

834
00:41:24.519 --> 00:41:28.599
but at the same time gets him into trouble for sure,

835
00:41:29.480 --> 00:41:31.800
And who the hell talks to world leaders the way

836
00:41:31.840 --> 00:41:32.199
he does?

837
00:41:32.800 --> 00:41:34.880
Right, By the way, hilarious doesn't mean I like him.

838
00:41:35.519 --> 00:41:39.360
I can objectively say somebody's hilarious, right, but people, we can't.

839
00:41:39.400 --> 00:41:41.400
We live in a world where that's that will be

840
00:41:41.559 --> 00:41:45.159
taken as an endorsement. Well, yeah, that's true. You don't

841
00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:46.519
have to like him. It's fine.

842
00:41:46.599 --> 00:41:48.760
I mean, we all don't have to agree on on

843
00:41:48.920 --> 00:41:51.159
candidates and who we back or whatever it is. I mean, look,

844
00:41:51.199 --> 00:41:52.960
there's a lot of people who voted for him that

845
00:41:53.079 --> 00:41:55.760
are now now looking at the fact that you know,

846
00:41:55.800 --> 00:41:57.719
there's a lot of promises that he made that he's

847
00:41:57.760 --> 00:41:59.920
not coming through. A lot of things he did were fine,

848
00:42:00.039 --> 00:42:03.559
a lot of things were great, But there's always the

849
00:42:03.679 --> 00:42:06.079
real argument here has always been we never had a

850
00:42:06.119 --> 00:42:09.119
perfect president. The problem with this guy, you know, even

851
00:42:09.159 --> 00:42:11.440
though he's human like all of them, is he has

852
00:42:11.480 --> 00:42:14.239
no damn filter. He's I mean, who the hell Arizon

853
00:42:14.320 --> 00:42:17.119
Grievance is out on social media? You're the fucking president.

854
00:42:17.559 --> 00:42:20.039
You're the president man a drug addict.

855
00:42:20.159 --> 00:42:23.280
You know what I'm saying. It's like, what are you doing? Yeah?

856
00:42:23.280 --> 00:42:25.400
I know, it's well that's what I'm saying. It's hilarious,

857
00:42:25.440 --> 00:42:27.360
but it's also scary at the same time, right, Like

858
00:42:27.960 --> 00:42:30.320
I can laugh at it, but then also be like

859
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:33.960
this is this is absolutely terrible. We're all gonna die, right,

860
00:42:34.119 --> 00:42:35.760
but how do you not laugh? You know? I mean,

861
00:42:35.800 --> 00:42:38.079
what else was someone I gonna do? Cry? Well? What

862
00:42:38.280 --> 00:42:43.239
is the reaction? The reaction? Look, I think there's a

863
00:42:43.320 --> 00:42:46.360
lot of things that Trump has done that. If the

864
00:42:46.519 --> 00:42:50.760
messenger was different, he would have been applauded. Because he's Trump.

865
00:42:52.400 --> 00:42:56.119
It's it's bad branding, right, you know, maybe it's not

866
00:42:56.320 --> 00:42:59.559
because he won so but at least to the opposition, right,

867
00:42:59.599 --> 00:43:01.599
I mean, there's there's a lot of people that just won't,

868
00:43:01.800 --> 00:43:04.480
that will openly not give this man credit for anything

869
00:43:04.480 --> 00:43:07.079
because they despise him. I don't despise him at that level.

870
00:43:07.280 --> 00:43:10.079
I used to watch The Apprentice at nauseum because I

871
00:43:10.079 --> 00:43:14.400
thought he was hugely entertaining. But I didn't even if

872
00:43:14.440 --> 00:43:17.079
I thought he could have been a good president, this

873
00:43:17.320 --> 00:43:20.280
version of him is not capable of being a good president.

874
00:43:20.559 --> 00:43:24.320
He's got moments where he's effective, right, but he is

875
00:43:24.440 --> 00:43:28.840
surrounded by some really dangerous people. I don't and it cares. No,

876
00:43:28.960 --> 00:43:31.320
he doesn't care because it's all about again self interest. Yeah,

877
00:43:31.360 --> 00:43:34.480
it's self interesting. Honestly, this is last term, Like he

878
00:43:34.599 --> 00:43:37.920
doesn't care. What comes next is what comes next is

879
00:43:38.000 --> 00:43:43.639
far more dangerous and more concerning. Peter feel backed JD.

880
00:43:43.840 --> 00:43:47.159
Vance presidency has the ability to do far more damage

881
00:43:47.199 --> 00:43:50.159
to this country than anything Trump's capable of doing because

882
00:43:50.400 --> 00:43:52.000
his brain can't move fast enough.

883
00:43:54.280 --> 00:43:58.400
The thing with Vance's I can see what you're saying

884
00:43:59.079 --> 00:44:01.840
and why it would be dangerous to the degree that

885
00:44:01.920 --> 00:44:05.039
you're speaking or where you're coming from, because Vance is

886
00:44:05.079 --> 00:44:08.159
a polished person who knows how to present himself and

887
00:44:08.239 --> 00:44:10.360
knows how to speak while he's eloqu when he's educated,

888
00:44:10.880 --> 00:44:14.679
he's everything. And Trump is educated too. But Trump just

889
00:44:14.719 --> 00:44:16.960
doesn't care. You know, He's always been rich and famous,

890
00:44:16.960 --> 00:44:19.280
he's always been powerful, so in his mind, this was

891
00:44:19.400 --> 00:44:20.639
just another notch on his belt.

892
00:44:21.039 --> 00:44:23.599
Honestly, you can tell he said in that interview in

893
00:44:23.679 --> 00:44:27.559
his thirties that he would only because she asked him again,

894
00:44:27.800 --> 00:44:31.599
can I never get her name right? But she asked him,

895
00:44:31.599 --> 00:44:33.199
would you run? And he said, I would only ever

896
00:44:33.280 --> 00:44:35.360
run if I was broke because people would elect me

897
00:44:35.400 --> 00:44:38.239
because they'd feel sorry for him. He is so honest

898
00:44:38.280 --> 00:44:40.519
in this interview in his thirties. Yeah, I mean, it's

899
00:44:40.519 --> 00:44:43.960
a version of him that we don't see. And I

900
00:44:44.079 --> 00:44:46.400
watched this thing from like from end to end with

901
00:44:46.559 --> 00:44:48.239
my jaw on the ground because it was just so

902
00:44:48.400 --> 00:44:52.519
fascinating to hear how open he was. But Trump is

903
00:44:52.559 --> 00:44:57.480
a guy that is just smart enough to get away

904
00:44:57.519 --> 00:45:00.599
with a lot of things, and just smart enough to

905
00:45:00.679 --> 00:45:02.920
keep the house of cards going and a lot of

906
00:45:03.000 --> 00:45:05.519
that he learned from other people. Yeah, do you think

907
00:45:05.559 --> 00:45:10.000
he's done anything good? Oh? Yeah, yeah. I mean even

908
00:45:10.360 --> 00:45:12.880
when he's doing bad, I think he's doing good because

909
00:45:12.960 --> 00:45:16.400
I think that you need the bad to breed the good.

910
00:45:17.000 --> 00:45:19.679
So I think that if Trump is showing the worst

911
00:45:19.880 --> 00:45:24.119
signs the were sides of what this country has to offer,

912
00:45:24.639 --> 00:45:27.440
that maybe it'll breed better leadership and maybe this is

913
00:45:27.639 --> 00:45:30.800
rock bottom and we can actually get somewhere productive. But

914
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:33.320
I don't think the Democrats have anything to offer towards

915
00:45:33.400 --> 00:45:36.960
that solution. No, they don't. We need we need a

916
00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:38.719
guy like you. What we need is a guy like you.

917
00:45:39.320 --> 00:45:41.440
Did you? Who is this girl who she just lost

918
00:45:41.519 --> 00:45:43.679
but she was running with a discord and a TikTok,

919
00:45:44.920 --> 00:45:47.199
you know what I'm talking about. No, I wish I

920
00:45:47.199 --> 00:45:49.400
could remember her name right now. Our last name was Fox.

921
00:45:50.239 --> 00:45:55.440
I really don't recall. Well, the primary was yesterday. The

922
00:45:55.519 --> 00:45:59.000
primary was yesterday, And I apologize for not remembering her

923
00:45:59.079 --> 00:45:59.880
name her first name.

924
00:46:00.039 --> 00:46:02.880
Literally, been doing nothing but interviews and podcasts, so like,

925
00:46:03.039 --> 00:46:06.239
I'm kind of disconnected, even though you know I should

926
00:46:06.320 --> 00:46:08.079
know that, since it's the nature of my what I do.

927
00:46:08.239 --> 00:46:11.719
But yeah, I literally have been disconnected. I've just been

928
00:46:11.800 --> 00:46:15.800
having podcasts after podcasts after guests since and I'm finding

929
00:46:16.000 --> 00:46:18.400
that I'm learning stuff from people I'm talking to in

930
00:46:18.480 --> 00:46:22.159
real time. I'm like, what, I don't know that I should, So, yeah,

931
00:46:22.199 --> 00:46:23.840
I apologize, I don't.

932
00:46:24.280 --> 00:46:26.039
I really only got dialed into her in the last

933
00:46:26.760 --> 00:46:30.159
three days to be fair, right, So, but she she

934
00:46:30.280 --> 00:46:33.599
didn't win, but her campaign she was. She's an influencer,

935
00:46:34.440 --> 00:46:38.840
and she wound up using discord. Interesting, and I think

936
00:46:38.880 --> 00:46:41.760
that's that's really that the next generation. So I think

937
00:46:41.760 --> 00:46:45.480
that when you talk about rebooting and overhauling, it'll be

938
00:46:45.599 --> 00:46:48.440
a whole bunch of people that are doing direct to

939
00:46:48.559 --> 00:46:53.920
consumer politics that doesn't involve money, that just involves online organizing.

940
00:46:54.679 --> 00:46:56.679
I mean, could you just imagine if they got rid

941
00:46:56.719 --> 00:46:59.159
of all of the lobbyists and influence.

942
00:46:59.519 --> 00:47:02.639
You don't have to it, you just circumvent it. Why

943
00:47:02.719 --> 00:47:05.599
do we keep asking people for money? All right? Just

944
00:47:05.679 --> 00:47:09.199
five more dollars, George, just listen, help me out, just

945
00:47:09.320 --> 00:47:11.840
five more dollars. We didn't make our goal, and we're

946
00:47:11.840 --> 00:47:13.199
still not going to make our goal. And I'm going

947
00:47:13.239 --> 00:47:16.440
to ask you again tomorrow, just five more dollars. I'm like,

948
00:47:16.519 --> 00:47:18.599
how much more money do you frigging people need. You're

949
00:47:18.679 --> 00:47:21.320
running on the fact that people are barely getting by,

950
00:47:21.679 --> 00:47:24.400
so stop asking for money. So the way we take

951
00:47:24.480 --> 00:47:27.960
money out of politics is to just not allow money

952
00:47:28.039 --> 00:47:31.920
to rule our politics. Start electing people using social media

953
00:47:32.000 --> 00:47:36.000
it's free. Well yeah, but that's that's not the people's choice. Really,

954
00:47:36.280 --> 00:47:40.280
that's up to the politician to do that. So there's

955
00:47:40.320 --> 00:47:42.480
but she's a disruptor, and she's she's a proof of

956
00:47:42.559 --> 00:47:44.920
what's to come because somebody will do it louder and

957
00:47:45.000 --> 00:47:47.119
harder than her, and maybe it will be her next time.

958
00:47:47.639 --> 00:47:50.320
But when it's that disruptive, they won't be able to

959
00:47:50.559 --> 00:47:50.960
stop it.

960
00:47:51.440 --> 00:47:54.280
Yeah, but it's it's also a big reason, like it's

961
00:47:54.320 --> 00:47:56.360
not new though, right, that's that's a big part of

962
00:47:56.360 --> 00:47:59.400
why Trump got elected. He did take advantage of social media.

963
00:48:00.079 --> 00:48:02.400
You know, he also had the money, but he was

964
00:48:02.400 --> 00:48:04.519
a different extremely popular and social media.

965
00:48:05.079 --> 00:48:07.840
Yeah, but that's but but look, I mean Trump, you

966
00:48:07.920 --> 00:48:10.880
know they say he wasn't a politician. Trump was a politician, right,

967
00:48:10.960 --> 00:48:13.960
He's a businessman. He was. He's a big time donor.

968
00:48:14.639 --> 00:48:16.440
He may have been on the outside, but he was

969
00:48:16.599 --> 00:48:19.880
he was in that world. We're talking about young folks

970
00:48:19.960 --> 00:48:23.880
from the outside that aren't in it for money or

971
00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:26.880
power or book deals that are like, hey, I got

972
00:48:26.960 --> 00:48:29.800
a job, let me just come do you know, pass

973
00:48:29.840 --> 00:48:33.360
some legislation, get some stuff through, help the people, and

974
00:48:33.440 --> 00:48:35.480
go home and go back to work. But that's the

975
00:48:35.480 --> 00:48:36.079
way it should be.

976
00:48:36.360 --> 00:48:38.239
Yeah, But I mean that's the whole I mean, you're

977
00:48:38.239 --> 00:48:41.719
talking about a unicorn man, and honestly, you know, everybody

978
00:48:41.840 --> 00:48:43.679
has that intent. There's okay, not everybody, but a lot

979
00:48:43.719 --> 00:48:45.760
of people do have that intent. Most people who want

980
00:48:45.800 --> 00:48:48.360
to get into politics want to change and help. They're

981
00:48:48.400 --> 00:48:51.119
not necessarily getting into it because they know unless they

982
00:48:51.159 --> 00:48:53.480
come up from a long line, you know, within a

983
00:48:53.519 --> 00:48:55.960
family that was already involved in politics. But most people

984
00:48:56.000 --> 00:48:57.719
from the outside, they don't know what they're getting into.

985
00:48:58.119 --> 00:49:01.719
I think the corruption just it just comes with a job,

986
00:49:01.960 --> 00:49:03.719
and it's almost like you got to pick and choose

987
00:49:03.760 --> 00:49:06.880
your battles and your poisons. I think most people start

988
00:49:07.000 --> 00:49:08.840
wanting to make a change, but once you get in there,

989
00:49:09.000 --> 00:49:12.119
it's I mean, it's it's a cess pullman, you know,

990
00:49:12.239 --> 00:49:14.639
trying to ward all that stuff off, all all the

991
00:49:14.760 --> 00:49:18.159
all the influence, all the all the money, all how

992
00:49:18.199 --> 00:49:20.719
are everything that comes with it. It's hard to stay

993
00:49:20.800 --> 00:49:21.199
the course.

994
00:49:21.760 --> 00:49:23.960
No, I get it, but that doesn't mean it can't

995
00:49:24.000 --> 00:49:26.519
be done. And I mean, you know, if you just

996
00:49:26.519 --> 00:49:29.480
look at innovation as a whole, it's never easy. But

997
00:49:30.199 --> 00:49:31.880
so one of the guys I interviewed when I first

998
00:49:31.880 --> 00:49:34.760
started my podcast was a guy former mayor by the

999
00:49:34.840 --> 00:49:38.360
name of Keith Ramos in New Jersey, small town. He

1000
00:49:38.559 --> 00:49:41.760
got involved in the politics because he got involved with

1001
00:49:41.840 --> 00:49:44.280
politics because he went up to the current mayor at

1002
00:49:44.320 --> 00:49:50.800
the time after a meeting, after a public meeting, and

1003
00:49:51.159 --> 00:49:54.239
ask him some questions about how money was being allocated.

1004
00:49:54.719 --> 00:49:56.280
And the mayor turned to him and goes, you don't

1005
00:49:56.280 --> 00:49:58.119
ask me these kind of questions. I'm the king of

1006
00:49:58.280 --> 00:50:01.800
this town. And he's like, did you really just say

1007
00:50:01.840 --> 00:50:05.760
that to me? And he ran and he beat this

1008
00:50:05.920 --> 00:50:09.199
guy and he was able. And I can't represent what

1009
00:50:09.400 --> 00:50:13.519
he did eloquently enough to even try right now, but

1010
00:50:13.719 --> 00:50:17.480
he made a difference in his town. And I said

1011
00:50:17.519 --> 00:50:20.559
to him, what's next, you know, like, because you would

1012
00:50:20.599 --> 00:50:22.360
think now you move on right, you go a little

1013
00:50:22.360 --> 00:50:24.760
bit higher up the ladder, but it comes back to

1014
00:50:24.920 --> 00:50:26.840
just your point, and it's a lot of work. And

1015
00:50:27.119 --> 00:50:29.320
I don't you know, doesn't know if his family is

1016
00:50:29.400 --> 00:50:31.320
ready for it. And you know, once you dip your

1017
00:50:31.360 --> 00:50:33.760
toe into the bigger pool, you open yourself up to

1018
00:50:33.840 --> 00:50:37.320
all sorts of exposure and it's a big decision. But

1019
00:50:37.519 --> 00:50:40.519
this is a guy I was, a working class guy

1020
00:50:40.599 --> 00:50:44.039
from the outside, didn't like what a politician said to

1021
00:50:44.159 --> 00:50:48.360
his face and took the reins so it could be done. Oh,

1022
00:50:48.440 --> 00:50:48.960
I know. Could.

1023
00:50:49.599 --> 00:50:51.599
I'm not trying to be too negative about it.

1024
00:50:52.519 --> 00:50:54.159
I'm not saying this for your benefit. I know you

1025
00:50:54.280 --> 00:50:56.760
know these things. I'm saying people listening because it's the

1026
00:50:56.800 --> 00:50:58.199
people listening that are going to run.

1027
00:50:58.559 --> 00:51:03.920
It's quite okay to have an opinion, and it's also

1028
00:51:05.039 --> 00:51:09.400
okay to be disenchanted about the whole situation as far

1029
00:51:09.480 --> 00:51:12.239
as I feel, because it's we all want better, we

1030
00:51:12.320 --> 00:51:14.360
all want change. I don't disagree with what you said.

1031
00:51:14.599 --> 00:51:18.960
Absolutely you're correct. If there's a possibility, fine, but there's

1032
00:51:19.000 --> 00:51:20.639
nothing new under the sun. I mean, like you said,

1033
00:51:20.760 --> 00:51:23.360
the lady that was using discord whatever. Look, it's all

1034
00:51:23.400 --> 00:51:26.000
that is is the delivery. It's just the way you're communicating.

1035
00:51:26.079 --> 00:51:29.639
But outside of that, you still have to present yourself

1036
00:51:29.719 --> 00:51:32.519
as someone that the people want. You got to make

1037
00:51:32.559 --> 00:51:34.599
people believe that you really, truly, in fact, do you

1038
00:51:34.639 --> 00:51:35.960
want to make the change, and you're gonna do it

1039
00:51:36.039 --> 00:51:39.400
on behalf of the people. And so now it comes

1040
00:51:39.480 --> 00:51:43.199
down to the reality, who's the better salesperson? Regardless of

1041
00:51:43.199 --> 00:51:45.800
what's in your heart, it's whoever the better sales person is.

1042
00:51:46.159 --> 00:51:50.320
The fact of the matter is politics is really nothing

1043
00:51:50.400 --> 00:51:53.159
more than a high school popularity contest. There are so

1044
00:51:53.280 --> 00:51:57.519
many inept people without qualifications that are voted into positions

1045
00:51:57.639 --> 00:51:58.760
just because oh.

1046
00:51:58.719 --> 00:51:59.280
I know that name.

1047
00:51:59.320 --> 00:52:01.599
They look on their Oh yeah, I've heard that commercial.

1048
00:52:02.039 --> 00:52:03.239
You don't even know anything about the guy.

1049
00:52:03.760 --> 00:52:06.000
But so you're absolutely right. But that brings it right

1050
00:52:06.039 --> 00:52:09.840
back to our earlier conversation about television, because TV turned

1051
00:52:09.840 --> 00:52:12.440
it into a popularity contest. Yes, it did. In the

1052
00:52:12.519 --> 00:52:14.880
era of radio, you would be able to listen to

1053
00:52:14.960 --> 00:52:20.079
the message, not be staring at the messenger, right, But

1054
00:52:20.159 --> 00:52:23.199
there's still influence in radio as well, of course, but

1055
00:52:23.880 --> 00:52:26.679
it was a huge shift to be able to now suddenly,

1056
00:52:27.440 --> 00:52:30.679
you know, optics literally factored in.

1057
00:52:32.239 --> 00:52:33.800
Are you talking about government syops?

1058
00:52:34.960 --> 00:52:36.800
No, I'm just talking about the fact that as soon

1059
00:52:36.840 --> 00:52:38.920
as you have television and with you no I know,

1060
00:52:39.159 --> 00:52:41.440
but as soon as you have television the conversation just

1061
00:52:41.519 --> 00:52:42.440
because oh, look at him.

1062
00:52:42.920 --> 00:52:46.199
No, you're right, It's it's easier to manipulate with when

1063
00:52:46.239 --> 00:52:49.239
you have the visual component. You can always imagine what

1064
00:52:49.400 --> 00:52:51.519
the person is. You know, you could drum up. It's

1065
00:52:51.559 --> 00:52:53.840
like reading a book, right, if you read a book,

1066
00:52:54.320 --> 00:52:56.239
Like movies and books are the same thing, really just

1067
00:52:56.320 --> 00:52:58.519
one's the visual component. But when you read the book,

1068
00:52:58.519 --> 00:53:00.880
you have a whole different idea of character, You have

1069
00:53:00.960 --> 00:53:02.880
an entire different idea of what this world is as

1070
00:53:02.920 --> 00:53:04.719
person lives in. And then when you see the movie,

1071
00:53:04.760 --> 00:53:07.599
that's why you're disappointed. You're like, this is not what

1072
00:53:07.760 --> 00:53:10.159
I read. This isn't what I drumed up in my

1073
00:53:10.320 --> 00:53:12.920
mind that I was getting behind, or what I loved.

1074
00:53:13.519 --> 00:53:19.519
And so that visual component is needed to manipulate people absolutely,

1075
00:53:20.239 --> 00:53:22.039
But with audio you can't. If it was just an

1076
00:53:22.039 --> 00:53:24.440
audio side, it's easy for the candidate to also hide

1077
00:53:24.480 --> 00:53:27.440
behind as well. It's it's harder to make the connection.

1078
00:53:27.960 --> 00:53:30.760
It's some people are sad enough to tell when someone's lying.

1079
00:53:30.840 --> 00:53:32.639
Like you just look at and you're like, this guy's yeah,

1080
00:53:32.760 --> 00:53:35.039
this guy's full of shit, right, you could tell at

1081
00:53:35.079 --> 00:53:37.639
the gate, but you know you're not wrong.

1082
00:53:37.760 --> 00:53:40.320
Yeah, the visual component. It's Look, it's a big part

1083
00:53:40.360 --> 00:53:41.719
of marketing. It's what it is. Everything.

1084
00:53:41.760 --> 00:53:44.000
Everything we're talking about in campaign is just marketing and sales.

1085
00:53:44.199 --> 00:53:46.320
It doesn't matter what your stance is. It's how you

1086
00:53:46.400 --> 00:53:46.880
can sell it.

1087
00:53:47.159 --> 00:53:47.639
It really is.

1088
00:53:48.079 --> 00:53:50.559
If you know how to talk and you're eloquent, that's

1089
00:53:50.639 --> 00:53:52.719
what people are going to eat up. You know, it's

1090
00:53:53.039 --> 00:53:55.960
in the Bomb administration is a big bondministration is a

1091
00:53:56.159 --> 00:53:59.840
big example of that. Everybody thinks he was the best ever.

1092
00:54:00.119 --> 00:54:00.719
No, he wasn't.

1093
00:54:00.800 --> 00:54:03.239
He was an amazing speaker. He knew how to talk,

1094
00:54:03.280 --> 00:54:05.280
he knew how to present, so when he spoke, you

1095
00:54:05.400 --> 00:54:08.320
had to pay attention and everything he said because of

1096
00:54:08.440 --> 00:54:10.960
his timing, his you know, everything that he did and

1097
00:54:11.079 --> 00:54:13.599
how he spoke, people just ate it up. But not

1098
00:54:13.760 --> 00:54:16.639
everything he did was great. And I'm not here to

1099
00:54:16.679 --> 00:54:18.239
bash him. I'm just using him as an example of

1100
00:54:18.360 --> 00:54:24.119
somebody that can be a very polished, presentable person if

1101
00:54:24.199 --> 00:54:27.119
you keep your tone the way you need to keep it,

1102
00:54:27.199 --> 00:54:29.920
if you have a certain tone, if you have enough

1103
00:54:30.039 --> 00:54:32.960
pause that allows people to sit there and think. I mean, look,

1104
00:54:32.960 --> 00:54:34.760
it's an old trick. If I'm talking to you and

1105
00:54:34.800 --> 00:54:36.679
I just paused for three seconds something. I'm just going

1106
00:54:36.719 --> 00:54:38.440
to shake my head. That's an old sales trick. I was,

1107
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:39.719
you know, I had a sales rep firm. I know

1108
00:54:39.760 --> 00:54:42.440
how to do all this crap. And eventually you're just

1109
00:54:42.480 --> 00:54:44.159
going to say the first thing on your mind.

1110
00:54:44.000 --> 00:54:45.320
And you're either going to agree with me or not.

1111
00:54:45.480 --> 00:54:47.119
But more than likely you're going to start agree with

1112
00:54:47.199 --> 00:54:49.760
me because you don't want to have that awkward moment.

1113
00:54:51.320 --> 00:54:54.760
Yeah. No, And the thing with Obama, I mean you're

1114
00:54:54.800 --> 00:54:58.280
talking about that, that's not just Obama. I mean, look,

1115
00:54:58.360 --> 00:55:01.599
Obama's first term, I think he, you know, came out strong.

1116
00:55:01.639 --> 00:55:04.599
I think his second term was all lame duck. Obama

1117
00:55:05.760 --> 00:55:10.119
had great speech writers and he was a strong orator.

1118
00:55:10.800 --> 00:55:12.880
So you know, when that guy can get up there

1119
00:55:12.920 --> 00:55:17.400
and play the teleprompter like he's Hendricks, then yeah, it's

1120
00:55:17.440 --> 00:55:20.519
gonna work. Now people will some people will say Trump

1121
00:55:20.639 --> 00:55:23.159
is not a good messenger, but you could argue he's

1122
00:55:23.199 --> 00:55:29.280
a very effective messenger for all the wrong reasons. So

1123
00:55:29.760 --> 00:55:31.920
it just depends. I mean, part of it has to

1124
00:55:31.960 --> 00:55:33.880
come with the tone of the country, right. I think

1125
00:55:33.960 --> 00:55:36.719
that again we caught up to somebody like Trump or

1126
00:55:36.800 --> 00:55:40.480
enough people did where they're like, Okay, well we identify

1127
00:55:40.599 --> 00:55:42.480
with that as real talk. We'll take it. We don't

1128
00:55:42.519 --> 00:55:45.079
want to be spoken down to. Yeah.

1129
00:55:45.119 --> 00:55:47.360
I think I think what it was is, I think

1130
00:55:47.360 --> 00:55:49.400
a lot of people felt he was saying what they

1131
00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:52.519
always wanted to say themselves, and he always has yeah,

1132
00:55:52.679 --> 00:55:55.679
And they saw someone who wasn't ones that mincing words,

1133
00:55:55.760 --> 00:55:59.079
wasn't holding back, like oh shit, now that's my guy.

1134
00:55:59.440 --> 00:56:01.800
And that was the appeal. I really was the appeal.

1135
00:56:02.800 --> 00:56:05.320
And yes he is a politician, but look, we're not

1136
00:56:05.400 --> 00:56:08.519
going to fix this, Royce, We're not. I like having

1137
00:56:08.519 --> 00:56:12.079
this conversations. I like having you know, I like having

1138
00:56:12.199 --> 00:56:15.280
other people's perspective and what they think of the situation.

1139
00:56:16.320 --> 00:56:17.360
I don't I don't know where we're going with this.

1140
00:56:17.440 --> 00:56:21.159
I don't know what's next. I mean, honestly, I wish

1141
00:56:21.239 --> 00:56:26.679
a president who was elected can just throw away the

1142
00:56:26.760 --> 00:56:30.559
party politics. I'm tired of everything being so politicized. I

1143
00:56:30.639 --> 00:56:32.639
want the president to actually look out for America and

1144
00:56:32.679 --> 00:56:35.280
look out for the people. It doesn't matter whether or

1145
00:56:35.280 --> 00:56:37.599
not the Republican Party is getting points to the Democratic

1146
00:56:37.639 --> 00:56:39.159
parties get point. I think at that point, when you

1147
00:56:39.159 --> 00:56:42.440
become president, you should be neutral. You should be centered, right,

1148
00:56:42.719 --> 00:56:44.239
That's what you should be because you've got to work

1149
00:56:44.280 --> 00:56:48.480
with both sides to get anything done. I don't know

1150
00:56:48.599 --> 00:56:50.239
when that's going to change, but man, we need that

1151
00:56:50.360 --> 00:56:50.920
so badly.

1152
00:56:51.559 --> 00:56:53.480
Really, I agree. I don't know how we get back

1153
00:56:53.519 --> 00:56:56.000
to it. And again, maybe maybe this is rock bottom

1154
00:56:56.280 --> 00:56:58.559
and there's nowhere to go but up. If it's not

1155
00:56:58.800 --> 00:57:03.599
rock bottom, then we have unfortunately a long way to go. Agreed.

1156
00:57:04.239 --> 00:57:06.400
So let's talk about media, because you kind of alluded

1157
00:57:06.400 --> 00:57:09.360
to that earlier when you're talking about podcasters and basically

1158
00:57:10.199 --> 00:57:13.400
everybody having this this circle of friends, right, I see

1159
00:57:13.400 --> 00:57:16.880
the same guys all over the place. They're all stroking

1160
00:57:16.920 --> 00:57:18.960
each other's egos and patting each other on the back.

1161
00:57:19.039 --> 00:57:21.400
And you know, I could drop names because like you

1162
00:57:21.519 --> 00:57:24.159
got like the Dave Smith with the Tucker Carlson's and

1163
00:57:24.199 --> 00:57:28.039
the Rogans, and then you know, now you have Daryl Cooper,

1164
00:57:28.119 --> 00:57:31.239
the martyr made guy. It's like, no matter what happens

1165
00:57:31.440 --> 00:57:33.519
with Peers Morgan, no matter what anybody says, it seems

1166
00:57:33.559 --> 00:57:36.199
like this whole team just jumps to their aid and goes, yeah,

1167
00:57:36.280 --> 00:57:37.760
you're the you're the man. And you also got Dave

1168
00:57:37.800 --> 00:57:39.719
Smith thinking he wins every damn argument, there is a

1169
00:57:39.800 --> 00:57:42.400
debate regards of what he says or what his takes are.

1170
00:57:43.800 --> 00:57:48.159
So I you know, the the problem I see with

1171
00:57:48.239 --> 00:57:50.960
that is, you know, it's a blatant to me, and

1172
00:57:51.000 --> 00:57:53.800
I don't know if everybody does intentional. But for example,

1173
00:57:53.880 --> 00:57:55.840
let's let's just talk about you don't have to, but

1174
00:57:55.920 --> 00:57:58.280
I will. Let's just talk about like Daryl Cooper, for example.

1175
00:57:58.679 --> 00:58:01.679
I think he's an intelligent guy. He denies he's an historian,

1176
00:58:01.719 --> 00:58:03.480
but then he says he is one. If someone calls

1177
00:58:03.559 --> 00:58:04.840
him a historian, all of a sudden he has one.

1178
00:58:05.159 --> 00:58:06.519
If he gets called on his shit, then all a

1179
00:58:06.519 --> 00:58:10.519
sudden he's not. He makes comments right, all of a sudden.

1180
00:58:10.599 --> 00:58:14.079
Hitler wasn't such a bad guy, you know, he was Okay,

1181
00:58:14.239 --> 00:58:17.519
he was just misunderstood. I don't understand what it is

1182
00:58:17.599 --> 00:58:21.000
about this revisionist history bullshit that we're going through right now.

1183
00:58:22.280 --> 00:58:24.280
And the reality is we could all look back one

1184
00:58:24.360 --> 00:58:28.119
hundred years, fifty years even and always say, you know,

1185
00:58:28.400 --> 00:58:29.599
we should have done it this way.

1186
00:58:30.079 --> 00:58:30.599
They were wrong.

1187
00:58:30.679 --> 00:58:32.719
There's a big difference of living through the time period

1188
00:58:32.840 --> 00:58:36.280
versus scrutinizing what has been done before you were born.

1189
00:58:36.440 --> 00:58:39.599
So what are your thoughts on this? To me, it

1190
00:58:39.719 --> 00:58:42.119
just seems like this big circle of friends are just

1191
00:58:42.199 --> 00:58:45.159
patting each other on the bat. They're pushing each other's narratives,

1192
00:58:45.599 --> 00:58:49.679
and it's like they're ganging up to keep control of media.

1193
00:58:49.679 --> 00:58:53.039
Because podcasting is media. Podcasting is a big business, and

1194
00:58:53.199 --> 00:58:55.679
as many people who want to think that it isn't.

1195
00:58:56.199 --> 00:58:58.039
I hate to break it to you, but it's an industry.

1196
00:58:58.800 --> 00:59:02.280
What's your thoughts on what happening lately with this movement

1197
00:59:02.559 --> 00:59:05.119
with these podcasters who just seem to be doing nothing

1198
00:59:05.199 --> 00:59:08.280
but making sure that they're the first and only voice heard,

1199
00:59:08.920 --> 00:59:13.079
and anybody who has an objection is suddenly a deranged

1200
00:59:13.159 --> 00:59:14.960
idiot that doesn't have their facts straight.

1201
00:59:15.800 --> 00:59:17.840
Well, the first thing I think of is like an

1202
00:59:17.880 --> 00:59:21.239
Ian Carroll, Okay, yeah, because when you talk about the

1203
00:59:21.320 --> 00:59:25.159
Holocaust and Hitler and all of these I shouldn't say all,

1204
00:59:25.480 --> 00:59:30.920
but a lot of these folks they they practice a

1205
00:59:32.960 --> 00:59:39.639
how can I say this, They practice a faux intellectual curiosity. Okay,

1206
00:59:40.119 --> 00:59:43.840
So it becomes okay to ask questions in their mind,

1207
00:59:44.800 --> 00:59:48.599
all right, and in the in the guise of well,

1208
00:59:48.639 --> 00:59:51.000
we don't know this and we don't know that, and

1209
00:59:51.119 --> 00:59:56.079
it becomes this fake intellectual curiosity, but it's very, very dangerous,

1210
00:59:56.960 --> 00:59:58.840
and they love to do that when it comes to

1211
00:59:58.920 --> 01:00:05.400
the Holocaust and anti Semitism. Okay, I think from the

1212
01:00:06.159 --> 01:00:11.719
independent content creator journalist perspective, I don't think there's much

1213
01:00:11.760 --> 01:00:15.079
of a thing as an independent content creator. If you

1214
01:00:15.239 --> 01:00:17.920
go look at most of these folks, the big ones,

1215
01:00:19.280 --> 01:00:22.840
not all a lot of them. They trace back to

1216
01:00:23.039 --> 01:00:28.519
night coo okay, they trace back to Chernin, Peter Chernan's

1217
01:00:28.599 --> 01:00:34.079
Churning Group, which is backed by Katari money, the Qia Okay,

1218
01:00:34.519 --> 01:00:38.000
Chernin has investment. The Churning Group has investments in Spotify,

1219
01:00:38.320 --> 01:00:41.960
which obviously has a deal with Brogan. They're invested in Nightco,

1220
01:00:42.440 --> 01:00:47.480
which manages Chi Senate and Hassan I believe, and the

1221
01:00:47.880 --> 01:00:51.559
Costco guys. So when you see all these independent creators,

1222
01:00:51.559 --> 01:00:55.519
whether we're talking politics or we're just talking creators, they're

1223
01:00:55.639 --> 01:00:59.480
generally being funded and managed by only a handful of people.

1224
01:00:59.840 --> 01:01:02.960
They have the illusion of independent. Go down that rabbit

1225
01:01:03.039 --> 01:01:05.159
hole of Nightco. I think it was his name, Red Rusher,

1226
01:01:05.639 --> 01:01:08.719
Go down that rabbit hole of Nightco and Churning Group,

1227
01:01:08.800 --> 01:01:11.800
and you see how much of that money is all

1228
01:01:12.320 --> 01:01:15.280
that those independent companies funnel back to that money.

1229
01:01:16.559 --> 01:01:19.599
I think you think it's just being controlled by just

1230
01:01:19.679 --> 01:01:22.840
a small handful of people, like, here's the personality we

1231
01:01:22.920 --> 01:01:25.559
can get behind this guy, and now once they got

1232
01:01:25.639 --> 01:01:27.679
him to a certain level, they're just controlling the narrative.

1233
01:01:28.199 --> 01:01:30.199
No, I don't think it's that thought out. I think

1234
01:01:30.239 --> 01:01:32.800
it's more like, no, I really don't. I think it's

1235
01:01:32.840 --> 01:01:35.480
more like, this is business and we don't really give

1236
01:01:35.519 --> 01:01:37.800
a ship what people are saying on either side as

1237
01:01:37.840 --> 01:01:42.000
long as they're keeping things murky and people arguing, right, okay,

1238
01:01:42.280 --> 01:01:46.239
because at the top, none of this exists. They're all

1239
01:01:46.480 --> 01:01:49.239
all these politicians on both sides of the aisle are

1240
01:01:49.360 --> 01:01:52.760
doing blow and shots on K Street together. Okay, to

1241
01:01:52.840 --> 01:01:56.880
go back to Gavin Newsom, Gavin Newsom's ex wife was

1242
01:01:57.000 --> 01:02:01.920
dating Donald Junior Trump Junior. Yeah, okay, it's all everybody's.

1243
01:02:02.199 --> 01:02:06.199
Everybody's hanging out. Okay. So at a certain level, they're

1244
01:02:06.239 --> 01:02:09.400
all they're all in there in their one percent club,

1245
01:02:10.159 --> 01:02:13.239
all right, and we're stuck playing this this game of

1246
01:02:13.360 --> 01:02:17.360
party politics or identity politics, or whatever you want to

1247
01:02:17.400 --> 01:02:19.599
call it. And I and I just think that we

1248
01:02:20.280 --> 01:02:23.880
were blinded by that because at the end of the day. Uh,

1249
01:02:24.760 --> 01:02:27.800
it's it's are there people out there trying to do

1250
01:02:27.840 --> 01:02:33.320
an independent thing? Yes, I don't think that the controlled

1251
01:02:33.400 --> 01:02:38.000
independent media is necessarily being handed a narrative. But I

1252
01:02:38.159 --> 01:02:41.559
think when the people at the top are making money

1253
01:02:42.199 --> 01:02:44.440
off of whatever they're saying, they don't give a shit

1254
01:02:44.519 --> 01:02:47.400
what they're saying because ultimately they get the final word

1255
01:02:47.440 --> 01:02:49.480
because they control the purse strings. Yeah.

1256
01:02:50.039 --> 01:02:55.000
But these guys are also extremely disingenuous. Oh yeah, because

1257
01:02:55.760 --> 01:03:00.159
Sean Ryan, for example, I remember watching one of his

1258
01:03:00.760 --> 01:03:05.000
appearances on Talker for example, the whole time, I'm not

1259
01:03:05.159 --> 01:03:06.599
in it for the money. I hate the money. I'll

1260
01:03:06.599 --> 01:03:08.360
never do it at the And on the other hand, oh,

1261
01:03:08.400 --> 01:03:10.480
I'm building this multimillion dollar studio.

1262
01:03:11.559 --> 01:03:12.199
Well, which is it.

1263
01:03:13.079 --> 01:03:14.199
You want to do it or you don't want to

1264
01:03:14.239 --> 01:03:15.679
do You're in it for the money or not. If

1265
01:03:15.880 --> 01:03:18.159
you didn't care, why are you putting so much investment

1266
01:03:18.239 --> 01:03:21.719
of your time and money into this thing? Like it

1267
01:03:21.800 --> 01:03:22.719
doesn't make any sense.

1268
01:03:23.480 --> 01:03:25.719
Yeah, there's a lot of people like that come to

1269
01:03:25.840 --> 01:03:28.079
mind that you're just in this for money, you know,

1270
01:03:28.440 --> 01:03:30.559
because if you all got together and actually wanted to

1271
01:03:30.800 --> 01:03:33.719
affect something, you could, but you don't want to erode

1272
01:03:33.760 --> 01:03:36.039
your revenue. I mean, there are some people out there.

1273
01:03:36.039 --> 01:03:38.039
I like that. There's some that I can think of,

1274
01:03:38.159 --> 01:03:39.360
and I really I don't want to get in the

1275
01:03:39.400 --> 01:03:43.920
pointing fingers because some of these people I kind of

1276
01:03:44.000 --> 01:03:46.760
have dealt with in the past, so I don't feel

1277
01:03:46.800 --> 01:03:51.519
like blowing that up yet yet. But there's some organizations

1278
01:03:51.559 --> 01:03:58.320
out there that went from anti Trump to fundraising off

1279
01:03:58.400 --> 01:04:01.800
of that too. Now we're a media company and we're

1280
01:04:01.840 --> 01:04:04.639
no longer a pack and you're like, oh, so this

1281
01:04:04.800 --> 01:04:08.920
whole thing was just a scheme to launch a media enterprise,

1282
01:04:09.159 --> 01:04:12.880
and now all you did was fundraise to build prop

1283
01:04:13.000 --> 01:04:16.880
up your quote unquote independent media outlet, you know, and

1284
01:04:16.960 --> 01:04:20.760
now you're out there continuing that grift. Yeah, well the

1285
01:04:20.840 --> 01:04:24.440
grift is real. Listen, I've been accused of grifting. I'm

1286
01:04:24.440 --> 01:04:26.760
a live streamer from TikTok. That's all I've been accused

1287
01:04:26.800 --> 01:04:27.360
of is grifting.

1288
01:04:27.519 --> 01:04:29.880
It's okay, it's it's and it's not for me to

1289
01:04:29.960 --> 01:04:33.840
get you to talk badly about anyone in particular. But

1290
01:04:34.159 --> 01:04:36.199
you know, I don't have a problem calling out people.

1291
01:04:36.360 --> 01:04:36.920
I never have.

1292
01:04:37.079 --> 01:04:41.719
I can care less because the reality is somebody has

1293
01:04:41.760 --> 01:04:44.079
to and there's people out there they say stuff about

1294
01:04:44.119 --> 01:04:46.719
me too, like who cares? You know, at some point

1295
01:04:46.840 --> 01:04:49.440
you've got to be able to stand for truth if

1296
01:04:49.480 --> 01:04:51.639
you can, or the truth we know anyway, because again,

1297
01:04:52.039 --> 01:04:53.800
you know, it's like like I said, everything that we

1298
01:04:53.920 --> 01:04:56.039
know in our assessments, in our opinions are only as

1299
01:04:56.079 --> 01:04:58.480
good as the information we get period. You know, And

1300
01:04:58.599 --> 01:05:00.920
I've always said, we're you know, right today, wrong tomorrow

1301
01:05:01.440 --> 01:05:02.159
always happens.

1302
01:05:02.519 --> 01:05:05.400
You're never going to be in Yeah, you're never going

1303
01:05:05.440 --> 01:05:06.440
to be information. Yeah.

1304
01:05:06.840 --> 01:05:09.639
So but when I when I when I see what

1305
01:05:09.840 --> 01:05:12.199
you just mentioned, the Grift for example, when I see

1306
01:05:12.239 --> 01:05:14.679
someone like and I'll just keep drumming it because I

1307
01:05:14.719 --> 01:05:16.559
can care less about what this guy thinks. But let's

1308
01:05:16.599 --> 01:05:18.039
say like a Dave Smith. And it's not because I

1309
01:05:18.039 --> 01:05:21.039
hate him, I don't. I actually I respected his intelligence.

1310
01:05:21.079 --> 01:05:22.480
I thought he was great when he first came out,

1311
01:05:22.840 --> 01:05:26.840
But now you can clearly see it's like he's just

1312
01:05:27.000 --> 01:05:28.639
kind of just going with what works.

1313
01:05:29.519 --> 01:05:29.679
You know.

1314
01:05:30.360 --> 01:05:33.760
It's it's always the same argument, the same thing. We

1315
01:05:33.840 --> 01:05:35.440
don't have to stay on him. I just use him

1316
01:05:35.440 --> 01:05:37.159
as an example. No, but but and I don't really

1317
01:05:37.199 --> 01:05:38.000
know much about him.

1318
01:05:38.000 --> 01:05:39.360
I know the name. But let me ask you this. No,

1319
01:05:39.440 --> 01:05:41.079
I'm just using him as an example. Yeah, but let

1320
01:05:41.119 --> 01:05:43.960
me ask you from the from the perspective of grifting. Yeah,

1321
01:05:44.280 --> 01:05:47.719
isn't it really all about perceived value? And I can

1322
01:05:47.840 --> 01:05:50.079
argue both sides of this, But isn't it really about

1323
01:05:51.000 --> 01:05:53.440
like how how many people pay for Netflix and do

1324
01:05:53.599 --> 01:05:56.320
nothing but scroll the menu and never why you look

1325
01:05:56.320 --> 01:05:58.440
at forty things like I think I'll watch nothing, I'll

1326
01:05:58.480 --> 01:06:02.719
just go to bed. So is that a grift? I mean,

1327
01:06:02.800 --> 01:06:04.159
if you pay it and never use it, is it

1328
01:06:04.199 --> 01:06:08.760
a grift? So I think that if people are grabbing

1329
01:06:09.480 --> 01:06:14.719
their information from a Joe Walsh okay, and he's becoming

1330
01:06:14.800 --> 01:06:18.800
their news source, then is it so wrong that they

1331
01:06:18.960 --> 01:06:22.719
choose to subscribe to him and help bankroll him. I

1332
01:06:22.840 --> 01:06:25.239
think the problem I have is that there's such an

1333
01:06:25.280 --> 01:06:31.159
oversaturation of this stuff that people just get further siloed. Well, So.

1334
01:06:32.679 --> 01:06:37.360
I say, what a grift is my opinion and the

1335
01:06:37.400 --> 01:06:40.400
way I see it and understand it is when someone

1336
01:06:40.519 --> 01:06:44.679
is literally disingenuous. Okay, there's someone who doesn't necessarily believe

1337
01:06:44.719 --> 01:06:47.840
in all the bullshit that they're spewing, but they said something,

1338
01:06:48.480 --> 01:06:52.199
they presented something that got them the attention. Now they

1339
01:06:52.280 --> 01:06:55.280
know what works, and now they just keep spitting out

1340
01:06:55.320 --> 01:06:57.800
and spewing the same old crap over and over because

1341
01:06:57.800 --> 01:06:59.719
they know that that formula is going to get them

1342
01:07:00.159 --> 01:07:04.559
the eyeballs. Those are grifters in the in the most

1343
01:07:04.599 --> 01:07:07.760
literal sense. Yes, so that that's my take on it.

1344
01:07:08.199 --> 01:07:11.400
I don't care that someone iurological guy. I mean the

1345
01:07:11.719 --> 01:07:15.039
Internet trolls, they consider what we're doing right now grift.

1346
01:07:15.119 --> 01:07:17.440
Oh yeah, I get what you're saying. Yeah, I understand,

1347
01:07:18.079 --> 01:07:19.920
but I don't. I don't have I don't.

1348
01:07:20.000 --> 01:07:21.840
I don't care that someone makes money. I mean, why

1349
01:07:21.880 --> 01:07:25.039
should you not be able to earn a living doing

1350
01:07:25.119 --> 01:07:28.320
what you like. I'm not against that whatsoever. I was

1351
01:07:28.679 --> 01:07:30.960
what I meant by a grift is exactly what I said,

1352
01:07:31.159 --> 01:07:34.079
or just just now in how I defined it is.

1353
01:07:34.280 --> 01:07:37.880
It's like, look, dude, you know you don't really believe

1354
01:07:37.920 --> 01:07:40.920
in what you're saying because just three years ago, just

1355
01:07:41.000 --> 01:07:42.719
three years ago, and I don't even say names were

1356
01:07:42.760 --> 01:07:47.840
just hypothetically you said Trump was was an asshole. Now

1357
01:07:47.880 --> 01:07:51.199
you're licking his boots. That's a grifter, because now licking

1358
01:07:51.239 --> 01:07:54.440
Trump's boots is what gets him paid. Okay, I get

1359
01:07:54.480 --> 01:07:56.639
you gotta pay bills, but the reasons you're doing it,

1360
01:07:57.440 --> 01:07:59.719
I'm sorry. You are being disingenuous. You are grifting, and

1361
01:07:59.800 --> 01:08:01.840
that's what a grifter is, and so that's what I'm

1362
01:08:01.880 --> 01:08:02.440
talking about.

1363
01:08:02.599 --> 01:08:07.800
I'm not talking you consider JD. Vance a grifter? You

1364
01:08:07.920 --> 01:08:10.000
know what. I think he is. Definitely.

1365
01:08:11.280 --> 01:08:14.280
I definitely think he's biden his time. I think he

1366
01:08:14.639 --> 01:08:17.159
is probably to be honest, if I had to say, yeah,

1367
01:08:17.159 --> 01:08:18.600
I think he is kind of a grifter. He is

1368
01:08:18.720 --> 01:08:22.119
someone who jumped on the ticket. I think he's using

1369
01:08:22.199 --> 01:08:24.479
Trump to get where he needs to go. But I

1370
01:08:24.520 --> 01:08:27.279
don't know if he believes in everything that Trump does whatsoever.

1371
01:08:27.840 --> 01:08:30.880
I really don't think I think Vance is the cleanup guy.

1372
01:08:31.720 --> 01:08:33.760
Because you were like describing all that, and I'm like,

1373
01:08:33.840 --> 01:08:38.279
you are painting the picture of JD. Vance. That's that's

1374
01:08:38.319 --> 01:08:40.640
what That's what I see. That's just what I see.

1375
01:08:40.960 --> 01:08:43.920
I I agree with you. He's intelligent. He is. He is,

1376
01:08:44.039 --> 01:08:46.760
He's very intelligent. But I don't believe he's bought in.

1377
01:08:47.039 --> 01:08:51.359
I just don't. I I think that it's the same

1378
01:08:51.399 --> 01:08:55.800
thing with Marco Rubio. You know, I can see that definitely,

1379
01:08:55.960 --> 01:08:59.399
these guys are in it for their career advancement. Unlike

1380
01:08:59.439 --> 01:09:02.399
a guy like Pete Hegseth, who is in it? Because

1381
01:09:02.640 --> 01:09:04.880
how do I turn down this opportunity? Of course I'm

1382
01:09:04.880 --> 01:09:06.319
gonna take it. And then he gets it, he goes,

1383
01:09:06.479 --> 01:09:09.239
this is a lot of work. I think I'll have

1384
01:09:09.319 --> 01:09:14.199
a drink, right, you know, did you see the video

1385
01:09:14.319 --> 01:09:19.279
of him with the drone delivering up the document? Like

1386
01:09:19.399 --> 01:09:23.239
what are we doing? It's fun even your videos, like

1387
01:09:23.319 --> 01:09:25.760
you said, you have to laugh, yeah, but like it what?

1388
01:09:26.079 --> 01:09:29.840
First of all, there's nothing impressive about a drone carrying

1389
01:09:30.399 --> 01:09:34.840
a payload of one sheet of paper. No, like like

1390
01:09:35.079 --> 01:09:37.920
what it should have been is a document like like

1391
01:09:38.199 --> 01:09:42.520
like like gorilla taped to a concrete block. Okay, and

1392
01:09:42.640 --> 01:09:45.800
the drone flies in a concrete block and he takes

1393
01:09:45.840 --> 01:09:48.920
the paper off the block. But there's nothing impressive about

1394
01:09:48.920 --> 01:09:51.319
a drone flying in a piece of paper. That doesn't

1395
01:09:51.359 --> 01:09:55.880
say masculinity. That's his small penis. That's like that makes

1396
01:09:55.920 --> 01:09:58.520
me think of Andrew Tait. When I think of small penis,

1397
01:09:58.560 --> 01:10:01.159
I think of Andrew Tate. Get me started on that guy.

1398
01:10:01.640 --> 01:10:04.479
I'm trying to because you can't stand him. Listen. I

1399
01:10:04.520 --> 01:10:06.359
wish you remember pay per view in the nineties. I

1400
01:10:06.600 --> 01:10:08.079
would love to get in the ring with that guy.

1401
01:10:08.359 --> 01:10:10.239
I don't care if I lose. I just want to

1402
01:10:10.319 --> 01:10:10.920
punch him in the.

1403
01:10:10.960 --> 01:10:15.279
Face, right, you know he brought him up. Let's talk

1404
01:10:15.279 --> 01:10:17.920
about Tate like. I'm gonna let you start it because

1405
01:10:17.920 --> 01:10:19.079
you obviously have a lot to say.

1406
01:10:20.399 --> 01:10:22.319
I just think he's got a small penis and I look,

1407
01:10:22.399 --> 01:10:24.119
the only reason I can say this is because he's

1408
01:10:24.319 --> 01:10:26.520
he's jumping around in that little bikini all the time.

1409
01:10:26.680 --> 01:10:29.359
I'm not asking to see these photos, he's putting them

1410
01:10:29.359 --> 01:10:31.600
out there. I'm like you, there's nothing about you that

1411
01:10:31.680 --> 01:10:35.760
says man. You are like an AI generated version of masculinity.

1412
01:10:37.520 --> 01:10:38.279
I can agree with that.

1413
01:10:38.720 --> 01:10:40.520
I think I think the guy is just a h

1414
01:10:40.760 --> 01:10:43.800
He's just a scammer. Literally, well, he's a grifter. I mean,

1415
01:10:43.880 --> 01:10:46.439
come on, is his his online university?

1416
01:10:47.199 --> 01:10:50.840
Have you ever looked at that crap? Only to the

1417
01:10:50.920 --> 01:10:52.520
extent that I know would exists? But no, I haven't

1418
01:10:52.560 --> 01:10:54.399
like signed up if that's what you're asking. Oh no, no,

1419
01:10:54.680 --> 01:10:57.880
I wasn't asking. I'm not sure where you go. No,

1420
01:10:58.079 --> 01:11:01.560
but look, have these stupid courses on how you can

1421
01:11:01.600 --> 01:11:04.439
make money? I got a webcam, girls and all that shit.

1422
01:11:04.560 --> 01:11:07.199
The paper route you're doing it wrong, you know, shit

1423
01:11:07.319 --> 01:11:07.439
like that.

1424
01:11:07.840 --> 01:11:10.239
I know I'm being facetious, but just saying it's like,

1425
01:11:10.319 --> 01:11:13.800
it's that bad and people buy into this crap and

1426
01:11:14.119 --> 01:11:14.960
they said, I.

1427
01:11:14.960 --> 01:11:17.680
Would have you wouldn't do the web girl the webcam business.

1428
01:11:17.720 --> 01:11:19.479
You got like eight girls to do webcams, and you

1429
01:11:19.520 --> 01:11:22.479
sit around and driving a nice car and sitting in

1430
01:11:22.520 --> 01:11:25.760
a bikini drinking whatever he's drinking. I got life.

1431
01:11:26.399 --> 01:11:29.279
Well, yeah, it's imagine being then insecure that that's what

1432
01:11:29.399 --> 01:11:32.119
you have to do. It's it's the problem is that

1433
01:11:32.239 --> 01:11:34.520
he is presenting that as the life that a man

1434
01:11:34.680 --> 01:11:39.279
should have. I mean, that's your thing, great, that's you whatever.

1435
01:11:39.600 --> 01:11:42.279
No, I know you were, but I know there's always

1436
01:11:42.319 --> 01:11:44.000
that one out there who's like, oh wow, he's really

1437
01:11:44.039 --> 01:11:44.319
into me.

1438
01:11:46.239 --> 01:11:48.760
I think it's just so ridiculous that that these young,

1439
01:11:49.119 --> 01:11:52.119
younger men are buying into this, Like if he is

1440
01:11:52.279 --> 01:11:56.560
the beacon of manhood, we're in trouble. I'm sorry. There's

1441
01:11:56.640 --> 01:11:59.640
nothing masculine as you said about him. He is absolutely drifting.

1442
01:11:59.680 --> 01:12:03.039
He's he's just really manipulating and molding young people's minds

1443
01:12:03.079 --> 01:12:05.640
to believe that if you act like me, you treat

1444
01:12:05.720 --> 01:12:09.520
women badly and you make bad investments that you're you're

1445
01:12:09.560 --> 01:12:12.199
gonna be a great person, You're gonna be successful individual.

1446
01:12:13.119 --> 01:12:15.920
Everything he's doing is just look, it's a house of cards.

1447
01:12:15.960 --> 01:12:18.560
Man. He know it's weak. He's a weak person. He

1448
01:12:18.680 --> 01:12:19.520
is weak, you know.

1449
01:12:19.640 --> 01:12:21.319
And and and sure, when he gets mad enough, all

1450
01:12:21.359 --> 01:12:23.319
of a sudden, it's like, oh, you know, let's get

1451
01:12:23.359 --> 01:12:26.119
in the ring. Like, bro, listen, that ship sailed. Sure,

1452
01:12:26.159 --> 01:12:28.640
that's that's when his lisp starts flying.

1453
01:12:28.880 --> 01:12:30.439
Yeah. Yeah, And I can only make fun of that

1454
01:12:30.479 --> 01:12:32.640
because I had a lisp as a kid. So don't

1455
01:12:32.680 --> 01:12:35.359
come for me because I overcame it. He didn't. And

1456
01:12:35.439 --> 01:12:38.439
then he gets really upset and he's like, dolls'll get

1457
01:12:38.479 --> 01:12:40.720
in the bring, would you okay, I'll beat you up.

1458
01:12:41.840 --> 01:12:44.920
British comes out. Yeah, like you know what he looks like.

1459
01:12:45.039 --> 01:12:49.279
He looks like like if Bam Bam from the Flintstone

1460
01:12:49.520 --> 01:12:53.039
grew up, but like never saw a therapist, you know

1461
01:12:53.039 --> 01:12:55.279
what I mean? Because he's like he's like bam bam

1462
01:12:56.840 --> 01:12:58.800
like and I can't get that out of my head. Yeah,

1463
01:12:58.880 --> 01:13:01.800
give him, give him like a giant drum stickers to

1464
01:13:01.920 --> 01:13:04.680
the chicken wing and uh and put them in one

1465
01:13:04.720 --> 01:13:08.079
of those Cocta things and it looks chromagnom so so

1466
01:13:08.199 --> 01:13:11.880
we were Box Adventure from Turbographics. Remember Box Adventures? Yes,

1467
01:13:13.439 --> 01:13:17.159
I remember that ship. You're going back? Hey? What what?

1468
01:13:17.399 --> 01:13:17.680
What is?

1469
01:13:17.760 --> 01:13:20.159
What are your thoughts that I have thoughts? We probably

1470
01:13:20.159 --> 01:13:22.399
were very much on the same page with this guy. Uh,

1471
01:13:23.520 --> 01:13:27.960
what were your thoughts about these podcasts, these conservative podcasts

1472
01:13:28.000 --> 01:13:30.439
that got behind this guy and platform him and gave

1473
01:13:30.520 --> 01:13:33.000
him the ability to do this podcast too? Like why

1474
01:13:33.079 --> 01:13:35.840
why is Patrick pick David having someone like him? You

1475
01:13:35.920 --> 01:13:38.920
know that that made no sense to me? Like there

1476
01:13:38.960 --> 01:13:41.560
there were there were, there was everybody. Yeah, Cannas owns

1477
01:13:41.600 --> 01:13:43.640
behind him, like she's gone off the deband anyway. But

1478
01:13:43.960 --> 01:13:47.039
I'm just saying that what what what was behind that

1479
01:13:47.159 --> 01:13:47.680
in your mind?

1480
01:13:47.760 --> 01:13:49.760
Like why? I mean, did they need the money that bad?

1481
01:13:49.840 --> 01:13:52.079
They need the eyeballs that bad that they would lower

1482
01:13:52.159 --> 01:13:54.880
their standards enough to platform this guy.

1483
01:13:55.800 --> 01:13:58.720
It's all self interested again. And Cannas Owen's husband is

1484
01:13:58.880 --> 01:14:03.520
like best friends with Andrew Tape, so so there's there's

1485
01:14:03.560 --> 01:14:05.840
real connections there, and I think sometimes you just do

1486
01:14:05.960 --> 01:14:09.359
it to save phase, you know, And it's all about clout, right,

1487
01:14:09.439 --> 01:14:12.399
It's all about clout, which is why people play the circles.

1488
01:14:12.479 --> 01:14:15.319
You know, you're talking a lot about folks on the

1489
01:14:16.239 --> 01:14:18.960
the conservative leaning side, and I can think of a

1490
01:14:19.000 --> 01:14:23.199
lot of people on the left leaning side of things

1491
01:14:23.520 --> 01:14:26.479
that do the same things. I mean, like Lev Parness

1492
01:14:26.800 --> 01:14:29.439
and Michael Cohen, Like how many times do these guys

1493
01:14:29.520 --> 01:14:31.800
need to go live on a podcast and talk to

1494
01:14:31.880 --> 01:14:35.199
the same twelve people? Like how much more does Michael

1495
01:14:35.239 --> 01:14:37.560
Cohen have to offer this world? Or is he just

1496
01:14:37.680 --> 01:14:39.760
there to get his five bucks a month. I don't know,

1497
01:14:40.119 --> 01:14:42.399
I don't know. You know, a great point, it really is.

1498
01:14:42.560 --> 01:14:46.800
It seems like the ability for since we're talking about

1499
01:14:46.800 --> 01:14:51.479
podcasting now, the ability for anybody who has the hope

1500
01:14:51.520 --> 01:14:53.000
in the dream to build.

1501
01:14:52.760 --> 01:14:53.439
Something as.

1502
01:14:55.279 --> 01:14:59.600
An independent podcaster. It seems like the window of opportunity

1503
01:14:59.600 --> 01:15:02.760
of the doors just being close to you. Because in

1504
01:15:02.840 --> 01:15:04.800
the beginning was the wild West, like anybody could just

1505
01:15:04.840 --> 01:15:07.359
get in there. Anybody can get in there and become,

1506
01:15:08.560 --> 01:15:10.359
you know, some a bit of a success in terms

1507
01:15:10.399 --> 01:15:12.800
of a following right right in the beginning, there wasn't

1508
01:15:12.800 --> 01:15:15.760
as many options. But now we're looking at what was

1509
01:15:15.800 --> 01:15:19.239
it they said last report, over five million podcasts out there.

1510
01:15:19.279 --> 01:15:19.399
Now.

1511
01:15:19.439 --> 01:15:21.000
It doesn't mean all of them are active, but Still

1512
01:15:21.000 --> 01:15:24.600
you got a huge saturation of choices, and who's going

1513
01:15:24.680 --> 01:15:26.680
to be presented to you when you open your app?

1514
01:15:27.159 --> 01:15:31.880
You know they and these apps are like okay, like Apple, Spotify. Look,

1515
01:15:31.960 --> 01:15:34.920
I've done enough in business to understand how it works.

1516
01:15:34.960 --> 01:15:36.800
I've been in sales. I understand how this works.

1517
01:15:37.199 --> 01:15:37.880
They deny that.

1518
01:15:38.159 --> 01:15:40.439
No, no, no, we don't take money. There's no such thing.

1519
01:15:40.520 --> 01:15:42.760
These people all play the game bullshit. You guys are

1520
01:15:42.760 --> 01:15:45.479
all lying. They all got big pockets behind them. The

1521
01:15:45.520 --> 01:15:48.239
only reason that every time you open Apple, for example,

1522
01:15:48.319 --> 01:15:51.439
and you see let's say, hot Save America is because

1523
01:15:51.439 --> 01:15:54.279
there's enough money to keep them on the front page,

1524
01:15:54.359 --> 01:15:55.880
just not because of their damn downloads.

1525
01:15:56.279 --> 01:15:56.439
Man.

1526
01:15:56.880 --> 01:15:58.520
Look, there was a time I was in the top

1527
01:15:58.560 --> 01:16:01.000
one hundred in politics on Apple and most people probably

1528
01:16:01.039 --> 01:16:04.359
even know who I am. You didn't see me on

1529
01:16:04.479 --> 01:16:07.479
every Apple splash page right when you open it.

1530
01:16:07.600 --> 01:16:08.079
No you didn't.

1531
01:16:08.439 --> 01:16:12.159
So it's a bunch of lies and manipulation and bullshit.

1532
01:16:12.439 --> 01:16:14.640
And it's unfortunate that you have voices out there like

1533
01:16:14.960 --> 01:16:16.920
I personally, Royce, I don't know what you do, but

1534
01:16:16.920 --> 01:16:18.600
I don't even listen to a lot of big guys anymore.

1535
01:16:18.640 --> 01:16:20.600
Unless there's like a certain interview I want to hear.

1536
01:16:21.199 --> 01:16:23.159
I support a lot of independence. I really do, because

1537
01:16:23.159 --> 01:16:26.359
there's a lot of good quality independent podcasters out there

1538
01:16:26.359 --> 01:16:27.720
who are going to do the work. They're going to

1539
01:16:27.760 --> 01:16:30.239
do the deep dive. They have other jobs and in

1540
01:16:30.319 --> 01:16:33.000
their spare time, they are really putting their all into this,

1541
01:16:33.680 --> 01:16:35.800
and I respect those people.

1542
01:16:35.920 --> 01:16:36.039
You know.

1543
01:16:36.079 --> 01:16:38.239
I'm one of those people period, You know, I am.

1544
01:16:38.920 --> 01:16:41.000
This isn't This isn't where I make my money. You know,

1545
01:16:41.319 --> 01:16:44.079
I make my money elsewhere. But I love doing this

1546
01:16:44.319 --> 01:16:46.720
and I felt that I had a voice, so I said, hey,

1547
01:16:46.840 --> 01:16:48.720
let me go ahead and do what I can. And

1548
01:16:48.840 --> 01:16:51.600
on some episodes, man, I sound like an encyclopedia because

1549
01:16:51.640 --> 01:16:52.600
I will dig that deep.

1550
01:16:52.600 --> 01:16:53.600
I get highper focused.

1551
01:16:54.119 --> 01:16:58.640
So I think that, you know, the window of opportunity, unfortunately,

1552
01:16:58.960 --> 01:17:01.640
is getting narrower, and it's very sad to see that

1553
01:17:01.760 --> 01:17:03.479
this has become an industry. I have a person I

1554
01:17:03.600 --> 01:17:06.039
know that has been podcasting for a very long time,

1555
01:17:06.119 --> 01:17:08.159
and you knows some people that are in the industry

1556
01:17:08.239 --> 01:17:11.640
that are pretty well known people, and he still wants

1557
01:17:11.680 --> 01:17:13.079
to hold on to the fact. He looks at it

1558
01:17:13.239 --> 01:17:15.560
as you know, it's just like bands, you know, it's

1559
01:17:15.640 --> 01:17:17.840
just like being in a band and all of this.

1560
01:17:18.079 --> 01:17:19.800
You know, it's not an industry. It's punk rock.

1561
01:17:19.880 --> 01:17:23.039
Now. I'm sorry, it's not anymore. And that's unfortunately. I

1562
01:17:23.159 --> 01:17:26.560
wish it wasn't. That was not the truth, but it is.

1563
01:17:27.000 --> 01:17:27.560
It really is.

1564
01:17:27.720 --> 01:17:29.800
So how does because you've been doing this for a

1565
01:17:29.840 --> 01:17:32.520
long time, how does someone become successful? And that could

1566
01:17:32.520 --> 01:17:35.439
be many things. It doesn't necessarily mean rich, But how

1567
01:17:35.439 --> 01:17:38.000
would you be able to be able to get your

1568
01:17:38.079 --> 01:17:40.680
voice heard and also be able to do this for

1569
01:17:40.760 --> 01:17:42.880
a living to where you know, maybe you make enough

1570
01:17:42.960 --> 01:17:43.760
to keep it going?

1571
01:17:43.960 --> 01:17:48.159
For example, how to set that I could tell I

1572
01:17:48.239 --> 01:17:52.000
mean I had for the post pandemic, I made a

1573
01:17:52.119 --> 01:17:56.000
living live streaming on TikTok, and you could look at

1574
01:17:56.039 --> 01:17:58.600
the metrics on TikTok and my success on TikTok and

1575
01:17:58.720 --> 01:18:00.960
think that it was really, really imporant pgressive. But as

1576
01:18:01.039 --> 01:18:03.359
soon as you took it out of that ecosystem, it

1577
01:18:03.439 --> 01:18:08.399
didn't scale, it didn't carry over into other platforms. I

1578
01:18:08.960 --> 01:18:15.159
have decided to break it in pursuit of growing further,

1579
01:18:15.680 --> 01:18:19.439
much along the same thought process of what you're asking,

1580
01:18:19.600 --> 01:18:23.439
because it comes down to if you're really gonna do this,

1581
01:18:23.760 --> 01:18:26.000
and if you've done it long enough that you're now

1582
01:18:26.159 --> 01:18:29.439
in it, And I'm like, oh, okay, well I didn't

1583
01:18:29.439 --> 01:18:31.640
expect to still be here and now I'm here, So

1584
01:18:31.840 --> 01:18:35.039
now what's next. I can't do this forever. So that's

1585
01:18:35.079 --> 01:18:37.680
the evolution, right, And if you're going to stick with

1586
01:18:37.840 --> 01:18:41.079
it the most. Look, I've gotten to the point where

1587
01:18:41.079 --> 01:18:44.920
I'm like, I just you're gonna get all of me. Okay,

1588
01:18:45.079 --> 01:18:47.159
there was a time when you wouldn't. You're gonna get

1589
01:18:47.199 --> 01:18:50.319
all of me. And if I lose followers, so be it.

1590
01:18:50.960 --> 01:18:55.159
But I'm hoping that I have five hundred really really

1591
01:18:55.359 --> 01:18:58.680
passionate people that are interested about anything that I have

1592
01:18:58.880 --> 01:19:01.680
going on, that they can help lift up anything that

1593
01:19:01.760 --> 01:19:04.119
I have going on. And I think that that's the

1594
01:19:04.279 --> 01:19:07.920
long term proposition. You know, I have six hundred and

1595
01:19:07.960 --> 01:19:11.520
fifty thousand followers on TikTok, but if I go live,

1596
01:19:11.960 --> 01:19:14.520
there might only be two hundred people watching any given home.

1597
01:19:14.920 --> 01:19:18.600
It's all bullshit, right. So then I go over to

1598
01:19:18.680 --> 01:19:21.479
my sub stack and my core people are there, and

1599
01:19:21.560 --> 01:19:23.159
those are the people that are on my Twitch and

1600
01:19:23.239 --> 01:19:26.760
my youth They're everywhere. So I think that part of

1601
01:19:26.840 --> 01:19:29.640
it has to be as weird as this sounds. It

1602
01:19:29.720 --> 01:19:32.640
has to be not focusing on the money that's short term.

1603
01:19:33.399 --> 01:19:36.039
You have to go long term and build something that

1604
01:19:36.239 --> 01:19:39.880
provides value for people. When I'm not live, people want

1605
01:19:39.920 --> 01:19:41.920
me to go live. I mean, I used to provide

1606
01:19:41.960 --> 01:19:45.920
a very specific type of stream. But now the people

1607
01:19:46.000 --> 01:19:48.479
that I have gotten rid of and the people that

1608
01:19:48.560 --> 01:19:51.760
I have kind of whittled it down to, don't just

1609
01:19:51.920 --> 01:19:55.479
watch me sit here and do like what I'll call

1610
01:19:55.600 --> 01:19:57.760
office hours where I'm like, guys, I just got to

1611
01:19:57.800 --> 01:19:59.479
go through notes and clean off my desk, but I

1612
01:19:59.560 --> 01:20:03.920
haven't been live today. And and if I went to

1613
01:20:04.039 --> 01:20:06.760
the parks where I used to stream, and I pay

1614
01:20:06.880 --> 01:20:10.119
and I played the game, I can make hundreds of dollars.

1615
01:20:11.319 --> 01:20:13.520
But I got to work the leaderboards and work the

1616
01:20:13.600 --> 01:20:16.760
gifting and do the whole thing. So that's short term money,

1617
01:20:16.840 --> 01:20:21.159
which is nice, yes, But I'm now, folks correct, So

1618
01:20:21.399 --> 01:20:24.439
now it's more valuable to be like, guys, I didn't

1619
01:20:24.439 --> 01:20:25.960
make it to the park today, but let me show

1620
01:20:25.960 --> 01:20:29.319
you what I've been working on, you know, So now

1621
01:20:29.359 --> 01:20:33.560
they're on the ride with you, and it's it's it's

1622
01:20:33.680 --> 01:20:35.159
it's a lot more work to do it that way,

1623
01:20:35.199 --> 01:20:36.880
and a lot of people said, just stick to doing

1624
01:20:36.920 --> 01:20:39.039
the dumb ship. Just stick to do and I'm like,

1625
01:20:39.039 --> 01:20:40.319
I don't want to spend the rest of my life

1626
01:20:40.359 --> 01:20:43.560
doing that. So to answer your question is how do

1627
01:20:43.600 --> 01:20:46.000
you how do you make a day like you? It's

1628
01:20:46.079 --> 01:20:50.079
not about getting tons of you right, It's about speaking

1629
01:20:50.119 --> 01:20:52.800
to the people that are listening. It's not it's it's

1630
01:20:52.880 --> 01:20:55.119
it's having it. Not speaking down to them, it's speaking

1631
01:20:55.199 --> 01:20:58.680
to them, speaking with them. So I think I think

1632
01:20:58.760 --> 01:21:02.479
that if you can find a way to sustain that,

1633
01:21:03.720 --> 01:21:05.600
then maybe you break through. I got to tell you

1634
01:21:05.760 --> 01:21:07.840
sometimes when you were describing this at the top of

1635
01:21:07.920 --> 01:21:11.359
the show about like you know, hitting that benchmark and

1636
01:21:11.399 --> 01:21:13.119
then having all that, and I'm like, it doesn't even

1637
01:21:13.159 --> 01:21:16.000
sound appealing at this age, like I've had I've had

1638
01:21:16.039 --> 01:21:18.880
a slice of it on TikTok, Like it's not appealing,

1639
01:21:19.439 --> 01:21:21.479
Like I'm not I'm not doing what I'm doing these

1640
01:21:21.560 --> 01:21:26.680
days reviews. I'm doing it to keep that core audience

1641
01:21:27.279 --> 01:21:30.760
going on these new endeavors. I could give a ship.

1642
01:21:31.479 --> 01:21:33.520
I mean, I get if somebody comes in a gains

1643
01:21:33.560 --> 01:21:35.199
me hard, I'm like, just don't don't fucking watch me,

1644
01:21:36.399 --> 01:21:39.640
Like I don't, I don't care. But but but you know,

1645
01:21:39.720 --> 01:21:42.199
like when, why weren't you in the park the other day?

1646
01:21:42.520 --> 01:21:42.680
Well?

1647
01:21:42.720 --> 01:21:44.920
I was, Oh I missed it? Well, who why the

1648
01:21:44.960 --> 01:21:47.840
fuck are you asking me? Right? Like, like if you

1649
01:21:47.960 --> 01:21:49.560
come into my life, I go, where were you? I

1650
01:21:49.680 --> 01:21:51.680
was working? Why the fuck were you working? Why weren't

1651
01:21:51.680 --> 01:21:55.399
you watching my live? Asshole? Like it's it sounds pretty

1652
01:21:55.479 --> 01:21:59.000
ridiculous when you flip the scrap. I hope I answered

1653
01:21:59.039 --> 01:22:00.600
your question. I know it just ranted a lot.

1654
01:22:00.680 --> 01:22:02.479
Well no, no, no, no, no, that's all. It's all

1655
01:22:02.560 --> 01:22:05.000
valid information. I mean, is your experiences right.

1656
01:22:05.720 --> 01:22:09.159
I I want to make it clear, like I believe

1657
01:22:09.680 --> 01:22:10.279
anybody in.

1658
01:22:10.399 --> 01:22:13.720
This space, for example, to me, be who you are.

1659
01:22:14.239 --> 01:22:17.600
Don't put on a front nothing. I hate nothing more

1660
01:22:17.680 --> 01:22:21.520
than watching somebody who's a character. Okay, now, unless you're

1661
01:22:21.520 --> 01:22:25.520
specifically putting it out there that it's entertainment, fair enough,

1662
01:22:25.680 --> 01:22:28.279
I know what I'm getting into. But you know, if

1663
01:22:28.319 --> 01:22:31.960
you're in the news, commentary, space, politics, anything like that,

1664
01:22:32.039 --> 01:22:35.279
which is really hot right now, don't don't don't be

1665
01:22:35.359 --> 01:22:38.119
something you're not. Just don't be something you're not. I

1666
01:22:38.359 --> 01:22:40.760
can't stand fake. That's that's what that's how you're.

1667
01:22:40.640 --> 01:22:43.600
Going to break through. But you still need to play into. Unfortunately,

1668
01:22:43.600 --> 01:22:46.439
you still have to play into the clickbait world if

1669
01:22:46.439 --> 01:22:48.560
you really want to. I understand I don't like doing it,

1670
01:22:49.159 --> 01:22:50.960
and I'm on your side. I agree with you. I'm

1671
01:22:51.000 --> 01:22:52.079
I'm against it as well.

1672
01:22:52.520 --> 01:22:54.760
But you know, everything I was saying earlier really had

1673
01:22:54.800 --> 01:22:57.640
to do with you know, I I see people get

1674
01:22:57.800 --> 01:23:00.800
so bent out of shape in his heart and when

1675
01:23:00.800 --> 01:23:04.279
they're like they're inspired and they're like, I'm going to

1676
01:23:04.359 --> 01:23:06.479
do this too, and then they get into it and

1677
01:23:06.560 --> 01:23:08.439
they feel, like you said, they've got to reach a

1678
01:23:08.479 --> 01:23:09.159
certain threshold.

1679
01:23:09.199 --> 01:23:11.439
I need ten thousand downloads, I need twenty thousand. I

1680
01:23:11.439 --> 01:23:13.640
need one hundred thousand, and it's like, give a shit.

1681
01:23:14.239 --> 01:23:16.159
You know, I like doing this more than I like

1682
01:23:16.199 --> 01:23:19.079
doing my own podcast. Yeah, you want to know why,

1683
01:23:19.239 --> 01:23:21.479
because when this is over, I'm gonna go smoke a

1684
01:23:21.560 --> 01:23:24.760
bowl and not have to edit shit. I'm not gonna

1685
01:23:24.760 --> 01:23:26.560
have to edit shit, right, you know what I mean?

1686
01:23:26.920 --> 01:23:28.600
And I can curse over here. I don't have to

1687
01:23:28.680 --> 01:23:32.479
care about here losing a follower. This is your fucking problem.

1688
01:23:32.560 --> 01:23:35.680
Yeah, well, everybody, Look, everybody, this is the my damn

1689
01:23:35.680 --> 01:23:37.039
show there. You know, I got a filthy mouth, so

1690
01:23:37.079 --> 01:23:37.680
it doesn't even matter.

1691
01:23:38.000 --> 01:23:40.239
But my audios will hear this and be like, oh man,

1692
01:23:40.279 --> 01:23:42.399
why does he act this way on his podcast?

1693
01:23:42.600 --> 01:23:45.119
Yeah, and you've got to listen more. I like I

1694
01:23:45.239 --> 01:23:47.439
like having the conversations though words. I like having the

1695
01:23:47.560 --> 01:23:50.000
opportunity to have someone open up and just let go.

1696
01:23:50.319 --> 01:23:52.479
I really do. I think there's more value in that.

1697
01:23:52.560 --> 01:23:55.680
I think you learn from somebody a lot more instead

1698
01:23:55.720 --> 01:23:59.319
of trying to play the persona and try to stay

1699
01:23:59.359 --> 01:24:01.600
within the guardbe. I mean, if you can't speak your mind,

1700
01:24:01.640 --> 01:24:04.439
then we're not having real conversation. We're just not You

1701
01:24:04.479 --> 01:24:05.760
should be able to express yourself.

1702
01:24:06.000 --> 01:24:07.199
But then it does to means you're doing it for

1703
01:24:07.239 --> 01:24:10.439
the wrong reasons, and that goes back to the whole

1704
01:24:10.600 --> 01:24:14.600
grifter thing, because you're if you're there. So when I started,

1705
01:24:14.640 --> 01:24:15.960
not to bring it back to what I was doing

1706
01:24:16.039 --> 01:24:18.039
on TikTok, but when I started doing what I was doing,

1707
01:24:18.079 --> 01:24:21.039
I was front of trend. A lot of people started

1708
01:24:21.079 --> 01:24:23.880
doing it because they saw what I was doing and

1709
01:24:24.000 --> 01:24:26.920
I was doing it with success. I originally started doing

1710
01:24:26.960 --> 01:24:29.680
it for my own mental health escape, and I think

1711
01:24:29.800 --> 01:24:33.479
because I was just having fun and being me that

1712
01:24:33.600 --> 01:24:37.039
people latched onto it. But I maintained an air of professionalism.

1713
01:24:37.840 --> 01:24:40.199
What has happened over the years is there's nothing left

1714
01:24:40.279 --> 01:24:42.960
to do. So now I just satirize it and let

1715
01:24:43.000 --> 01:24:45.000
it rip all day and just look for the punchline,

1716
01:24:45.600 --> 01:24:48.199
you know what I mean. Because it's an oversaturated market,

1717
01:24:48.279 --> 01:24:51.479
so there's nothing left because now everybody's doing it for

1718
01:24:51.600 --> 01:24:54.079
the clout, and and I'm like, man, I've been doing

1719
01:24:54.119 --> 01:24:56.439
this so damn long. I've seen it all, I've done

1720
01:24:56.439 --> 01:24:59.800
it all. There's nothing left to do but to completely flip.

1721
01:25:00.000 --> 01:25:02.800
So with that being said, where where is the grift?

1722
01:25:02.880 --> 01:25:04.760
As you said, like, where where would it be that

1723
01:25:04.880 --> 01:25:06.159
you would be grifting?

1724
01:25:06.760 --> 01:25:09.119
How am I a grifter? No? You're saying, no, no, no, no,

1725
01:25:09.399 --> 01:25:13.159
that's the question. That's I don't care. Okay, I listen.

1726
01:25:13.560 --> 01:25:15.520
Reddit would tell you I'm a grifter because of the

1727
01:25:15.560 --> 01:25:18.239
gifting on TikTok. But I would tell you a lot

1728
01:25:18.279 --> 01:25:20.279
of those people on Reddit are just jealous that I

1729
01:25:20.319 --> 01:25:22.600
get to make money going with Disney World. Oh I

1730
01:25:22.640 --> 01:25:23.399
thought I thought you were.

1731
01:25:23.560 --> 01:25:27.439
You're alluding to maybe because for example, you can act

1732
01:25:27.520 --> 01:25:29.920
one way on a show like mine, but then on yours,

1733
01:25:30.039 --> 01:25:31.880
you you have to be a different person.

1734
01:25:32.279 --> 01:25:35.199
No, if people don't understand persona that's them. Gotcha? What what?

1735
01:25:35.560 --> 01:25:35.600
What?

1736
01:25:35.800 --> 01:25:38.319
What I used to do in the early days about

1737
01:25:38.359 --> 01:25:41.239
being professional was I didn't express my opinions as much

1738
01:25:41.800 --> 01:25:44.399
as you know I didn't. I didn't I didn't say

1739
01:25:44.840 --> 01:25:47.880
what I was thinking. Now I say whatever I want.

1740
01:25:48.159 --> 01:25:51.159
I choose my words carefully right, so that if people

1741
01:25:51.159 --> 01:25:53.239
are only half listening, they're not going to know what

1742
01:25:53.319 --> 01:25:57.319
I'm saying. But to those that have, you know, anything

1743
01:25:57.359 --> 01:26:00.239
above an eighth grade reading level, I can get was

1744
01:26:00.319 --> 01:26:03.079
saying things in a family friendly manner and rip somebody

1745
01:26:03.159 --> 01:26:06.920
to shit, right. So so, but it was a natural

1746
01:26:07.000 --> 01:26:10.359
evolution of like showing all of myself. It's not that

1747
01:26:10.479 --> 01:26:12.840
I wasn't being authentic in the beginning. I was still

1748
01:26:12.960 --> 01:26:18.119
being me, but I I took the gloves off because

1749
01:26:18.119 --> 01:26:20.920
there was nothing left to do and it became an

1750
01:26:21.000 --> 01:26:27.359
oversaturated market. So again, how do you differentiate yourself? How

1751
01:26:27.399 --> 01:26:28.920
do you you know it goes back to the idea

1752
01:26:28.920 --> 01:26:31.520
of the purple elephant, if you're familiar with that marketing term.

1753
01:26:31.840 --> 01:26:33.880
So how do you differentiate yourself in a world of

1754
01:26:33.960 --> 01:26:37.239
podcasting now? When everything on YouTube is a face like this,

1755
01:26:37.520 --> 01:26:41.359
like yours, right, I'm I call to me. You know

1756
01:26:41.399 --> 01:26:43.880
what this is like you're an audio guy. This is

1757
01:26:43.960 --> 01:26:47.359
like phase two of podcasting, because podcasting had a boom.

1758
01:26:47.640 --> 01:26:51.079
This is the phase two boom of podcasting. This is

1759
01:26:51.159 --> 01:26:54.439
like when mini disc came back the second time. So

1760
01:26:54.720 --> 01:26:56.760
that's what this is, you know what I mean.

1761
01:26:57.000 --> 01:27:02.039
Yeah, yeah, well I I understand what you're getting at.

1762
01:27:02.479 --> 01:27:07.000
In my perspective, I'm I am what you see man,

1763
01:27:07.359 --> 01:27:08.239
You know, I don't.

1764
01:27:08.359 --> 01:27:12.039
I don't. I don't believe in being that different person.

1765
01:27:13.119 --> 01:27:16.039
The only thing this does for me when I get

1766
01:27:16.079 --> 01:27:17.840
on the mic and I got the earbuds or whatever

1767
01:27:17.880 --> 01:27:19.560
the hell it is, I get focused.

1768
01:27:19.680 --> 01:27:20.279
That's all it is.

1769
01:27:20.560 --> 01:27:23.840
It's just like me having a drink right loosens me

1770
01:27:23.960 --> 01:27:25.800
up a bit, and now I can have a conversation

1771
01:27:26.279 --> 01:27:29.119
without inhibition because now I'm just focusing on you. I

1772
01:27:29.279 --> 01:27:32.239
know that I hit the record button and I got

1773
01:27:32.359 --> 01:27:35.920
to get here to this space where I can listen

1774
01:27:36.479 --> 01:27:38.720
hopefully say something that has any value.

1775
01:27:39.279 --> 01:27:41.399
But and sometimes I'm playing mental.

1776
01:27:41.279 --> 01:27:45.359
Judo with people, you know, But I am who I am,

1777
01:27:45.560 --> 01:27:46.920
you know, And you're right, there's a lot of guys

1778
01:27:46.920 --> 01:27:49.279
that may look like me, but really, you know, for me,

1779
01:27:49.720 --> 01:27:51.600
like I'm a working person, you know, I work with

1780
01:27:51.680 --> 01:27:53.079
my hands. I work in the trades. I do a

1781
01:27:53.159 --> 01:27:53.680
vent production.

1782
01:27:53.800 --> 01:27:54.359
You know, I'm in it.

1783
01:27:54.840 --> 01:27:57.560
Sometimes I get here and this is what I look

1784
01:27:57.680 --> 01:27:59.479
like because I ain't got time to polish up and

1785
01:27:59.520 --> 01:27:59.880
put a suit.

1786
01:28:00.279 --> 01:28:01.920
Can I wear one? Absolutely? I love it?

1787
01:28:02.479 --> 01:28:05.640
But right now, hey, I'm more concerned about having a

1788
01:28:05.640 --> 01:28:07.640
good conversation and making sure that people can hear what

1789
01:28:07.720 --> 01:28:11.199
we're talking about. So will will this change someday?

1790
01:28:11.319 --> 01:28:16.319
Possibly? Who knows? But for the amendment, I just I

1791
01:28:16.319 --> 01:28:18.439
didn't take it. But I'm just talking about But I'm

1792
01:28:18.479 --> 01:28:21.920
saying the world we're living in, it's microphone phase chair square. Well, No,

1793
01:28:22.000 --> 01:28:23.760
there's guys like this, this is come on.

1794
01:28:24.119 --> 01:28:26.279
There's there's the ex military guy with the hat and

1795
01:28:26.359 --> 01:28:28.199
the tight shirt, and you know that there's a lot

1796
01:28:28.239 --> 01:28:30.079
of that going around right now. And they think it's

1797
01:28:30.119 --> 01:28:32.359
because it's cool and it's this whole manisphere thing. It's like,

1798
01:28:34.159 --> 01:28:36.000
you know, it's it's just a stick.

1799
01:28:36.119 --> 01:28:37.920
It really is. It's all it is. But when you're

1800
01:28:38.399 --> 01:28:40.439
what we're doing right here, and I will tell you

1801
01:28:40.560 --> 01:28:42.479
because when I'm listening to you and then when I'm

1802
01:28:42.520 --> 01:28:45.880
responding to you, I'm in the zone right now, like

1803
01:28:46.039 --> 01:28:48.840
I'm in a I'm gonna. I'm in a a dialed

1804
01:28:49.000 --> 01:28:52.720
in thing right now where I am. I am focused

1805
01:28:52.760 --> 01:28:55.760
on listening to what you're saying. I'm trying to build

1806
01:28:55.880 --> 01:28:58.319
my thoughts and to the to the point that I

1807
01:28:58.439 --> 01:29:02.079
start going like from my heart, and when I'm done,

1808
01:29:02.239 --> 01:29:04.760
I'm like, Man, I hope that made sense because that

1809
01:29:04.960 --> 01:29:07.640
really just came from the soul, you know, because I'm

1810
01:29:07.640 --> 01:29:08.159
in the zone.

1811
01:29:08.720 --> 01:29:10.920
Yeah, but you got you got to put it out there, man,

1812
01:29:11.560 --> 01:29:13.439
you know, that's the whole that's the beauty of these

1813
01:29:13.479 --> 01:29:16.359
type of conversations. You have to let it go and

1814
01:29:16.439 --> 01:29:17.600
you have to get it out there.

1815
01:29:17.800 --> 01:29:19.159
But you can't do that if you're trying to hold

1816
01:29:19.239 --> 01:29:22.880
up a fake front. It's impossible, exactly exactly.

1817
01:29:23.039 --> 01:29:26.119
And that's that's the issue that I'm having right now

1818
01:29:27.000 --> 01:29:30.039
with the podcasting world, and it's become such a big

1819
01:29:30.119 --> 01:29:33.199
thing and it's so influential that it's leading people in

1820
01:29:33.279 --> 01:29:36.760
the wrong direction. I believe there's a lot of intentional

1821
01:29:36.880 --> 01:29:39.960
misinformation or you know, like you said earlier, there's like

1822
01:29:40.000 --> 01:29:43.399
a handful of companies or whatever that control most of

1823
01:29:43.479 --> 01:29:46.920
the narrative because of the money behind it, and that

1824
01:29:47.079 --> 01:29:49.520
individual when they started may not have wanted to be

1825
01:29:49.600 --> 01:29:51.680
that person, but now they're too deep. It's like, you know,

1826
01:29:51.760 --> 01:29:53.560
going back to what we're talking about earlier, do you

1827
01:29:53.600 --> 01:29:55.439
want to get rid of the money or the power?

1828
01:29:56.039 --> 01:29:57.880
You're kind of stuck in this situation. It's like, well

1829
01:29:57.880 --> 01:29:59.439
what do I do to I go back to poverty,

1830
01:30:00.439 --> 01:30:01.920
go back to you know, washing dish?

1831
01:30:02.079 --> 01:30:03.720
Like how do I have my cake and eat it too?

1832
01:30:03.920 --> 01:30:06.199
Is that possible? Not to bring it back to Bongino,

1833
01:30:06.279 --> 01:30:08.520
But I mean, he really is the perfect example. I

1834
01:30:08.600 --> 01:30:11.239
mean I almost empathize with the guy, you know what

1835
01:30:11.319 --> 01:30:13.479
I mean, in a weird way. I mean, first of all,

1836
01:30:13.680 --> 01:30:16.840
was he was secret service for Obama? Yes? Okay, so

1837
01:30:17.000 --> 01:30:19.199
like let's not even politicize the man for a half

1838
01:30:19.239 --> 01:30:21.880
a second. Let's just talk about him as a podcaster, right,

1839
01:30:22.680 --> 01:30:26.399
Like you you had a really good thing going, why

1840
01:30:26.439 --> 01:30:29.680
would you leave it? Because you would be a fool

1841
01:30:29.920 --> 01:30:32.119
to not take that opportunity, Like if you and I

1842
01:30:32.319 --> 01:30:35.199
were given that opportunity, you'd be a fool not to

1843
01:30:35.279 --> 01:30:37.640
take it because it's once in a lifetime. But then

1844
01:30:37.680 --> 01:30:39.239
you get there and you find out the grass isn't

1845
01:30:39.239 --> 01:30:40.640
always green, and that's truth.

1846
01:30:41.239 --> 01:30:43.359
There's there's nothing much truth in what you said because

1847
01:30:44.039 --> 01:30:46.640
you only have one life, and how many opportunities do

1848
01:30:46.680 --> 01:30:47.560
you ever really get?

1849
01:30:47.680 --> 01:30:50.079
You know, would you rather live with the doubt? Would

1850
01:30:50.119 --> 01:30:53.800
you rather live with the doubt or did you really

1851
01:30:53.840 --> 01:30:56.399
regret it? Though I will yes, you would.

1852
01:30:56.640 --> 01:31:00.680
Everybody regrets the decision to not pursue, and many of

1853
01:31:00.760 --> 01:31:03.399
us may not even pursue something because of the fear.

1854
01:31:03.800 --> 01:31:06.279
And there's also the imposter syndrome. Maybe we don't believe

1855
01:31:06.399 --> 01:31:08.760
like we belong in that position, or or that we

1856
01:31:08.920 --> 01:31:11.079
need we should be the person in that in that

1857
01:31:11.199 --> 01:31:15.039
position taking advantage of the opportunity. So a lot, a lot,

1858
01:31:15.119 --> 01:31:16.880
a lot of what holds people back. I believe it's

1859
01:31:16.920 --> 01:31:18.720
both fear and imposter syndrome. If it's not fear, it's

1860
01:31:18.720 --> 01:31:22.479
imposter syndrome. There's very few people that can be confident

1861
01:31:22.640 --> 01:31:26.640
enough to walk out there into any situation and go,

1862
01:31:26.760 --> 01:31:28.960
you know what, no matter what, I'm going to be

1863
01:31:29.039 --> 01:31:29.720
me and I'm taking this.

1864
01:31:29.920 --> 01:31:31.800
I'm taking this. Not many people do.

1865
01:31:32.359 --> 01:31:34.079
And it's it's and it's not it's not to put

1866
01:31:34.119 --> 01:31:36.840
anybody down who feels the way that I just describe,

1867
01:31:37.239 --> 01:31:39.600
because there's times we all feel that way. There's times

1868
01:31:39.640 --> 01:31:41.640
we all feel that way. I've had job offers where

1869
01:31:41.640 --> 01:31:43.560
I'm like, you know what, the money's good, but this

1870
01:31:43.680 --> 01:31:46.279
isn't me. The sain't my wheelhouse, you know, just like

1871
01:31:46.760 --> 01:31:47.760
I'm not going to be that guy.

1872
01:31:47.920 --> 01:31:49.279
I just knew it right, you know.

1873
01:31:49.960 --> 01:31:52.319
So again it wasn't I wasn't trying to talk down

1874
01:31:52.319 --> 01:31:53.840
to anybody who may feel like, oh I don't ever

1875
01:31:53.880 --> 01:31:55.800
fit in. I'm not going to take that step. There's

1876
01:31:55.800 --> 01:31:58.239
a lot of fear. I've always had the entrepreneurial spirit.

1877
01:31:58.880 --> 01:32:01.439
I've never been afraid to take a chance. I've risked money,

1878
01:32:01.439 --> 01:32:03.680
I've risked all that you have to and I'm I'm

1879
01:32:03.720 --> 01:32:05.560
not some multi millionaire by the way, but I think

1880
01:32:05.600 --> 01:32:09.359
I did pretty well for myself considering. And the reality is,

1881
01:32:10.239 --> 01:32:12.640
you're gonna hear a hundred no's. You only need one

1882
01:32:12.760 --> 01:32:15.880
yes man, you really do the basic principles of sales.

1883
01:32:15.880 --> 01:32:17.840
I've always I've always taken personally, like even with my

1884
01:32:17.880 --> 01:32:19.600
sales teams when I used to have the company, is like,

1885
01:32:20.319 --> 01:32:21.640
I don't care, you're gonna hear on a hundred knows.

1886
01:32:21.640 --> 01:32:23.000
You've got to keep knocking those doors you've got. If

1887
01:32:23.000 --> 01:32:26.560
you're not trying, you're not progressing. And if you're always doubting,

1888
01:32:26.600 --> 01:32:29.840
You're not even gonna try. You're gonna live until you've

1889
01:32:29.960 --> 01:32:32.880
cold called. I mean until you have cold called in life. Then,

1890
01:32:33.199 --> 01:32:35.840
because once you've gotten through the rejection of a cold

1891
01:32:35.920 --> 01:32:38.680
call and then also had the success of a cold call,

1892
01:32:39.039 --> 01:32:40.760
that you could take nose all day long.

1893
01:32:41.079 --> 01:32:44.279
Sure, Kirby vacuums cut co all that. I mean, it's

1894
01:32:44.359 --> 01:32:50.960
just like it's it's you know, look so and again

1895
01:32:51.199 --> 01:32:53.279
I don't want to harp on the Bongino thing, but

1896
01:32:53.359 --> 01:32:59.479
my last point to that is that the fear, the

1897
01:32:59.560 --> 01:33:04.479
fear of of regret by not taking that job. Okay,

1898
01:33:04.840 --> 01:33:07.319
I don't think now if I was in that position

1899
01:33:07.399 --> 01:33:10.079
and decided to leave, that I would regret taking the job.

1900
01:33:10.560 --> 01:33:14.119
I may go, oh, I'm leaving now, this isn't what

1901
01:33:14.279 --> 01:33:17.680
I thought. But I think the deeper regret is not knowing.

1902
01:33:18.199 --> 01:33:20.880
So you take that leap and you take that opportunity.

1903
01:33:21.239 --> 01:33:23.279
But to bring it back to the point of failure

1904
01:33:24.600 --> 01:33:27.840
is most people they shut down after a failure and

1905
01:33:27.880 --> 01:33:30.920
they don't realize that that failure is necessary. So then

1906
01:33:30.960 --> 01:33:34.279
the failure becomes the thing that is the roadblock. When

1907
01:33:34.479 --> 01:33:38.680
failure is actually a necessity. Failures is a litmus test

1908
01:33:38.760 --> 01:33:39.239
for success.

1909
01:33:40.079 --> 01:33:43.000
Well, they don't ever want to feel that embarrassment again,

1910
01:33:43.239 --> 01:33:45.720
so they avoid conflict, they avoid struggle.

1911
01:33:46.199 --> 01:33:49.000
But failure is not doing it, not failing at trying.

1912
01:33:49.399 --> 01:33:51.880
Failing at not trying is success in its own even

1913
01:33:51.920 --> 01:33:54.840
if it look most businesses, as you well know, were

1914
01:33:54.920 --> 01:33:58.960
berthed out of a completely different thing. Before Lego was Lego,

1915
01:33:59.079 --> 01:34:01.880
they were making wooden toys. Nintendo was a card company.

1916
01:34:02.319 --> 01:34:04.800
So you know, you you you fail at one thing,

1917
01:34:05.319 --> 01:34:08.079
it's it's it's the it's the not doing that is

1918
01:34:08.159 --> 01:34:11.039
the failure. Yeah, And I hope people listening hear that.

1919
01:34:11.439 --> 01:34:14.680
I completely agree, And that's that's what I was getting at.

1920
01:34:15.279 --> 01:34:17.399
That just probably didn't communicate it, No.

1921
01:34:17.479 --> 01:34:19.600
You did, you did. I just I love harping on

1922
01:34:19.680 --> 01:34:22.000
that because I think that we live in a fear

1923
01:34:22.079 --> 01:34:26.800
based culture, whether it's executive level decision making or or

1924
01:34:26.920 --> 01:34:30.760
whether it's just even the fear of of offending. Like

1925
01:34:30.880 --> 01:34:32.560
you're not going to say anything in this conversation to

1926
01:34:32.640 --> 01:34:35.640
offend me, right, you know what I mean? And I'm

1927
01:34:35.680 --> 01:34:37.840
get I'm reading from you that it's probably the same

1928
01:34:37.960 --> 01:34:38.119
for you.

1929
01:34:38.680 --> 01:34:41.439
I'm good man, you know, I just look, I just

1930
01:34:41.520 --> 01:34:44.239
had I don't know if you heard of him, Derek Gilliard.

1931
01:34:45.039 --> 01:34:49.760
He served under the first Trump administration. He was part

1932
01:34:49.760 --> 01:34:53.680
of HHS twenty five years and he wrote this book.

1933
01:34:55.640 --> 01:34:56.399
I think it was uh.

1934
01:34:56.680 --> 01:34:59.319
I just had him yesterday too, longest four years of

1935
01:34:59.359 --> 01:35:03.960
his life, as he calls it, his perspective of working

1936
01:35:04.039 --> 01:35:07.399
in the Trumpet administration as a black man. And we

1937
01:35:07.560 --> 01:35:11.359
had this long conversation and we we broke through barriers.

1938
01:35:11.399 --> 01:35:13.760
We talked about race, we talked about racial stereotypes. He

1939
01:35:13.840 --> 01:35:15.880
asked me straight up, he is a white guy. Let

1940
01:35:15.920 --> 01:35:17.319
me ask you why there's so many white people that

1941
01:35:17.359 --> 01:35:20.319
shoot up schools and whatnot. And I'm like, happy to

1942
01:35:20.479 --> 01:35:21.319
happy to address that.

1943
01:35:21.720 --> 01:35:24.600
You know, you can't. You can't be afraid to have

1944
01:35:24.760 --> 01:35:26.319
those discussions. You really can't.

1945
01:35:27.359 --> 01:35:30.720
I have a file on that one, right, But you

1946
01:35:30.800 --> 01:35:32.520
can't be afraid to have these discussions. You know, if

1947
01:35:32.960 --> 01:35:35.159
you're afraid of being offended, you're not going to progress

1948
01:35:35.199 --> 01:35:35.560
and learn.

1949
01:35:35.880 --> 01:35:37.680
You're just not. I think it's boring to have a

1950
01:35:37.800 --> 01:35:41.680
conversation where all we're doing is agreeing. Why do I

1951
01:35:41.720 --> 01:35:42.720
want to have that conversation.

1952
01:35:43.399 --> 01:35:47.000
I mean, look, I've had many many conversations where I

1953
01:35:47.039 --> 01:35:50.319
don't agree with everything everyone says. But at least you know,

1954
01:35:50.319 --> 01:35:53.520
if you're intelligent enough of a person, I should walk

1955
01:35:53.560 --> 01:35:56.880
away understanding your perspective. And I should walk away with

1956
01:35:56.920 --> 01:35:59.680
an understanding that I know why you think the way

1957
01:35:59.720 --> 01:36:03.000
you It doesn't mean you're stupid. I just understand why

1958
01:36:03.119 --> 01:36:05.720
you think the way you do. I can now say, okay,

1959
01:36:06.239 --> 01:36:08.479
the way you lived, what you went through, Now I

1960
01:36:08.600 --> 01:36:08.840
get it.

1961
01:36:09.199 --> 01:36:10.279
I get it. I get it.

1962
01:36:10.319 --> 01:36:13.840
I didn't understand it before, and that's that's important to me.

1963
01:36:14.039 --> 01:36:15.800
It really is. And I like learning.

1964
01:36:15.840 --> 01:36:17.279
I mean, one of the things I enjoy about having

1965
01:36:17.319 --> 01:36:20.560
this conversations Royce, is I always walk away learning something.

1966
01:36:20.880 --> 01:36:24.600
I'm always hungry for knowledge. I'm always diving deep and

1967
01:36:24.880 --> 01:36:27.399
going down these rabbit holes. But I like coming away

1968
01:36:27.399 --> 01:36:28.680
from conversations where I'm.

1969
01:36:28.520 --> 01:36:29.760
Like, damn, I didn't look at it that way.

1970
01:36:30.319 --> 01:36:33.199
Or you might tell me something like you know earlier,

1971
01:36:33.199 --> 01:36:35.399
when you were just talking about the lady that ran

1972
01:36:35.479 --> 01:36:37.119
that discord, Now I now I got to go look

1973
01:36:37.119 --> 01:36:37.520
at who.

1974
01:36:37.479 --> 01:36:40.119
This person was, like things like that. But I do

1975
01:36:40.399 --> 01:36:41.000
like learning.

1976
01:36:41.039 --> 01:36:44.920
I like coming away with knowing that this conversation was

1977
01:36:44.960 --> 01:36:46.720
worth it because there was value in it, because we

1978
01:36:46.800 --> 01:36:50.600
both walked away with some insight that we didn't have before,

1979
01:36:51.199 --> 01:36:53.319
and that's what I like about this. And so even

1980
01:36:53.359 --> 01:36:56.279
on on what I do Royce like, I listened to

1981
01:36:56.640 --> 01:36:58.720
quite a bit of your podcast recently, knowing that you

1982
01:36:58.760 --> 01:36:59.920
were going to be coming on, so I wanted to

1983
01:37:00.039 --> 01:37:02.119
hear more where you're coming from. But even with me,

1984
01:37:02.159 --> 01:37:03.920
a lot of when I first started, a lot of

1985
01:37:04.000 --> 01:37:06.760
people had this thing where it's like, oh, he's the

1986
01:37:06.840 --> 01:37:10.880
Maga guy, He's the Trump Trumpster guy. And my guests

1987
01:37:10.960 --> 01:37:14.640
were never really like the conservative trumpters guys. I've had

1988
01:37:15.079 --> 01:37:18.039
most people that were on the liberal or democratic side.

1989
01:37:18.079 --> 01:37:18.199
You know.

1990
01:37:18.239 --> 01:37:20.880
I just talked to a psychologists who was a hardcore liberal.

1991
01:37:21.199 --> 01:37:23.800
He wanted to start a fight with me verbally in

1992
01:37:23.880 --> 01:37:25.720
a nice way. I didn't let it get that way,

1993
01:37:25.800 --> 01:37:28.399
and then we both ended up coming to understand that

1994
01:37:28.479 --> 01:37:31.000
we agree on more than we disagree. Because when you

1995
01:37:31.039 --> 01:37:32.880
take politics out of it and you just talk about

1996
01:37:32.960 --> 01:37:35.880
things that human beings need to deal with, you find

1997
01:37:35.920 --> 01:37:39.560
out that, damn, we're all pretty freaking similar.

1998
01:37:39.920 --> 01:37:43.000
We really are. Well, most people want the same things right.

1999
01:37:43.119 --> 01:37:46.399
They want mentally, they want to be viable, financially viable,

2000
01:37:46.479 --> 01:37:48.920
they want health, they want to leave this place in

2001
01:37:49.319 --> 01:37:52.000
a better condition. For their children and their children's children.

2002
01:37:52.239 --> 01:37:56.399
It's just how they choose to get there. Yeah, voices made, Yeah,

2003
01:37:56.960 --> 01:37:59.159
who but who I mean, show me somebody who doesn't

2004
01:37:59.199 --> 01:38:04.359
want those things. Everybody generally has the same desires. It's

2005
01:38:04.399 --> 01:38:06.119
how you get there. I have to tell you this

2006
01:38:06.199 --> 01:38:10.439
really quick because you're talking about all these all these

2007
01:38:10.479 --> 01:38:16.239
different folks and I so I'm doing the substack thing now,

2008
01:38:16.399 --> 01:38:18.439
you know. Like I said, I broke TikTok and I'm

2009
01:38:18.479 --> 01:38:21.359
building up substack and we've hit the Substack leaderboard thirty

2010
01:38:21.439 --> 01:38:25.159
five and Rising News whatever eighty three. Cool. It's not

2011
01:38:25.279 --> 01:38:27.359
based off of gifting and money. It's based off of

2012
01:38:27.479 --> 01:38:30.000
engagement and followers and all that. So it's nice. It's

2013
01:38:30.039 --> 01:38:33.560
a different proposition and I like it, and I'm trying

2014
01:38:33.600 --> 01:38:36.000
to get people on, but I don't want the same

2015
01:38:36.159 --> 01:38:41.119
five names, some of whom we've mentioned. So I find

2016
01:38:41.159 --> 01:38:44.279
this kid on the leaderboard okay, because I was like, oh,

2017
01:38:44.279 --> 01:38:46.560
this is the best place to go go with contemporaries.

2018
01:38:46.600 --> 01:38:49.359
They'll see that you're up there doing your thing and

2019
01:38:50.279 --> 01:38:54.800
young journalists. Okay, black kid. And I only say that

2020
01:38:55.000 --> 01:38:57.439
because it's like, like, I couldn't be more of an

2021
01:38:57.439 --> 01:39:01.119
ally buddy but okay, fine, so he's supposed to come

2022
01:39:01.199 --> 01:39:03.239
on the podcast. I send him the link like an

2023
01:39:03.279 --> 01:39:06.079
hour two hours before the show, and he goes, Royce,

2024
01:39:06.199 --> 01:39:08.840
I can no longer do your show. The way you

2025
01:39:08.920 --> 01:39:15.319
have characterized Trump's victories in your recent articles is absolutely abhorrent.

2026
01:39:16.119 --> 01:39:18.920
And I am a journalist, but I am also a

2027
01:39:19.039 --> 01:39:24.239
human being, and I wrote back, Trump's victories don't necessarily

2028
01:39:24.319 --> 01:39:28.720
correlate to victories for all American people, and he blocked me,

2029
01:39:29.720 --> 01:39:32.439
and I'm like, this is wild, Like this is a

2030
01:39:32.560 --> 01:39:35.560
very true statement you made. Though it's true, it's true

2031
01:39:35.640 --> 01:39:37.199
what I said or what he said, what you said.

2032
01:39:39.920 --> 01:39:41.279
I just I'm like, dude, I'm trying to have a

2033
01:39:41.319 --> 01:39:43.159
conversation with you. First of all, you're not a journalist.

2034
01:39:43.279 --> 01:39:45.479
None of us are. Okay, even the people who call

2035
01:39:45.520 --> 01:39:49.039
themselves a journalist on TV are not journalists. The commentators journalists,

2036
01:39:49.159 --> 01:39:52.880
they're talking heads. Man, probably are so, but this kid's

2037
01:39:52.920 --> 01:39:55.680
not a journalist. Number one and number two. Trump has

2038
01:39:55.720 --> 01:39:59.840
had a string of victories politically speaking, how how are

2039
01:39:59.880 --> 01:40:03.119
you if you can't admit that you could talk about

2040
01:40:03.159 --> 01:40:06.680
the negative effects of these victories, but politically he's had victories. Yeah,

2041
01:40:06.720 --> 01:40:09.800
if you can't admit that you're not objective, right.

2042
01:40:09.800 --> 01:40:13.039
I mean, you're not necessarily saying you need to like

2043
01:40:13.159 --> 01:40:15.079
this guy because of these victories. They may not be

2044
01:40:15.159 --> 01:40:18.279
the victories you want, but he did have them. I

2045
01:40:18.479 --> 01:40:22.600
wanted to hear what was of concern to this guy,

2046
01:40:24.159 --> 01:40:25.960
and that made me. I'm like, you know what, this

2047
01:40:26.119 --> 01:40:28.560
is the problem. You can't talk to and I'm an independent.

2048
01:40:29.000 --> 01:40:31.439
You can't talk to anybody on the left. They don't

2049
01:40:31.680 --> 01:40:32.840
it's their way or no way.

2050
01:40:33.119 --> 01:40:36.560
I've been fortunate enough to have some though, and I

2051
01:40:36.800 --> 01:40:39.000
don't I don't know what it is. I tend.

2052
01:40:39.479 --> 01:40:42.880
I tend to like in this conversation, you know where

2053
01:40:42.920 --> 01:40:44.159
we have a lot of back and forth, but there's

2054
01:40:44.159 --> 01:40:48.000
a lot of times where I let them talk. I

2055
01:40:48.079 --> 01:40:49.720
want them to reveal who they are so I can

2056
01:40:49.800 --> 01:40:51.920
understan where they're coming from before I form an opinion,

2057
01:40:52.000 --> 01:40:55.359
because you know, I could be very reaction, but it

2058
01:40:55.399 --> 01:40:58.439
could just go down the wrong road. I might be

2059
01:40:58.560 --> 01:41:02.119
creating a bad situation for me and my guests if

2060
01:41:02.199 --> 01:41:06.960
I just if he says, you know, listen, he says,

2061
01:41:07.039 --> 01:41:08.920
you know, fuck the Republicans this in this and you

2062
01:41:08.960 --> 01:41:11.319
guys are war hawks whatever. I don't even care about that,

2063
01:41:11.359 --> 01:41:14.279
but just saying then I could be re reactioning to like, hey,

2064
01:41:14.319 --> 01:41:16.920
screw you this whatever that gets us nowhere. Let me

2065
01:41:17.079 --> 01:41:19.239
let me let this person talk, let me let them

2066
01:41:19.279 --> 01:41:22.760
get it out, because the more you talk, the more

2067
01:41:22.800 --> 01:41:24.359
we're going to come to a place where we can

2068
01:41:24.439 --> 01:41:27.239
actually start having the conversation. And then now we're going

2069
01:41:27.319 --> 01:41:30.439
to find out that we both hate politics.

2070
01:41:30.960 --> 01:41:34.880
You know, there's nothing you said in this conversation that

2071
01:41:34.960 --> 01:41:37.399
I have disagreed with, And there's nothing you've said in

2072
01:41:37.479 --> 01:41:40.680
this conversation that makes me think you're maga or conservative.

2073
01:41:42.880 --> 01:41:47.920
Well that's the stereotype. But I'm just saying fair enough.

2074
01:41:47.960 --> 01:41:50.560
I appreciate I try to stay centrist.

2075
01:41:50.720 --> 01:41:52.760
I try to. There's times that I do.

2076
01:41:53.039 --> 01:41:54.520
I mean, I'll be honest, I do lean more right,

2077
01:41:54.600 --> 01:41:58.039
But I don't think either side is one hundred percent right.

2078
01:41:59.279 --> 01:42:02.560
They both have their problems. They're both fricking crazy. Let's

2079
01:42:02.560 --> 01:42:04.279
just be honest. Man, You get into the extreme sides

2080
01:42:04.319 --> 01:42:06.560
of both of them, is like, wow, where what world

2081
01:42:06.600 --> 01:42:07.319
do you guys live in?

2082
01:42:07.640 --> 01:42:08.600
Well that's the horseshoe.

2083
01:42:09.399 --> 01:42:14.279
Yes, yes, funny that was just brought up recently with

2084
01:42:14.439 --> 01:42:17.479
someone else else talking about talking about.

2085
01:42:17.279 --> 01:42:20.920
That so you know, I don't know where all this

2086
01:42:21.079 --> 01:42:21.319
is going.

2087
01:42:21.399 --> 01:42:23.960
I just know that what I see out there is

2088
01:42:24.199 --> 01:42:27.159
is a lot of frustrated individuals, including myself, because we

2089
01:42:27.279 --> 01:42:30.920
all want change, but it just doesn't seem that, you know,

2090
01:42:31.560 --> 01:42:33.199
as you said, or in the deep state, they don't

2091
01:42:33.199 --> 01:42:34.920
want to give up their position, they don't want to

2092
01:42:34.960 --> 01:42:38.479
give up what they're doing, and we're just always going

2093
01:42:38.560 --> 01:42:40.960
to be arguing over stuff out of our control. You know,

2094
01:42:41.159 --> 01:42:43.840
there's people who get so obsessed about it that they

2095
01:42:43.880 --> 01:42:45.880
get sick from it, just from the stress. You know,

2096
01:42:45.920 --> 01:42:48.640
they can't even get through their day without going on

2097
01:42:49.159 --> 01:42:51.800
X or you know, Blue Sky or whatever app they

2098
01:42:51.920 --> 01:42:56.039
choose to be on and just spewing whatever opinion they have.

2099
01:42:57.119 --> 01:43:00.199
And it's like, man, a perfect example of that for me.

2100
01:43:00.319 --> 01:43:03.119
By the way, I'm not gonna name names, but where

2101
01:43:03.199 --> 01:43:06.640
I live, and you know, I have frequently in the

2102
01:43:06.720 --> 01:43:09.560
Bay Area many times, especially for business. I went to

2103
01:43:09.640 --> 01:43:11.840
school out there in San Jose for some time. And

2104
01:43:12.640 --> 01:43:15.680
the reality is it's a whole different world. It's a

2105
01:43:15.720 --> 01:43:18.039
whole different world, and it got to the point where

2106
01:43:19.119 --> 01:43:22.680
it's so far left that if you say anything that

2107
01:43:22.880 --> 01:43:27.640
is outside of the group, think you're a Trumpster. It

2108
01:43:27.720 --> 01:43:29.520
got so bad that one day a friend of mine

2109
01:43:29.560 --> 01:43:31.279
saw me wearing a hat that just had an American

2110
01:43:31.399 --> 01:43:35.560
flag and they called me trumpy. I'm like, what does

2111
01:43:35.600 --> 01:43:37.960
the American flag have to do with Trump? It represents

2112
01:43:38.039 --> 01:43:40.880
the United States of America, you know, the country in

2113
01:43:40.960 --> 01:43:43.000
which you reside, the country on which you are a citizen,

2114
01:43:43.079 --> 01:43:47.319
the country in which you are benefiting from its protections

2115
01:43:47.359 --> 01:43:50.000
and a sovereignty. What does that have to do with Trump?

2116
01:43:50.920 --> 01:43:55.199
And that's where we have gotten And that's what I'm

2117
01:43:55.279 --> 01:43:57.840
concerned with, is that there's too many people living on

2118
01:43:57.880 --> 01:43:58.960
the surface of the headline.

2119
01:43:59.359 --> 01:44:00.439
They don't want to deeper.

2120
01:44:00.520 --> 01:44:03.239
They just believe whatever it is that their favorite morning

2121
01:44:03.319 --> 01:44:06.560
show is telling them and taking it for face value.

2122
01:44:06.600 --> 01:44:09.199
And it never It really wasn't that bad before people

2123
01:44:09.359 --> 01:44:12.920
were They used to think for themselves. And I don't

2124
01:44:12.920 --> 01:44:14.359
know if they're just so busy that they don't want

2125
01:44:14.359 --> 01:44:15.680
to take the time to do so anymore.

2126
01:44:16.399 --> 01:44:18.600
I don't think it's that they're busy. I think that

2127
01:44:18.760 --> 01:44:22.279
you know, there used to be a term second screen. Okay,

2128
01:44:22.279 --> 01:44:24.800
I haven't heard it see second screen? So yeah, second

2129
01:44:24.840 --> 01:44:27.319
screen was a term. You know, Oh, you're watching TV.

2130
01:44:27.560 --> 01:44:30.039
Have your iPad out that's your second screen. Oh okay,

2131
01:44:30.199 --> 01:44:32.600
got it? Okay, so second screen viewing and all this.

2132
01:44:33.359 --> 01:44:36.479
We are long past second screen. People have the news

2133
01:44:36.600 --> 01:44:39.359
on with music playing in the background, and they're scrolling

2134
01:44:39.439 --> 01:44:43.039
Twitter on their iPhone. So I think a lot of

2135
01:44:43.119 --> 01:44:47.479
it has to do with hyper consumption and the spread

2136
01:44:47.520 --> 01:44:51.359
of information too fast. So when you take social media

2137
01:44:52.479 --> 01:44:56.039
and you pair it with you know, a Steve Bannon

2138
01:44:56.079 --> 01:44:59.000
strategy like flooding the zone with shit right, it makes

2139
01:44:59.039 --> 01:45:02.439
it very very hard card to you know, the headline,

2140
01:45:02.520 --> 01:45:04.960
to your point, always gets the most noise. It makes

2141
01:45:05.000 --> 01:45:08.479
it very very hard to fact check anything because people

2142
01:45:08.520 --> 01:45:11.479
are already onto the next headline, and the fact check

2143
01:45:11.680 --> 01:45:15.479
never gets the level of engagement sure notice as the headline.

2144
01:45:16.199 --> 01:45:20.720
So it's oversaturation, gotcha. I mean that's just my opinion,

2145
01:45:20.960 --> 01:45:23.159
But I mean, you scroll, you scroll, you scroll, jump

2146
01:45:23.279 --> 01:45:25.600
to the next I disagree with you, because that's a tactic.

2147
01:45:25.680 --> 01:45:29.479
It's a real tactic that is used oversaturating. Look, how

2148
01:45:29.520 --> 01:45:30.760
are you going to keep people in control?

2149
01:45:31.079 --> 01:45:34.119
You overwhelm them. You overwhelm to the point.

2150
01:45:33.920 --> 01:45:36.319
That they don't know how to make heads details what's

2151
01:45:36.359 --> 01:45:39.479
going on. You keep them moving, you keep their attention

2152
01:45:40.079 --> 01:45:41.960
moving you guide them just like a horse of blinders.

2153
01:45:42.000 --> 01:45:44.720
That's exactly what they're doing. And it's the same thing

2154
01:45:44.800 --> 01:45:45.079
in war.

2155
01:45:46.520 --> 01:45:49.960
How do you your enemy, you know, through misinformation, disinformation

2156
01:45:50.600 --> 01:45:54.920
and getting the people to believe the narrative so that

2157
01:45:55.199 --> 01:45:58.399
they rise up and they oppose the ruling class. That's

2158
01:45:58.439 --> 01:46:03.439
what we're seeing in America right now. And I don't

2159
01:46:03.479 --> 01:46:05.439
know where it's gonna go. Look, I don't even want

2160
01:46:05.479 --> 01:46:08.920
to say that I'm enjoying the ride, because sure, we

2161
01:46:09.000 --> 01:46:12.800
get eyeballs from talking about this stuff, but I am

2162
01:46:12.880 --> 01:46:18.000
more concerned with the the sentiment of how people feel

2163
01:46:18.159 --> 01:46:22.039
in view things these days, and that it seems like

2164
01:46:22.159 --> 01:46:26.560
we've we've just lost the ability to reason, that the

2165
01:46:26.840 --> 01:46:30.880
ability to think logically has just I mean, it's just

2166
01:46:31.000 --> 01:46:31.960
gone out the window.

2167
01:46:32.159 --> 01:46:35.680
Unfortunately. Everything everything's emotional. I feel like America is just

2168
01:46:35.760 --> 01:46:40.319
a big ball of zombies, you know, just fire. Yeah,

2169
01:46:40.920 --> 01:46:44.640
and you got the perfect background, I mean you really

2170
01:46:44.640 --> 01:46:46.560
And I didn't say that because of that. It's just

2171
01:46:46.640 --> 01:46:48.760
the way I have always felt. It's a dumpster fire,

2172
01:46:48.880 --> 01:46:52.520
and you know it's not. And and party politics has

2173
01:46:52.600 --> 01:46:56.000
just been turned into a sport, so people wave their pennant,

2174
01:46:56.439 --> 01:46:59.079
but they don't think logically about what they're and that's

2175
01:46:59.119 --> 01:47:01.119
why you have this whole Epstein fisser to bring it

2176
01:47:01.199 --> 01:47:05.399
back to that, because uh, you know, look, the Republicans

2177
01:47:05.399 --> 01:47:08.239
have become the big tent party and everybody has their

2178
01:47:08.279 --> 01:47:11.079
wedge issue, and now what you have is a whole

2179
01:47:11.119 --> 01:47:15.119
bunch of people that feel betrayed. Okay, but what's going

2180
01:47:15.199 --> 01:47:16.560
to come out of this? They're going to go vote

2181
01:47:16.600 --> 01:47:18.680
Democrat next time, or they're going to stay home. No,

2182
01:47:18.920 --> 01:47:21.720
it's not like it's going to birth any movement. It's

2183
01:47:21.800 --> 01:47:24.079
just it's the same old It's this that's why they

2184
01:47:24.119 --> 01:47:26.520
call it political theater. It's the same old game.

2185
01:47:27.439 --> 01:47:33.479
It's exactly Yeah, it's exactly fear you're you're substack what

2186
01:47:34.359 --> 01:47:36.600
you mentioned a little bit, But so you got into

2187
01:47:36.600 --> 01:47:38.399
your substack because you kind of want to just change

2188
01:47:38.439 --> 01:47:39.399
the direction you were going.

2189
01:47:39.720 --> 01:47:42.319
What about what about that substack attracted you to it?

2190
01:47:43.079 --> 01:47:43.199
Was it?

2191
01:47:43.439 --> 01:47:45.760
Was it the community involvement in general or was there

2192
01:47:45.840 --> 01:47:47.840
something else, some other vibe about it that you really

2193
01:47:47.880 --> 01:47:48.279
were into?

2194
01:47:49.000 --> 01:47:53.720
It was it was literally the mechanics. So I have,

2195
01:47:54.119 --> 01:47:55.960
as I told you, I've been doing TikTok lives over

2196
01:47:56.000 --> 01:48:01.560
the years, and my TikTok handle is this theme. I'm

2197
01:48:01.600 --> 01:48:03.319
not even looking to plug it, so I'm not going to.

2198
01:48:03.720 --> 01:48:07.199
But it's it's Disney theme, okay, so I don't. I don't.

2199
01:48:07.319 --> 01:48:09.399
You can put it in the metadata, so I don't.

2200
01:48:09.479 --> 01:48:13.159
Even in the early days, I didn't even want to

2201
01:48:13.159 --> 01:48:16.840
break that, right. I wouldn't even if I was doing

2202
01:48:16.960 --> 01:48:18.800
like a live radio show, I'd go do it on

2203
01:48:18.880 --> 01:48:21.880
my Instagram, you know, and I would take callers and

2204
01:48:22.000 --> 01:48:24.079
a virtual phone bank. So I was always trying to

2205
01:48:24.199 --> 01:48:25.960
do these things, but I was trying to do them

2206
01:48:26.359 --> 01:48:30.399
wherever I could. I did a word press blog and

2207
01:48:30.560 --> 01:48:32.800
was trying to get that going. I built up the

2208
01:48:32.920 --> 01:48:34.920
discord and was trying to make that. I thought that

2209
01:48:34.960 --> 01:48:38.760
would be more message board than it really was. So

2210
01:48:39.279 --> 01:48:43.079
when I discovered that Substack was my blog and I

2211
01:48:43.119 --> 01:48:45.760
had a newsletter, a monthly newsletter, was became a pain

2212
01:48:45.840 --> 01:48:47.399
in the ass. Somebody said, hey, we'll do a newsletter.

2213
01:48:47.439 --> 01:48:49.840
We'll help you, and then here I am every month

2214
01:48:50.079 --> 01:48:52.359
trying to stream do a newsletter. It was too much.

2215
01:48:53.079 --> 01:48:59.520
So Substack became obviously my podcast is everywhere, but Substack

2216
01:48:59.600 --> 01:49:03.800
became a podcast, hosts a newsletter, a blog, and it

2217
01:49:03.840 --> 01:49:05.880
took care of the discord, being able to have a

2218
01:49:05.960 --> 01:49:08.119
chat thread and all these things. So it just became

2219
01:49:08.199 --> 01:49:12.119
a one stop shop for everything. So it was literally

2220
01:49:12.199 --> 01:49:15.479
the mechanics that makes a lot of sense. I never

2221
01:49:15.560 --> 01:49:16.119
got into it.

2222
01:49:16.560 --> 01:49:19.960
And honestly, you know, it's like you said earlier, you

2223
01:49:20.039 --> 01:49:22.199
can get very overwhelmed doing this, Like you have to

2224
01:49:22.239 --> 01:49:25.720
pay attention to all this different medium and you got

2225
01:49:25.800 --> 01:49:27.199
to see on top of it, and I just barely

2226
01:49:27.239 --> 01:49:27.680
keep up.

2227
01:49:27.560 --> 01:49:30.239
With what I'm doing now. Same so when you're telling

2228
01:49:30.239 --> 01:49:31.319
me your story, I'm like, I don't even know how

2229
01:49:31.319 --> 01:49:33.159
you're able to keep up with all of it. Oh,

2230
01:49:33.159 --> 01:49:35.239
I'm pretty the whole kids series. At the same time,

2231
01:49:35.319 --> 01:49:37.439
I'm relaunching my YouTube and next year or at the

2232
01:49:37.520 --> 01:49:40.840
end year. It's crazy, man, I just readid you by YouTube?

2233
01:49:40.960 --> 01:49:45.520
I destroyed it and just started relaunching it and focusing

2234
01:49:45.560 --> 01:49:47.880
on video for the specific for that side of it.

2235
01:49:48.720 --> 01:49:52.479
So yeah, definitely, I mean video editing. I never thought

2236
01:49:52.520 --> 01:49:53.760
would be a video editing guy. I was always a

2237
01:49:53.840 --> 01:49:57.760
sound engineer, right, and then I got into video because

2238
01:49:57.840 --> 01:49:59.760
doing events also, and everybody wanted a live stream. And

2239
01:49:59.800 --> 01:50:01.840
now I'm doing imag for concerts and we're doing all

2240
01:50:01.840 --> 01:50:04.279
this stuff. And it's just a natural progression. Now, Henry,

2241
01:50:04.279 --> 01:50:08.399
I'm spending hours and in front of the damn software

2242
01:50:08.600 --> 01:50:09.439
just doing his waves.

2243
01:50:09.479 --> 01:50:12.439
Man, you gotta streamline your workflow. Oh, I'll believe me.

2244
01:50:12.520 --> 01:50:14.720
It's streamline. Maybe I'm just too picky. I don't know.

2245
01:50:15.079 --> 01:50:17.039
You might be, but but but I only say that

2246
01:50:17.079 --> 01:50:21.159
from experience, because no understood. The last four months, five

2247
01:50:21.239 --> 01:50:24.760
months have been I feel like I've I've had a

2248
01:50:25.039 --> 01:50:29.760
master class in assistive AI, and I have figured out

2249
01:50:29.840 --> 01:50:32.720
how to use AI not to do the work, but

2250
01:50:32.880 --> 01:50:34.880
to make it easier so I don't have to do

2251
01:50:35.439 --> 01:50:37.960
the heavy lifting, so I can do like twenty. I

2252
01:50:38.000 --> 01:50:39.960
think I heard somebody said, like, oh, like ten eighty

2253
01:50:40.039 --> 01:50:43.079
ten or whatever. Everybody's got a bullshit phrase, But basically

2254
01:50:43.600 --> 01:50:46.359
I can have a eighty twenty at whatever it was, like,

2255
01:50:46.399 --> 01:50:48.319
ten eighty ten, whatever. I don't know. It might not

2256
01:50:48.439 --> 01:50:50.199
even even added to one hundred. They might have gone

2257
01:50:50.279 --> 01:50:53.399
over budget quite frankly. But it's just one of those

2258
01:50:53.439 --> 01:50:57.800
things where you're like, oh, there's a way that I

2259
01:50:57.920 --> 01:50:59.840
can do all Like when we do when you come

2260
01:50:59.840 --> 01:51:04.399
on my podcast, we'll use software called Riverside. Yeah, I'm familiar, Yeah,

2261
01:51:04.640 --> 01:51:06.640
and I love it because by the time we're done,

2262
01:51:07.479 --> 01:51:10.000
I've got my transcripts, I've got my clips, I've got

2263
01:51:10.039 --> 01:51:12.640
everything I need. Now I might not use it all,

2264
01:51:13.000 --> 01:51:16.039
but I've got options at my fingertips. And i haven't

2265
01:51:16.079 --> 01:51:21.199
even I haven't even finished talking. So that's the kind

2266
01:51:21.199 --> 01:51:23.359
of stuff that then buys me time to go. You

2267
01:51:23.439 --> 01:51:25.840
know what, it's time to relaunch my YouTube because now

2268
01:51:25.880 --> 01:51:26.840
I have the bandwidth.

2269
01:51:27.439 --> 01:51:31.680
You know, technology is advancing in a way that yes

2270
01:51:31.800 --> 01:51:32.319
or our benefits.

2271
01:51:32.359 --> 01:51:32.479
You know.

2272
01:51:32.520 --> 01:51:34.680
My issue is is every time I've tried to use

2273
01:51:35.399 --> 01:51:37.520
I was an early adopter of Riverside, and I can

2274
01:51:37.600 --> 01:51:40.680
never get it to work consistently and correctly. Where I

2275
01:51:40.720 --> 01:51:44.000
got so frustrated I just stopped using it. Interesting and

2276
01:51:44.079 --> 01:51:47.119
I know they got better. I've tried it recently, No,

2277
01:51:47.239 --> 01:51:51.039
I couldn't say recently. A few months back I had

2278
01:51:51.079 --> 01:51:52.359
a guess where I was going to try to use it,

2279
01:51:52.880 --> 01:51:55.159
and same frustrations.

2280
01:51:55.159 --> 01:51:55.920
I just had to go back.

2281
01:51:55.960 --> 01:51:57.479
I think I just want too much control, you know.

2282
01:51:57.520 --> 01:51:59.960
I like to go back and multi track the audio.

2283
01:52:00.000 --> 01:52:01.359
I want to have more control of the audio. I

2284
01:52:01.399 --> 01:52:03.520
want the individual feeds, like.

2285
01:52:04.000 --> 01:52:06.159
Maybe it's just me. I mean, it's just me. Yeah,

2286
01:52:06.199 --> 01:52:08.079
But there's I mean, look not to push AI, but

2287
01:52:08.119 --> 01:52:11.199
I mean AI can take stems out of an MP three. Yeahs.

2288
01:52:11.720 --> 01:52:13.479
So you get to this point where I'm like, and

2289
01:52:13.600 --> 01:52:16.199
it's for people love to resist this stuff. I love

2290
01:52:16.279 --> 01:52:18.399
to be on the as close to the front of

2291
01:52:18.520 --> 01:52:22.039
these things as possible. I always find myself finding the

2292
01:52:22.119 --> 01:52:25.479
next thing when when whatever I'm doing starts to hit

2293
01:52:25.560 --> 01:52:27.520
mass adoption, I'm onto the next. Yeah.

2294
01:52:27.520 --> 01:52:29.920
I believe in using it as well, Royce. I just

2295
01:52:30.039 --> 01:52:31.239
I guess I'm control freak.

2296
01:52:31.359 --> 01:52:31.479
You know.

2297
01:52:31.800 --> 01:52:33.840
When it comes to my shorts, I absolutely use AI.

2298
01:52:33.880 --> 01:52:35.600
I mean, I use a program that just doesn't I'm

2299
01:52:35.640 --> 01:52:38.359
not sitting there. I'm not sitting there and doing I'm

2300
01:52:38.399 --> 01:52:40.520
letting it do it for me. I'm going back and

2301
01:52:40.560 --> 01:52:42.199
I might make an edit here or there, but other

2302
01:52:42.279 --> 01:52:44.039
than that, I'm letting the software do it for me.

2303
01:52:44.039 --> 01:52:45.119
I don't have time to do all that.

2304
01:52:45.359 --> 01:52:47.239
I get it, man, I mean, I look, it took

2305
01:52:47.319 --> 01:52:49.520
me so long to learn how to edit video on

2306
01:52:49.600 --> 01:52:52.680
my cell phone, like to jump from Premiere to but

2307
01:52:52.760 --> 01:52:55.039
this is years ago, to jump from Premiere to my

2308
01:52:55.159 --> 01:52:58.239
cell phone, and at a certain point it became so

2309
01:52:58.520 --> 01:53:01.199
clunky to try to take stuff off my phone and

2310
01:53:01.279 --> 01:53:03.960
put it in premiere. I was like, stop being stubborn,

2311
01:53:04.960 --> 01:53:07.880
and now I can edit. I can edit on two

2312
01:53:07.920 --> 01:53:12.640
cell phones simultaneously. Yeah. Yeah, that's a bad day if

2313
01:53:12.640 --> 01:53:13.119
I'm doing that.

2314
01:53:13.359 --> 01:53:15.119
I tried to do a self phon thing. I got

2315
01:53:15.159 --> 01:53:17.000
the I got the big you know thumb thing. I

2316
01:53:18.159 --> 01:53:19.960
I can't do it. I got I gotta I gotta

2317
01:53:19.960 --> 01:53:21.640
get in front of my in front of my PC

2318
01:53:21.800 --> 01:53:23.800
or whatever it is, and you know, have everything laid

2319
01:53:23.840 --> 01:53:25.520
out in front. I guess I'm just too old school.

2320
01:53:25.560 --> 01:53:28.760
I don't know how old are you? Forty seven? All right,

2321
01:53:29.000 --> 01:53:31.520
I just turned forty four, so we're we're the same ballpark.

2322
01:53:31.560 --> 01:53:36.399
But I look, most of my my contemporaries don't touch

2323
01:53:36.520 --> 01:53:38.279
the stuff. They're everybody's.

2324
01:53:38.439 --> 01:53:42.359
It's still very very young, it's very very new, and

2325
01:53:42.760 --> 01:53:45.119
I find it to be very exciting as a creator

2326
01:53:45.239 --> 01:53:50.119
because it's giving me time to focus on more important things. Yeah,

2327
01:53:50.239 --> 01:53:51.439
I mean, time management is the thing.

2328
01:53:51.479 --> 01:53:55.000
Your time is valuable, so agreed, you know, and maybe

2329
01:53:55.000 --> 01:53:57.039
I should look into more of that stuff. And that's

2330
01:53:57.039 --> 01:54:00.119
also a good lesson for anybody who's getting into the

2331
01:54:00.159 --> 01:54:02.279
space that you know, hey, take advantage of the technology

2332
01:54:02.319 --> 01:54:04.399
out there. We'll give you more time.

2333
01:54:04.439 --> 01:54:06.000
Don't let it do all the work, but let it

2334
01:54:06.079 --> 01:54:07.560
do some of the heavy lifting so you don't have to.

2335
01:54:07.840 --> 01:54:09.520
I got to look into the substack thing. I've always

2336
01:54:09.520 --> 01:54:12.359
I've always heard. I've just never dove into it, and

2337
01:54:12.399 --> 01:54:15.239
it's mostly a time thing for me. But yeah, you know,

2338
01:54:15.720 --> 01:54:17.119
I've been going through some of your stuff and it's

2339
01:54:17.119 --> 01:54:19.680
pretty good. I mean, you're very active, and uh, it's

2340
01:54:19.720 --> 01:54:21.720
really cool what you're doing, man, it really is. It's

2341
01:54:21.760 --> 01:54:23.560
almost like you're, like you said earlier, from what I

2342
01:54:23.600 --> 01:54:26.239
can tell, you're just reinventing yourself to it to a degree,

2343
01:54:26.279 --> 01:54:26.960
Do you feel that way?

2344
01:54:28.880 --> 01:54:31.760
I think, you know, reinvention Maybe not so much. I

2345
01:54:31.800 --> 01:54:34.640
think I'm peeling back some layers that I buried. I

2346
01:54:35.039 --> 01:54:37.600
I was involved in a lot of this political stuff

2347
01:54:37.680 --> 01:54:40.079
early on. I don't know if you if you saw

2348
01:54:40.159 --> 01:54:41.840
the art, like if you know anything about the Trump

2349
01:54:41.920 --> 01:54:44.680
call and all that, No, I heard you talk about it.

2350
01:54:44.760 --> 01:54:48.720
I wasn't really sure about what that was. Well so

2351
01:54:49.039 --> 01:54:50.760
so so I'll answer your question and then I can

2352
01:54:50.800 --> 01:54:53.000
give you the quick summation on that. But sure, it's

2353
01:54:53.039 --> 01:54:55.800
not that it's a reinvention. But I feel like I'm

2354
01:54:55.880 --> 01:54:58.079
going back to the things that I used to do

2355
01:54:58.399 --> 01:55:01.880
and getting to show all of my myself. So I've

2356
01:55:02.119 --> 01:55:03.920
gotten rid of the people that just wanted me to

2357
01:55:03.960 --> 01:55:07.159
take them to Disney every day. Oh and I call

2358
01:55:07.239 --> 01:55:10.880
that like a Disney daycare. And now I've got the

2359
01:55:10.920 --> 01:55:12.840
people that, yeah, we really love it when you take

2360
01:55:12.960 --> 01:55:15.039
us there, but we also want to hear about your

2361
01:55:15.079 --> 01:55:18.600
other thoughts. So I've been able to kind of pull

2362
01:55:18.760 --> 01:55:21.479
back in some stuff. So I would say it's more like,

2363
01:55:23.640 --> 01:55:25.600
maybe I'm just being semantical now and it's just my

2364
01:55:25.680 --> 01:55:27.720
own desire to control the narrative. But I feel like

2365
01:55:27.760 --> 01:55:32.239
I'm shedding skin. If anything. I don't think it's a reinvention,

2366
01:55:32.439 --> 01:55:35.640
because that would imply that I'm doing something I've never done,

2367
01:55:35.760 --> 01:55:38.960
or it's new territory, and it's not new territory, you know.

2368
01:55:39.800 --> 01:55:41.399
So and I can tell you the Trump story if

2369
01:55:41.399 --> 01:55:46.439
you want to hear it real quick. Sure. So I

2370
01:55:47.840 --> 01:55:51.159
let's see, I'm running an arcade business in Los Angeles,

2371
01:55:51.960 --> 01:55:56.239
and somewhere along the line, I start branching out into

2372
01:55:56.239 --> 01:55:58.359
doing content because content has always been a part of

2373
01:55:58.399 --> 01:56:02.840
the thing. And I'm producing a podcast for Stuttering John

2374
01:56:03.399 --> 01:56:10.359
from The Stern Show. Tonight's show former announcer, and he says, Oh,

2375
01:56:10.439 --> 01:56:13.039
We're gonna have Casey Armstrong on the show today, and

2376
01:56:13.119 --> 01:56:15.359
Casey Armstrong was a guy from The Stern Show back

2377
01:56:15.399 --> 01:56:19.920
in the day. And Casey turns down at the last minute.

2378
01:56:19.920 --> 01:56:22.760
I'm too busy and John didn't have anything to do,

2379
01:56:23.520 --> 01:56:24.560
and I go, you know what you should do is

2380
01:56:24.560 --> 01:56:26.439
you should call the White House because Trump had just

2381
01:56:26.520 --> 01:56:29.760
gotten into office. I guarantee you can get through because

2382
01:56:29.760 --> 01:56:32.680
a few weeks earlier, I was just po driving around

2383
01:56:32.720 --> 01:56:35.079
and I got through to the White House and Hope

2384
01:56:35.119 --> 01:56:37.359
Hicks called me back and I was like, oh shit,

2385
01:56:37.520 --> 01:56:43.000
I think I'll hang up now, and so he goes,

2386
01:56:43.079 --> 01:56:46.039
oh okay. He goes, well, I used to party with Trump.

2387
01:56:46.119 --> 01:56:48.039
I used to go on the helicopter with him to

2388
01:56:48.520 --> 01:56:51.680
AC So he picks up the phone and this is

2389
01:56:51.720 --> 01:56:56.319
on his podcast, this is first term, and he goes, Hi,

2390
01:56:56.520 --> 01:57:00.840
John Melendez. Click, they hang up, calls again. He goes,

2391
01:57:00.880 --> 01:57:03.600
John Melendez, I used to hang out with Donald click,

2392
01:57:04.319 --> 01:57:06.560
and I go, you gotta go my cousin Vinnie. You

2393
01:57:06.640 --> 01:57:12.119
ever see my cousin Vinnie, not Melendez? Say Menendez, you know,

2394
01:57:12.319 --> 01:57:16.079
not Jerry Callo, Jerry Gallo. I don't realize as I'm

2395
01:57:16.239 --> 01:57:20.720
saying this, that corrupt senator from New Jersey, Bob Menendez,

2396
01:57:20.760 --> 01:57:23.800
a Democrat, has ties to the Kushners and the Trumps.

2397
01:57:23.960 --> 01:57:30.239
I just said it for the joke. Okay, Hi, White House,

2398
01:57:30.279 --> 01:57:34.399
because mind you were calling the main switchboard, White House. Hi,

2399
01:57:34.680 --> 01:57:37.920
this is a calling from Senator Bob Menendez's office. Oh

2400
01:57:38.000 --> 01:57:42.960
hold on one second, please, right. So then, and John

2401
01:57:43.119 --> 01:57:46.359
is doing like the worst fucking British accent you've ever heard,

2402
01:57:46.760 --> 01:57:50.239
and he says his name is like it was like

2403
01:57:50.520 --> 01:57:53.319
his name was like uh like it was like an

2404
01:57:53.319 --> 01:57:57.720
amalgamation of like Bond names. It was like Sean, like

2405
01:57:58.399 --> 01:57:59.920
I don't even remember what it was. It was like

2406
01:58:00.079 --> 01:58:03.800
Sean Moore or something like that. And he goes, uh, yeah,

2407
01:58:03.960 --> 01:58:05.560
my name is Sean Moore and my parents were big

2408
01:58:05.640 --> 01:58:08.680
Bond fans, and like this is all getting through, and

2409
01:58:08.760 --> 01:58:11.199
the woman's like, well, listen, we just have one question.

2410
01:58:12.039 --> 01:58:15.039
If you're calling from Senator Bob Menendez's office, why do

2411
01:58:15.159 --> 01:58:17.800
you have an eight one to eight area code from California?

2412
01:58:18.560 --> 01:58:21.279
And he goes, oh, well on holiday in like the

2413
01:58:21.399 --> 01:58:24.840
worst accent, and they're like, oh, that makes sense. So

2414
01:58:25.039 --> 01:58:27.760
the next thing you know, they're like, we'll call you back.

2415
01:58:27.880 --> 01:58:29.760
We wrap up the podcast and we're like, fuck, that

2416
01:58:29.920 --> 01:58:32.359
was close. We're done. And I get a call that

2417
01:58:32.520 --> 01:58:34.079
night and he goes, I just got off the phone

2418
01:58:34.079 --> 01:58:37.760
with Donald Trump. I go, what? He goes. Jared Kushner

2419
01:58:37.840 --> 01:58:39.560
called me I was on a date with some girl.

2420
01:58:39.640 --> 01:58:41.880
I go, I gotta go. They were at a restaurant.

2421
01:58:41.880 --> 01:58:44.079
He goes, I gotta go outside. The President's calling. I go,

2422
01:58:44.479 --> 01:58:46.600
you must you had to have gotten laid right, because

2423
01:58:46.680 --> 01:58:49.119
like that's the ultimate Like I don't think he did,

2424
01:58:49.199 --> 01:58:53.079
which is a whole other commentary on him. But so

2425
01:58:54.039 --> 01:58:57.520
I get this voicemail like this this this MP three

2426
01:58:57.680 --> 01:59:00.079
texted to me because his buddy recorded the call a

2427
01:59:00.239 --> 01:59:04.640
third party. I spend two days trying to get this

2428
01:59:04.720 --> 01:59:08.520
out into the media. I finally Politico picked it up,

2429
01:59:09.000 --> 01:59:12.319
and it was a whirlwind, but it was I basic.

2430
01:59:12.439 --> 01:59:16.680
I produced that call on Air Force one, so so

2431
01:59:17.279 --> 01:59:20.399
so so reinvention, not so much dipping my toe back

2432
01:59:20.439 --> 01:59:24.239
in the water. Maybe that's that's I like that story.

2433
01:59:24.800 --> 01:59:26.399
It's a fun story, man. I try to tell it

2434
01:59:26.439 --> 01:59:27.319
as quick as possible.

2435
01:59:27.680 --> 01:59:30.199
That is well, Royce, I don't hold you up anymore

2436
01:59:30.680 --> 01:59:32.680
because you're in a you're in a completely different time zone,

2437
01:59:32.680 --> 01:59:36.319
but not man, joining this. I I like this conversation

2438
01:59:36.760 --> 01:59:40.319
and I'm looking forward to joining you on your podcast

2439
01:59:40.600 --> 01:59:44.079
down the road here. So with that being said, Man,

2440
01:59:44.079 --> 01:59:45.600
if you don't mind, I want to wrap this up,

2441
01:59:47.079 --> 01:59:50.520
get on with my evening over here, and uh again,

2442
01:59:50.600 --> 01:59:51.359
appreciate your time.

2443
01:59:51.439 --> 01:59:54.119
I really do. Thank you for coming on. I really do,

2444
01:59:54.720 --> 01:59:55.560
and thank you.

2445
01:59:55.880 --> 01:59:58.720
I hope everything you do moving forward is just a success.

2446
01:59:58.760 --> 02:00:00.760
And I know that doesn't always mean for all of us.

2447
02:00:00.840 --> 02:00:01.159
It's just.

2448
02:00:02.840 --> 02:00:04.319
Keep at it, man. I mean, you've been doing this

2449
02:00:04.439 --> 02:00:06.840
a while and I like what you're doing. It's great,

2450
02:00:07.199 --> 02:00:09.199
it really is. I like your attitude. Man, you always

2451
02:00:09.239 --> 02:00:10.600
coming at it with a little bit of humor, and

2452
02:00:10.600 --> 02:00:13.279
it's like you're just very engaging. And it was a great,

2453
02:00:13.720 --> 02:00:16.159
great conversation, great experience, man, appreciate it.

2454
02:00:16.359 --> 02:00:17.800
Thank you for having me on. I look forward to

2455
02:00:17.800 --> 02:00:21.039
having you on my show. And honestly, I don't do

2456
02:00:21.119 --> 02:00:23.880
a lot of this, but it's it's really nice to

2457
02:00:23.920 --> 02:00:26.439
have these kind of conversations and to hear how other

2458
02:00:26.479 --> 02:00:28.479
people are thinking and to be reminded that at the

2459
02:00:28.560 --> 02:00:29.960
end of the day, we all want the same stuff,

2460
02:00:30.199 --> 02:00:31.840
absolutely for and be honest.

2461
02:00:31.880 --> 02:00:33.399
Down the road, I'll probably have you on again if

2462
02:00:33.439 --> 02:00:34.000
you're open.

2463
02:00:33.880 --> 02:00:37.079
So any time, man, I really enjoyed this, I really did.

2464
02:00:37.199 --> 02:00:38.680
And I don't know how long we've done here. I

2465
02:00:38.760 --> 02:00:41.520
have no concept of time right now. I don't know.

2466
02:00:41.800 --> 02:00:44.680
Let me look down. I think we're about yeah, just

2467
02:00:44.760 --> 02:00:48.760
over two hours. Okay, I found about two hours. But

2468
02:00:48.920 --> 02:00:51.840
it no, no, it's not a bad thing. No no, no,

2469
02:00:52.079 --> 02:00:55.800
it's not. Thank you, thank you. I'm gonna go ahead

2470
02:00:55.800 --> 02:01:08.159
and grab this up, sir, take your content of your field. Attention, devils,

2471
02:01:08.359 --> 02:01:16.239
high high temption, high stairs on my get do do

2472
02:01:16.960 --> 02:01:23.000
do do do do do do do do do
Royce D'Orazio Profile Photo
Royce D'Orazio

Opinionated Independent, Podcast Host

Royce D’Orazio is a media producer, former radio personality, and content creator with a background spanning broadcast TV, FM radio, and independent production. Known for his bold takes and no-holds-barred interviews, D’Orazio is emerging as a powerful independent voice in the new era of media—one not afraid to challenge narratives or speak the unfiltered truth.

He is a veteran of TV, radio, and production, brings a dynamic and fearless voice to the mic—one shaped by decades behind the scenes in media and an unrelenting curiosity about what makes culture tick. On Under the Influence, nothing is off-limits. From deep dives into politics and pop culture to critiques of corporate media and even hot takes on Disney, Royce takes listeners into the stories people are afraid to tell—and the truths they’re desperate to hear.