Evan Longin - Author | Psychology | Speaker

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Tay my osiy like you just let me in my way.

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Welcome world to Blaze listeners and now watchers. As promised,

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I am doing video episodes, and as I stated previously,

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for those who do listen to my audio only episodes,

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I am primarily focusing on guest episodes and where those

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will be video because I just believe it's better to

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be able to see people's reactions for better context. You

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can see people's faces, et cetera. Welcome to Episode eighty

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and on today's episode, I have guest Evan Longen. Evan

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Longen is a psychologist of forty five years. He used

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to have his private practice. He also taught psycho therapy

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and he's a published author. He wrote the book The

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Root of Evil, and in that book he discusses how

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it is possible that evil can creep into society without

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us even knowing it. And of course this discussion definitely

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goes in the direction of Trump. We discuss Trump as

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many consider him to be evil or hitler or a dictator,

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and so that discussion has had But then we shift

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from domestic politics and talk about conflicts abroad. We talk

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about Israel, Gaza, and of course we discuss Russia and Ukraine.

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I really do hope you enjoy this episode. Evan's a

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very intelligent person, and this is a great episode to

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watch because in this episode you see that two people

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that don't necessarily agree. I'm not a democrat of the

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left and Devan is definitely not of the right, but

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we were still able to come together, have a discussion

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and even offer solutions that work, I mean, just makes

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sense for everybody, for humans living on the planet in

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a way that we can coexist in respec back to

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each other. So, without further ado, here is Evan Longan.

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So thank you for taking the time and coming onto

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the show. And as we just discussed earlier before I

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press record appropriate, giving what's going on in California, before

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we move on, I want to go ahead, and I

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mean the background that I see here on you had

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You were a psychologists before the private practice. Is this true? Yes? Okay?

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And you taught psychotherapy for over forty five years or

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so is that correct?

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Yes?

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Okay, awesome? And then you became an author that book

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The Root of Evil? And was that released in twenty

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twenty two or twenty twenty three.

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Twenty twenty At the end of twenty twenty two.

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So right on that cusp of transitioning into twenty three. Yes,

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and you're known for that. You sold a few copies

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for sure, and you do discuss it and the subjects

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in here. Now, I'm a politics and geopolitics show, but

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I do like to venture onto other areas.

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Yeah.

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That being said, I think a lot of what you

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wrote in what you study is very appropriate to what's

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going on today. I did want to ask you, though,

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before we dive into that. Excuse me while I turn

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this up, that that you mentioned something I'm reading here,

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you your bio about how psychotherapy I believe, if I'm

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getting this correct, can fail society or it can lead Yes, okay.

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Yeah, Yeah, That's how I got interested in this whole

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idea of the breakdown of institutions and the breakdown of

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the body politic because in my own field we failed

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people frequently.

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Okay.

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I originally was a fellow at the Nathan Ackerman Family Institute,

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where I studied post doc and family therapy, and one

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of the things we noted back then was that the

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person who's the identified patient may in fact be the

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person who is most likely to bring new perspective to

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the family, and over and over again in my career,

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I was given very difficult cases that were not responding

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to treatment, and they found that they weren't responding to

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treatment because they were treating the wrong person. That the

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person that was the hospitalized or identified patient was not

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the problem. And I have a case that I talk

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about in my book that's the simplest one to understand.

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I get a call from a mother who tells me

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that her doctor, her pediatrician, had referred her family to

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me that her son had just been excluded from school

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after he went back to school and knocked out all

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the windows on the first floor of the school. This

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is an eight year old boy. So I said to

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the mother, well, okay, I'm more than happy to see you.

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I want to see you tomorrow with your whole family

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and with the boy and we'll all talk about what's

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going on. And the first thing she says to me, no, no, no, no, no,

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you don't get it. My son is the problem. We

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don't need to come in. And I said, ah, well,

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you have to humor me, because this is how I work.

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I like to see a family together, get a feel

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for what the dynamics are that are going on in

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the family, and if you want to bring your son in,

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I'm more than happy to see you. She said, well,

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I'm not coming in. I said, well, listen, then go

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back to your pediatrician and get a referral to someone else.

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She said, well, the doctor said you're the best around.

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I said, well, thank you, So if you want my help,

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come in. So the next day she arrives her husband

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and herself and her son, but she didn't bring her daughter.

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And I said to her, where's your daughter? And she said,

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my daughter's not a problem. My son's the problem, and

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you've got to fix him. Well you see where this

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is going obviously, absolutely yea. So they all come into

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the office, the three of them, and I say to

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this son, would you do me a favor, Take your

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chair and bring it up next to me. I want

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you to be my assistant therapist. And he goes really,

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and I said, yeah, I'd like you to help me.

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And the mother goes, when is this What are you doing?

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You're rewarding him for being a bad kid. I said, no,

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I'm getting him to participate and to feel safe and

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to join me in exploring what's going on in the family. Well,

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to make a long story short. Ultimately she's about to

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leave when the father says, I can't take it anymore.

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My wife was out cold on the floor when he

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came home from school. She's drunk, she's out of control,

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and he, in his own way, went looking for help.

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I said, Wow, that's really impressive. Dead. So I've seen

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so much of that. I've seen where it's so easy

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to look at a situation and blame that person, and

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so often if that kid had been treated in a

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more traditional setting, he would have been in therapy forever

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with no progress.

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Well because the mother would to mask her own actions

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and her own behavior. Yes, it's effective family units.

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So those are the kinds of situations that's as blatant

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one as I can can share. One of the we

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worked with a team. We would have a team of

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people who sat in the room with me, and the

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family would sit with other members of my team being interviewed,

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and then the family would we would talk amongst ourselves

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about the things we heard. In this one instance, a

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young man who had been in McLean's Hospitals, a famous

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say chiatric facility, and had been removed because he wasn't

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making progress, sat with us on our team, and the

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mother and the father and the sister were talking on

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the other side of the room, and after they finished talking,

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he looked at us and he said, holy cow, is

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it possible that I did the things I did because

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I knew my mother was so depressed and I needed

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to do it to help the family? Is that? And

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this came spontaneously from this twelve year old boy. So again,

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over and over and over, I have been called into

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difficult situations that don't get better because that's treating the

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wrong situation, the wrong problem, right, That's how I got

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into this.

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Yeah, that's common in the medical industry in general. I mean, yes, yeah,

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that's unfortunate. So with that that being said, is that

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that is how why you got into doing what you're

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doing and why you chose to get on the path

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of researching. And in your book you do give you

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your opinions on how evil can easily sneak into society.

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Now does this tie into that? Do you think?

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Yeah? Again, what I started to see in situations in

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the families that work with. And by the way, I

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also back back around nineteen twenty ten that era. For

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five years I was in the Middle East, working with

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Palestinian and Israeli children, bringing them together to talk with

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each other and to learn about each other and to collaborate.

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So my experience went from being a psychotherapist to working

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in issues in the community. But what I saw over

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and over again was one binary thinking us versus them

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in the case of the Middle East, Israelis versus Palestinians.

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In today's California, the weight majority versus minority immigrants, they're

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seen as different, they're seen as other. The second thing

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is power over behavior, where the psychiatrist or the teacher

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or the politician uses power to control situations that should

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come about in a more collaborative discussion between people. The

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third piece is the control of information. Today, today a

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blatant thing happened. I don't know if you saw. Senator

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Padilla was tackled when he was trying to ask questions

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of the Secretary of Homeland Security.

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I did not see that today. Yet he was.

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Thrown to the ground, he was handcuffed, And the story

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that MAGA is putting out is that they didn't know

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who he was, he didn't identify himself. Well, you can

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watch the TV reporting of this, so you can see

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he's going I'm Senator Padilla, I mean said and throwing

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him to the ground. So again there's a distortion of information.

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Information is corrupted, we don't get the truth. And the

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final the final piece that I found was people come

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up with simplistic solutions to complex problems.

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Yeah, they do.

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So instead of they're saying, Okay, this is going to

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require some thought. We're going to have to work together.

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Both sides have to come together and collaborate to come

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up with a solution. Unfortunately, in all the instances that

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I put in my book of Evil, in the community,

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in the college, in psychotherapy, we come up with simplistic solutions.

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This kid broke the windows. He needs to be the patient.

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It's it's too often a simplistic approach to something that

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requires more in depth discussion and collaboration.

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Well, because punishment's not treating the cause right or the

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root of why they behave that way right. So that

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all being said, it's in society, I mean, we'll just

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dive into because we're already talking about things that are

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going on. Obviously, Trump administration repolarizing figure. Some people approve,

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some people don't, but regardless of some people see him

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as a dictator, fascist, evil person. Fine, so let's talk

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about how or if you can explain rather because you're

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the expert in this is from your viewpoint, How does

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evil creep in? How does it get accepted to society?

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And how do these cults get formed where people are

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just willingly, just blindly following the leader. How does this happen?

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How does it happen? I just got back from Europe.

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I was in Germany in Austria, and I was struck

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by what a wonderful culture, historic culture, the German Austrian

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culture has been over generations. How was it possible that

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people joined with Adolf Hitler in this horrendous movement that

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was so inhuman, so evil, so dastardly. I don't know

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whether the were to you.

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That is the prime example of evil sneaking in and

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become acceptable, right.

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And being accepted. My senses, you need people to be frightened,

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You need people to feel like they're not being heard.

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I didn't spend enough time in my book talking about that.

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The reason why Hitler took hold is the people of

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Germany felt like they were mistreated after World War One.

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They were poor, they were hungry, they wanted more opportunity,

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and Hitler was giving them a sense of the power,

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sense of being heard. Trump is doing exactly the same thing.

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Trump listened to people who were feeling left out, feeling

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like to peopleeople who felt like they weren't given the

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same opportunities as others. Unfortunately, those people are not being

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represented by Trump. He is not making it any easier

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for them to buy eggs, He's not making it any

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easier for them to have access. In fact, his whole

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political economic strategy is he's going to give more money

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to the rich and then ultimately that's going to seep

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down to the poor people. So again they they they

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think he's he is speaking to their hurt and their

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anger and their receptive to it. That's how it happens,

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I think.

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I mean, he can't argue against that. That is that

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is usually how most any leader who gets elected, though

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it comes into power regardless. I mean, you're you're trying

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to play it to people's sympathies, right, That's usually what But.

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The problem the problem with with Trump, with Hitler, with

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other meglomaniacs is that they really uh don't offer solutions

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that will make the situation any better. They offer false

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solutions that ultimately create more problems.

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It's interesting do you think some of some of because

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he is an interesting person to talk about. I mean,

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he's never never had a president like this ever, and

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it's it. I I will I will say that I

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don't agree with how he acts in public, Like he's

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not presidential, you know, and and the and the thing

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that that he does, Like why are we airing out

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grievances on social media? For example, that whole spat between

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00:16:56.799 --> 00:16:59.039
him and Elon Musk and whoever wants to speak up

248
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against him, Like that's, let's kind of closed door conversation, right,

249
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you work that out, You keep that, you keep that

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out of the public. In my opinion, do you feel

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Trump though, at times where he does have success, do

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you think it's intentional or just accidental? Like things just

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kind of half hal hazardly come together and he just

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claims the win.

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Look, Unfortunately, in each of these situations that I think

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evil comes about, the person is not open to collaboration.

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The person is not open to being in a discussion

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that brings together multiple ideas and then work out as

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best a solution as you can. Trump, unfortunately, besides being

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vulgar and crass, doesn't respect. He speaks badly about anybody

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who disagrees with him. He calls them communist, he calls

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them we he calls them all kinds of names. But

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he doesn't say, Okay, I want to talk with them,

264
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let's sit down and talk about what's the best way

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to go forward. And that was my sense when I

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was in Middle East. Those people never understood that both

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sides had reasonable claims to their position.

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Okay, it wasn't that.

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The Israelis were correct or that the Palestinians were correct.

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They both had legitimate claims that needed to be listened to,

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and unfortunately the powers that be continue to vilify the other.

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Side right right, Well that's not uncommon though. You know,

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each side things they're right, each side things that they're owed,

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whatever it is they believe is old to them. That

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situation like that, that's that goes back a very long ways,

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it really does. I don't I don't know if we're

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ever going to come to a solution on as far

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as that goes, I would hope. So, I mean, I

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don't think that the Palestinian people themselves need to be

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caught in the middle between what's allegedly happening between Hamas

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and you know, Israel. But it's it's just it's just

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sad that I think that those people have to go

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through this and they're they're the ones being stuck in

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the middle between the two fighting, and they're being used,

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you know, they're being used not just as shields but

286
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absolutely both they are.

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Again, that's the problem. The problem is that's to me,

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has all the makings of evil. Us versus them, power

289
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over behavior. I'm stronger than you, so.

290
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I'll fuck you up, right, Yeah.

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Simplistic solutions out below the hell out of Gaza and

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the Hamas.

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Will disappear, right, which is not the right place not

294
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tell the.

295
00:20:05.559 --> 00:20:11.079
Truth about the political realities that are governing why these

296
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people are behaving this way, the powers are behaving this way.

297
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Nettan Yahoo has all kinds of political agenda that have

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00:20:21.799 --> 00:20:26.759
nothing to do with Hamas, and yet that will be

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his his calling card. I'm going to save israelis from Hamas.

300
00:20:33.319 --> 00:20:35.839
So what do you think So what is his actual

301
00:20:35.920 --> 00:20:39.519
political okay, example of his political agenda outside of He's

302
00:20:39.519 --> 00:20:42.839
going to save Israel from Hamas? What what do you

303
00:20:42.920 --> 00:20:44.519
think it is he wants to achieve?

304
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He wants to maintain power.

305
00:20:46.599 --> 00:20:48.400
Well, yeah, right, he.

306
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Is in cahoots with the ultra Orthodox and he needs

307
00:20:53.279 --> 00:20:58.160
their support. He has been much like Trump, he has

308
00:20:58.240 --> 00:21:02.279
been indicted on a number of crimes that he does

309
00:21:02.319 --> 00:21:04.880
not want to sit before the court. In fact, he's

310
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trying to change the nature of the court. Right, So

311
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those other agenda are part of what are driving him

312
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to do what he does.

313
00:21:16.319 --> 00:21:22.160
Okay, And so how do you feel about the sudden

314
00:21:22.839 --> 00:21:25.200
thinning out or pulling out of you know, our embassies

315
00:21:25.200 --> 00:21:26.279
in the Middle East? Right now?

316
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Is it?

317
00:21:29.240 --> 00:21:33.359
Is it? Basically you think the US or Trump saying, Hey,

318
00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:35.480
I had nothing to do with this. Now, who's doing

319
00:21:35.559 --> 00:21:37.279
whatever he's going to do. We can't stop them, we

320
00:21:37.319 --> 00:21:41.559
can't control them. He's not listening. The reports are there

321
00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:43.799
is a verge of well, they're on the verge of

322
00:21:43.799 --> 00:21:47.240
attacking Iran for example, Yes, which is what the hot

323
00:21:47.279 --> 00:21:51.640
topic is, which is a bad thing. Regardless, Yes, what

324
00:21:51.680 --> 00:21:53.039
do you think the move was there?

325
00:21:53.119 --> 00:21:53.279
Then?

326
00:21:53.440 --> 00:21:59.440
As far as Trump administrations concerned, Trump.

327
00:21:59.119 --> 00:22:04.519
Thought he had an easy solution to the situation in

328
00:22:04.519 --> 00:22:07.960
the Middle East. He thought he had an easy solution

329
00:22:08.519 --> 00:22:12.359
to the Russian Ukraine war. Right, Neither one of those

330
00:22:12.400 --> 00:22:15.960
things are turning out to be easy solutions and require

331
00:22:16.000 --> 00:22:24.240
a lot more in depth analysis and discussion than he understood.

332
00:22:24.799 --> 00:22:28.279
Now he sees that Netta Yahoo is as crazy as

333
00:22:28.319 --> 00:22:31.799
he is, and that Neta Yahoo can't be dealt with

334
00:22:32.480 --> 00:22:36.079
in a way that he anticipated Netta Yahoo would be.

335
00:22:36.599 --> 00:22:39.599
And it scares him to think that all of a sudden,

336
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the Middle East is going to blow up into a

337
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major conflagration.

338
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I mean, they were always in the verge since the

339
00:22:49.240 --> 00:22:53.400
beginning of time, it seems as well. So let's talk

340
00:22:53.400 --> 00:22:57.200
about that Ukraine piece then, So does the world really

341
00:22:57.400 --> 00:23:00.519
seem you know, both the world blames the US for

342
00:23:00.559 --> 00:23:04.799
that situation for whatever reason? Do you think that Trump

343
00:23:05.000 --> 00:23:08.400
is really the blame for this situation? And is it

344
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solely fall.

345
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Name for which situation? I mean, he certainly wasn't Ukraine Russia? Yeah,

346
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I think the one to blame. There is another egomaniac

347
00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:26.079
named Putin, right, and Putin was determined to make a

348
00:23:26.240 --> 00:23:31.119
greater Soviet Union again, Yeah, and he's thought he again

349
00:23:31.240 --> 00:23:36.559
misread simplistic solution to a complex problem. He misread the

350
00:23:36.599 --> 00:23:41.160
situation in the Ukraine that they would be easy marks

351
00:23:41.200 --> 00:23:43.720
for him to march in and him take over a

352
00:23:43.759 --> 00:23:49.680
part of their territory. So again it starts, I think

353
00:23:49.720 --> 00:23:55.079
with Putin. Unfortunately, again, Trump, being who he is and

354
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his his sense that he has this charisma that can

355
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make other people bend to his ways. Thought that Putin

356
00:24:07.960 --> 00:24:10.319
would come around and he would come up with an

357
00:24:10.359 --> 00:24:17.359
alliance and they would solve the Russian Ukraine problem, just

358
00:24:17.400 --> 00:24:23.599
like he did with Netanyahu. Unfortunately, he's dealing with people

359
00:24:23.640 --> 00:24:27.480
who are much the same as he is. And then

360
00:24:27.519 --> 00:24:33.640
you got guys like Erdawan and Turkey and Orebon and Hungry,

361
00:24:34.200 --> 00:24:37.480
all these people that he aligns himself with that are

362
00:24:37.559 --> 00:24:42.359
also of the same ilk. So I mean, think about

363
00:24:42.440 --> 00:24:45.440
the simplistic solutions that he's coming up with while he's

364
00:24:45.519 --> 00:24:54.880
alienating NATO, our historic allies, making like they have robbing us.

365
00:24:55.839 --> 00:25:01.480
That's such misinformation. Again, it's so interesting. Have you been

366
00:25:01.480 --> 00:25:02.680
in Europe recently?

367
00:25:02.920 --> 00:25:04.000
No, I have not.

368
00:25:04.920 --> 00:25:08.440
Europe is so far ahead of us in their lifestyle.

369
00:25:09.519 --> 00:25:12.400
They have buses that don't give off missions. They have

370
00:25:12.480 --> 00:25:14.240
lights when you go into the room to go on

371
00:25:14.319 --> 00:25:18.880
and off. They have escalators at the airport that shut

372
00:25:18.920 --> 00:25:23.119
down if there's nobody running on them. They have streets

373
00:25:23.160 --> 00:25:28.759
that are paved. We are becoming a third world country.

374
00:25:29.039 --> 00:25:31.599
He's telling everybody we're the greatest country in the world.

375
00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:36.160
My eyes tell me that you go to a place

376
00:25:36.279 --> 00:25:43.240
like Spain or France. They live so much healthier lifestyles.

377
00:25:43.279 --> 00:25:45.079
They take breaks in the middle of the day, they

378
00:25:45.079 --> 00:25:48.039
don't work the number of hours we work. They get

379
00:25:48.079 --> 00:25:52.359
all these benefits that he calls the socialist conspiracy. They

380
00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:55.920
get their they get their medicine paid for, they get

381
00:25:55.960 --> 00:26:00.519
their education paid for, they get their home googling and

382
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:04.640
paid for it for their children. And we're talking about

383
00:26:04.680 --> 00:26:09.559
them like they're crazy people. We aren't getting the facts

384
00:26:09.680 --> 00:26:11.599
out there for us to listen to.

385
00:26:13.000 --> 00:26:17.519
Yeah, but our situation has gone This is years in

386
00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:20.920
the making. This isn't specific to any Republican or Democratic

387
00:26:20.960 --> 00:26:23.680
president regardless. It's been going on for quite some time.

388
00:26:24.799 --> 00:26:26.920
But it's been taken to an extreme.

389
00:26:27.160 --> 00:26:30.200
Well, it has because people tend to not like Trump.

390
00:26:30.839 --> 00:26:34.640
And you know, call it what you will, but you know,

391
00:26:34.680 --> 00:26:38.079
when everybody is doing everything they can to focus the

392
00:26:38.119 --> 00:26:41.880
messaging on Trump. Bad, Hey, Trump, he's going to be

393
00:26:41.920 --> 00:26:42.880
the scapegoat of everything.

394
00:26:42.920 --> 00:26:43.039
Now.

395
00:26:43.079 --> 00:26:45.400
He's not perfect. I've already admitted that, and he does

396
00:26:46.119 --> 00:26:48.720
do some stupid things. I mean, we can't. I'm not

397
00:26:48.759 --> 00:26:49.960
gonna sit here and pat him on the back all

398
00:26:50.039 --> 00:26:52.319
day because I can't. You know, we can't deny. It's

399
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:54.759
like I scratch my head constantly, like what are you doing?

400
00:26:55.119 --> 00:26:57.400
You know? Sometimes I'm like, okay, you got something, but

401
00:26:57.440 --> 00:26:59.119
then you got a question what was that accidental?

402
00:26:59.400 --> 00:26:59.440
To?

403
00:26:59.599 --> 00:27:02.440
Just was it really planned? I have no idea. He's

404
00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:05.720
definitely going to be studied for years, I believe. Now,

405
00:27:05.759 --> 00:27:08.279
as far as Ukraine goes, let's talk about that, because

406
00:27:08.319 --> 00:27:11.759
that whole thing started way back in fact during the

407
00:27:11.759 --> 00:27:15.480
Obama administration. Everybody turned their back when Russia took over

408
00:27:15.920 --> 00:27:18.839
the Crimean it was annexed. Nobody stepped in to help

409
00:27:18.920 --> 00:27:22.400
Ukraine at that point. Here we go fast forward. Russia's

410
00:27:22.400 --> 00:27:24.920
trying to do it again because, as you said, Putin

411
00:27:24.960 --> 00:27:28.400
wants to reunite the old USSR. That's always been his goal.

412
00:27:28.440 --> 00:27:31.519
He's never hit it. He's said it many, many, many times.

413
00:27:31.799 --> 00:27:34.799
He's getting older. There's a legacy issue for him. He's

414
00:27:34.799 --> 00:27:36.680
getting older. He's been in power for a long time.

415
00:27:36.759 --> 00:27:38.880
I think it's now or never for him. Now. I

416
00:27:39.000 --> 00:27:42.440
call this a Cold World War III, because reality is

417
00:27:42.559 --> 00:27:45.079
China is involved. They have troops there, although they're claiming

418
00:27:45.079 --> 00:27:47.319
they're not involved in the war. They have North Korean

419
00:27:47.319 --> 00:27:50.279
troops there, and Iran has been sending technology and drones

420
00:27:50.279 --> 00:27:52.799
and other things to support this war as well. Everybody

421
00:27:52.839 --> 00:27:54.960
else has done nothing. Let's just be quite honest. Europe

422
00:27:55.000 --> 00:27:59.000
hasn't done anything. Ker Starmer talks loud, mccron talks loud.

423
00:27:59.359 --> 00:28:03.039
Nobody does it thing. The United Kingdom signed one hundred

424
00:28:03.079 --> 00:28:07.599
year agreement with Ukraine way before the incident happened in

425
00:28:07.599 --> 00:28:10.480
the White House between Zelensky and Trump. By the way,

426
00:28:11.119 --> 00:28:15.319
signed in January twenty twenty five, where they committed to

427
00:28:15.599 --> 00:28:19.920
build up their economic trade okay using by the way

428
00:28:21.880 --> 00:28:24.880
UK trade partners and trade channels. They were gonna bulsh

429
00:28:24.960 --> 00:28:28.039
their business, help them with their minerals, and protect them.

430
00:28:28.279 --> 00:28:30.079
A one hundred year agreement that was signed January twenty

431
00:28:30.079 --> 00:28:33.480
twenty five. Nothing has happened. Nothing outside of maybe sending

432
00:28:33.480 --> 00:28:35.519
a little bit of money, maybe they get a little

433
00:28:35.519 --> 00:28:38.799
bit of munitions. Even Kris Starmer said, hey, we're gonna

434
00:28:38.839 --> 00:28:41.559
We're gonna go ahead and we're gonna ramp everything up.

435
00:28:41.839 --> 00:28:44.640
We're gonna put boots on the ground. Hasn't happened. Nobody's

436
00:28:44.680 --> 00:28:46.519
putting boots on the ground, it doesn't matter who it is.

437
00:28:46.960 --> 00:28:48.960
Yet the US is blamed for the whole thing because

438
00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:52.559
we're seeing as the superpower what's stopping Europe. Poland is

439
00:28:52.559 --> 00:28:56.519
on the ready. Poland has been very very much on

440
00:28:56.559 --> 00:28:58.720
the ready and protecting their border and ready to go.

441
00:28:59.039 --> 00:29:02.000
But the reality is nobody wants a nuclear war. Nobody

442
00:29:02.039 --> 00:29:03.799
wants to admit that they No one's really coming out

443
00:29:03.799 --> 00:29:05.599
and say that that's the only reason they're letting putin.

444
00:29:05.640 --> 00:29:08.480
Do you know doing anything he does? Now you take

445
00:29:08.519 --> 00:29:11.680
that into account that China at anytime they're saying they

446
00:29:11.720 --> 00:29:14.319
don't support this, but yet they're sending troops and then

447
00:29:14.319 --> 00:29:18.920
they're playing games over there in Taiwan. So this situation

448
00:29:19.000 --> 00:29:22.839
is bad regardless if Europe steps in. If you're up

449
00:29:22.839 --> 00:29:26.640
steps in, China might say, cool, here's our opportunity. While

450
00:29:26.680 --> 00:29:29.119
everybody's focused over here in the US might have to

451
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:31.279
go and help their allies. They're going to move in

452
00:29:31.319 --> 00:29:35.160
on Taiwan. Right, So, while the US gets the blame

453
00:29:35.200 --> 00:29:37.319
and Trump gets a blame, this thing was debacled. This

454
00:29:37.480 --> 00:29:41.599
was a mess since Obama. Nothing happened under the Biden administration. Either,

455
00:29:42.039 --> 00:29:45.920
nobody wanted to step foot, everybody talk loud, nobody did anything.

456
00:29:46.480 --> 00:29:49.039
I personally think it's time to pull our heads out

457
00:29:49.039 --> 00:29:51.359
of our ass. Trump needs to go in and we

458
00:29:51.400 --> 00:29:53.359
need to do something because we also have an agreement

459
00:29:53.359 --> 00:29:55.759
with the Ukraine. Are we really going to be protecting them?

460
00:29:55.880 --> 00:29:58.240
Is the UK going to protect them? Or is everybody

461
00:29:58.319 --> 00:30:01.079
just going to posture and try to win brownie points,

462
00:30:01.079 --> 00:30:03.799
you know in the media by saying, Hey, I'm speaking

463
00:30:03.799 --> 00:30:06.519
tough to Putin. Putin don't give a damn. Putin can

464
00:30:06.559 --> 00:30:09.720
care less. He's already called everybody's bluff. So what's the

465
00:30:09.720 --> 00:30:13.200
next step. We could point the finger who's the blame?

466
00:30:13.240 --> 00:30:15.400
But who step?

467
00:30:15.519 --> 00:30:17.960
I don't want to talk about who's the blame?

468
00:30:18.519 --> 00:30:20.440
No, I know I've said, but everyone's doing that right now.

469
00:30:20.720 --> 00:30:22.400
So I'm saying, like, who's going to stay? We need

470
00:30:22.440 --> 00:30:23.880
a solution, We need a solution.

471
00:30:24.039 --> 00:30:26.759
This goes back, This goes back to the fall of

472
00:30:26.839 --> 00:30:32.039
the Russian Empire. Yes, yes, we made some very tactical

473
00:30:32.319 --> 00:30:38.680
errors in closing in on Russia with NATO. I think I.

474
00:30:38.839 --> 00:30:40.359
Don't disagree with that. By the way, I think I

475
00:30:40.400 --> 00:30:42.240
think that was a bad move. It really was.

476
00:30:42.279 --> 00:30:45.000
It was a bad move, And I think what we

477
00:30:45.119 --> 00:30:49.119
created going way back, so we're going back into the

478
00:30:49.200 --> 00:30:55.119
twentieth century. That Uh, lots of errors have been made,

479
00:30:55.599 --> 00:31:01.799
a lot of simplistic solutions to complex problems. I'm not

480
00:31:01.920 --> 00:31:06.119
here to blame Trump for having caused this. What I

481
00:31:06.319 --> 00:31:10.519
do concern myself with is when he says things like

482
00:31:12.480 --> 00:31:20.960
the Ukraine attacked Russia, that those kinds of misinformation are problematic.

483
00:31:21.319 --> 00:31:22.880
And I agree with you, I do.

484
00:31:23.480 --> 00:31:26.720
I think that's wrong, and I'm agreeing with you too.

485
00:31:26.960 --> 00:31:31.240
I mean, it's very scary because if we back Russia

486
00:31:31.759 --> 00:31:34.319
into a position where they feel they have to strike

487
00:31:34.359 --> 00:31:40.880
out with nuclear weapons, we'll have a horrendous situation. So

488
00:31:40.920 --> 00:31:44.240
we don't want to do that. But it's very important

489
00:31:44.839 --> 00:31:48.799
I think for the United States to stand with its

490
00:31:48.880 --> 00:31:54.000
allies and say we we will confront this together, not

491
00:31:54.559 --> 00:31:59.759
to blame them, not to distort this as we have

492
00:31:59.839 --> 00:32:04.160
no problem with Russia. We do the Russian The Russian

493
00:32:04.759 --> 00:32:09.240
situation is problematic for us and for them, And and

494
00:32:09.319 --> 00:32:12.000
I keep coming back to this. The solutions are collaborative,

495
00:32:12.559 --> 00:32:17.240
The solutions are discussion. The solutions are looking at both

496
00:32:17.279 --> 00:32:22.480
sides of an issue. Russia needs protection, Russia needs to

497
00:32:22.519 --> 00:32:26.559
know that NATO is not going to infringe upon them, right,

498
00:32:27.359 --> 00:32:31.279
Russia needs to know that they're going to have us

499
00:32:31.920 --> 00:32:36.440
access to selling their goods again and building back their economy.

500
00:32:36.960 --> 00:32:43.759
There needs to be people coming together, collaborating in a

501
00:32:44.000 --> 00:32:49.079
sensible dialogue instead of us against them, whoever them is.

502
00:32:50.599 --> 00:32:55.319
You're spot on there, because everybody wants to be everyone

503
00:32:55.319 --> 00:32:58.519
wants to take credit at this point, right, the UK

504
00:32:58.680 --> 00:33:00.839
wants to be the one to say, look, solution I have,

505
00:33:01.559 --> 00:33:04.920
We're the hero. France, same thing. Obviously Trump's doing the

506
00:33:04.960 --> 00:33:08.240
same thing. It's it's a it's a really dire situation

507
00:33:08.440 --> 00:33:11.039
because the people that are suffering, the people in the

508
00:33:11.119 --> 00:33:15.759
Ukraine period, Zelensky cannot win this war. He can't on

509
00:33:15.799 --> 00:33:19.279
his own. Like I said, everybody's sending munitions and money,

510
00:33:19.880 --> 00:33:22.160
but that's not going to win it. It's going to

511
00:33:22.279 --> 00:33:26.680
have to be numbers, bodies, boots, period. That's the only51200:33:26.720 --> 00:33:29.200



thing that's going to work. But people don't realize that.51300:33:29.359 --> 00:33:34.559



I'm concerned if you start sending boots in exescalate exactly.51400:33:34.599 --> 00:33:39.160



That's that's that's the crux of it, right, agree. So again,51500:33:39.240 --> 00:33:42.440



I you're very knowledgeable about this, George, But my sense51600:33:42.559 --> 00:33:48.480



is both sides have reasonable positions that need to be heard.51700:33:48.680 --> 00:33:50.920



No, agreed, agreed, and I was I was going to51800:33:50.960 --> 00:33:53.079



echo what you said earlier about Rump.51900:33:53.079 --> 00:33:57.160



Was the success in this last election because he heard52000:33:57.680 --> 00:34:01.759



the voices of people who were in pain that the52100:34:01.839 --> 00:34:09.239



Democrats were talking about all kinds of what's the word52200:34:09.360 --> 00:34:19.960



for it, social issues? Should transgender people play sports rather52300:34:20.039 --> 00:34:23.079



than talk about the price of eggs, rather than talk52400:34:23.119 --> 00:34:26.119



about the fact that people are feeling cut off and52500:34:26.159 --> 00:34:32.480



they don't have access. Again, is this country cannot operate52600:34:32.679 --> 00:34:38.079



without immigrants, even illegal immigrants. What's happening? What's happening in52700:34:38.079 --> 00:34:41.079



my own community. I was sitting in the diner the52800:34:41.159 --> 00:34:45.039



other day in Salem, Massachusetts, and the waitress said to me,52900:34:45.639 --> 00:34:48.599



you know what's happened. None of the Hispanic people come53000:34:48.639 --> 00:34:51.719



here anymore. They're all frightened. They're all frightened. They're going53100:34:51.760 --> 00:34:55.199



to get rounded up. There used to be all these53200:34:55.360 --> 00:34:57.880



workers at home Depot who would line up there every53300:34:57.880 --> 00:35:03.199



morning to help tractors and landscapers and all kinds off.53400:35:03.239 --> 00:35:06.079



They don't come there anymore because they're afraid they're going53500:35:06.159 --> 00:35:10.639



to be targeted and arrested. We need these people. No,53600:35:11.159 --> 00:35:14.239



there aren't poor people who want to do what the53700:35:14.360 --> 00:35:20.280



day laborers do who are illegal eminents our country. Will53800:35:20.599 --> 00:35:25.119



you guys out in California will have no more avocados53900:35:25.480 --> 00:35:26.880



if you don't have those people.54000:35:27.599 --> 00:35:30.559



Yeah, well, our avocados were pretty much given away to54100:35:30.639 --> 00:35:32.639



Mexico as it was as far as an industry. It54200:35:32.719 --> 00:35:35.159



started in California and now we import it all from Mexico.54300:35:35.280 --> 00:35:40.880



So here's that with avocados. I don't disagree with your statements.54400:35:40.960 --> 00:35:43.960



This is a tricky situation because I think that we54500:35:44.000 --> 00:35:47.079



need to enforce policies to protect our sovereignty in our borders.54600:35:47.159 --> 00:35:50.719



But we shouldn't be targeting everybody who looks like an54700:35:50.760 --> 00:35:53.199



illegal immigrant. You know, you have to you have to54800:35:53.239 --> 00:35:54.280



do your research.54900:35:54.079 --> 00:35:58.280



In that's right. If and he he Trump said he55000:35:58.400 --> 00:36:00.960



was going to go after those people who were criminals.55100:36:01.119 --> 00:36:02.159



Yes that was what he said.55200:36:02.639 --> 00:36:04.639



Yes, that's what he said. But he's not doing that.55300:36:05.079 --> 00:36:08.280



He's going into places like the home depot and rounding55400:36:08.400 --> 00:36:10.800



up everybody who's brown.55500:36:11.280 --> 00:36:12.960



Yeah, they're casting two wide of a net on this.55600:36:13.039 --> 00:36:16.599



I mean, I believe, I believe you and I may55700:36:16.599 --> 00:36:19.480



be in agreement on this. They should just go out55800:36:19.480 --> 00:36:22.000



for the people with the criminal records. That are obviously55900:36:22.039 --> 00:36:24.360



not legal but have a criminal background. They need to56000:36:24.360 --> 00:36:27.360



be addressed period. The way this law even works, so56100:36:27.440 --> 00:36:28.920



even if you have a green card, by the way,56200:36:29.159 --> 00:36:33.440



if you commit a crime, you are still eligible to56300:36:33.440 --> 00:36:36.880



be deported. You're not safe in that either until that56400:36:37.000 --> 00:36:40.079



you actually become a citizens. As far as you said,56500:36:40.119 --> 00:36:41.679



with the legal workers that will do the work in56600:36:41.719 --> 00:36:45.280



the fields, we do need them now at that point though,56700:36:45.320 --> 00:36:47.519



if they did this legally, they're not illegal. They do56800:36:47.599 --> 00:36:50.360



get a visa in which they are allotted a certain56900:36:50.360 --> 00:36:53.320



amount of time to stay here and work under a57000:36:53.400 --> 00:36:54.119



legal status.57100:36:54.599 --> 00:36:58.400



We are in total agreement. Yeah, there needs to be57200:36:58.760 --> 00:37:02.920



laws that are reasonable, that can be enforced absolutely, and57300:37:03.719 --> 00:37:07.400



we can't just have porous boilers where anybody can cross57400:37:07.480 --> 00:37:12.920



over and do that. Again, it requires people working together57500:37:13.519 --> 00:37:20.000



to sensibly work out and collaborate together to make regulations57600:37:20.039 --> 00:37:22.960



and rules that work and that are in the best57700:37:23.000 --> 00:37:24.559



interest of everyone.57800:37:24.679 --> 00:37:27.280



Agreed. We need to do better, period. You know, we57900:37:27.360 --> 00:37:29.639



need to do better. It wouldn't look so drastic if58000:37:29.639 --> 00:37:31.800



we didn't let it get to this point. It's the58100:37:31.840 --> 00:37:33.760



problem I'm having with the way Trump has hand this.58200:37:33.840 --> 00:37:36.960



Like I said, I agree with trying to clean up58300:37:37.000 --> 00:37:39.920



the mess. But he's he's taking a hammer and just hitting.58400:37:40.119 --> 00:37:42.320



It's like playing whackamle on whatever. Right, he's bringing down58500:37:42.320 --> 00:37:45.199



a hammer instead of using you know, the term kid clubs, like,58600:37:45.320 --> 00:37:48.239



you know, hey, let's be gentle about this. Let's let's58700:37:48.239 --> 00:37:53.480



try to approach this amicably. Because what gets me is58800:37:53.519 --> 00:37:57.480



this when you have a family and you're just taking58900:37:57.480 --> 00:38:00.000



the mother away after being here ten to twenty five years.59000:38:00.119 --> 00:38:01.920



And now I'll just put this out there, and you59100:38:02.000 --> 00:38:04.679



might disagree with me, doesn't matter how long you've been here.59200:38:04.719 --> 00:38:07.880



If you committed the crime of coming over illegally, it's59300:38:07.920 --> 00:38:09.519



going to catch up to you eventually. Just as if59400:38:09.559 --> 00:38:11.119



I robbed a bank, got away with her for twenty59500:38:11.199 --> 00:38:12.519



years and all of a sudden the FBI finds out59600:38:12.519 --> 00:38:15.559



where I am and knocks on my door. That's serving justice.59700:38:15.800 --> 00:38:20.159



But in this case, with a family, do you think,59800:38:20.199 --> 00:38:22.159



and I think this, by the way, should you not59900:38:22.199 --> 00:38:25.360



take that situation differently? Should you not say, okay, look,60000:38:25.880 --> 00:38:29.119



there's a family here. She's already this mother or this60100:38:29.280 --> 00:38:32.519



dad has children, been here for ten fifteen years. Maybe60200:38:32.679 --> 00:38:35.719



negotiate to work out a program with them that they60300:38:35.760 --> 00:38:38.119



can take steps to make them legal or give them60400:38:38.159 --> 00:38:40.880



an extension, say all right, here's what's going on. We60500:38:40.920 --> 00:38:43.440



need you to do this, and we'll let you stay60600:38:43.480 --> 00:38:46.000



here for six months, for example, to get everything straight.60700:38:46.440 --> 00:38:48.480



How do you feel about that as a solution to60800:38:48.519 --> 00:38:50.760



those problems.60900:38:50.599 --> 00:38:54.880



George, I'm impressed that you're a sensible man. I try61000:38:54.920 --> 00:38:59.920



to be, and that, of course, there has to be61100:39:01.480 --> 00:39:08.559



sensible mechanisms for evaluating a situation. You have a situation61200:39:08.639 --> 00:39:12.480



where you have a family where that the children are61300:39:12.519 --> 00:39:16.920



a fact Americans, We're born here and the parents came61400:39:16.960 --> 00:39:21.360



in here illegally. We need to come up with ways61500:39:21.360 --> 00:39:24.320



of saying, okay, it's in the family's best interest, in61600:39:24.360 --> 00:39:29.239



the community's best interests to give those people a mechanism61700:39:29.360 --> 00:39:33.159



for becoming citizens. It's much like we talked about dreamers61800:39:33.199 --> 00:39:37.480



at one point, so that they had mechanisms for becoming citizens.61900:39:38.280 --> 00:39:41.440



We can't do things with a hammer, we can't do62000:39:41.519 --> 00:39:46.559



things with broad us in they statements that anybody who62100:39:46.639 --> 00:39:51.880



was not born here has to be eliminated. We need62200:39:51.920 --> 00:39:56.000



to think about what are the effects on families, on62300:39:56.079 --> 00:40:01.639



the community, on industries. That requires us all sitting down,62400:40:01.760 --> 00:40:07.400



people like you and me, talking about reasonable solutions.62500:40:06.800 --> 00:40:10.000



Yeah, No, you're you're correct. I mean, you're correct.62600:40:10.480 --> 00:40:11.840



I'm with you.62700:40:13.840 --> 00:40:16.039



I got my moments. Let's put that I'm never always correct.62800:40:16.079 --> 00:40:17.960



I mean I never always get it right. Believe me.62900:40:18.760 --> 00:40:22.480



It's too hard. It's too hard to be uh, you know,63000:40:22.559 --> 00:40:25.840



to to have a definite answer these things, as you said,63100:40:25.840 --> 00:40:27.440



because you know, there's a lot of gray area that's63200:40:27.440 --> 00:40:30.400



always ignored. It's not a black it's nothing black and white.63300:40:30.719 --> 00:40:32.760



You know, everybody lives in the gray. We gotta admit that.63400:40:32.840 --> 00:40:35.679



Nobody nobody looks it that way, at least right now63500:40:35.719 --> 00:40:38.079



with everything going on. It's just black white done. No,63600:40:38.239 --> 00:40:41.599



there's a big gray area that everybody lives in period. Yes,63700:40:42.039 --> 00:40:43.039



not being as.63800:40:42.880 --> 00:40:45.719



Again that that requires sensibility. You know, I was going63900:40:45.760 --> 00:40:49.480



to say this before. Sure was a philosopher named Levi Strauss.64000:40:50.239 --> 00:40:51.119



Do you know of him?64100:40:51.360 --> 00:40:53.800



I heard the name. I don't know the work.64200:40:53.880 --> 00:40:57.760



He taught at the University of Chicago. Uh. He was64300:40:58.079 --> 00:41:03.760



a Holocaust victim in Germany. Many. He escaped from Germany64400:41:04.079 --> 00:41:11.039



and taught philosophy at the University of Chicago, and many64500:41:11.079 --> 00:41:17.320



of his students were the neo cons who worked in64600:41:17.400 --> 00:41:27.199



the Bush won a Bush to administration and Strauss said64700:41:27.800 --> 00:41:32.960



it's in the best interests of the community to lie64800:41:33.039 --> 00:41:39.880



to them if they can't understand the issues, make up64900:41:39.920 --> 00:41:50.000



excuses such as weapons of mass destruction, make up those situations,65000:41:50.800 --> 00:41:54.119



and that will give you access to taking care of65100:41:54.199 --> 00:41:57.639



the people in the way that they should be taken65200:41:57.679 --> 00:42:02.320



care of. Unfortunately, I think Leo Strauss made a terrible error.65300:42:03.280 --> 00:42:08.800



You know, Plato, Plato in the Republic, many many generations ago,65400:42:10.440 --> 00:42:17.000



said that philosophers should be king. Unfortunately, nobody listens to them.65500:42:17.480 --> 00:42:20.400



They're the first ones to know there's a problem, but65600:42:20.480 --> 00:42:23.199



the last one to have any impact. So Strauss said, well,65700:42:23.239 --> 00:42:26.800



I'm not going to wait for Plato's solution to teach65800:42:26.880 --> 00:42:31.519



the people. We got to do it and protect people. Unfortunately,65900:42:31.679 --> 00:42:36.079



that's too often what is happening now in our country.66000:42:36.119 --> 00:42:39.480



That's been yeah for a while, right, that's the playbook.66100:42:39.559 --> 00:42:43.440



Tell people what they can understand, even if it's not66200:42:43.559 --> 00:42:47.920



the truth, and come up with solutions that they can66300:42:47.960 --> 00:42:51.360



buy into. And that's not just one side of the other.66400:42:53.239 --> 00:42:57.239



That's not taking responsibility for saying I don't have a66500:42:57.280 --> 00:43:00.719



solution that you'll buy into. Let's sit and I'm gonna66600:43:00.800 --> 00:43:03.880



keep saying this Let's come up with dialogue, Let's come66700:43:03.960 --> 00:43:08.280



up with consensus. Let's come up with mechanisms that bring66800:43:08.400 --> 00:43:12.119



people to listen to one another. You and I don't66900:43:12.159 --> 00:43:14.440



agree about everything, but we agree about enough that we67000:43:14.480 --> 00:43:17.000



can sit down and we can talk, and we could67100:43:17.000 --> 00:43:21.320



look for common reality. So it goes forward.67200:43:21.400 --> 00:43:24.039



I think I think the opposition of opinion is how67300:43:24.119 --> 00:43:26.159



you come to a solution in the middle. I mean,67400:43:26.159 --> 00:43:28.320



if you can't hear each other out, you're never going67500:43:28.400 --> 00:43:30.559



to come up with a solution. You're just going to67600:43:30.599 --> 00:43:35.039



continue to be segregated right, left, whatever. You know, it's67700:43:35.039 --> 00:43:39.480



just ridiculous if you can't sit down and talk about67800:43:39.480 --> 00:43:43.800



these issues, deal with your own emotions, angers, whatever it is.67900:43:44.000 --> 00:43:46.880



You have to be able to sit down, check that68000:43:46.920 --> 00:43:49.440



shit at the door, and just talk about the issues.68100:43:50.360 --> 00:43:52.760



I'll ask you, Evan, what's your view on this? Great,68200:43:53.000 --> 00:43:55.199



I'll take it in. I'll give you mine same thing,68300:43:55.639 --> 00:43:58.039



and then in our minds we're calculating I don't agree68400:43:58.039 --> 00:43:59.840



with that, but he made a point here. And then68500:44:00.079 --> 00:44:02.480



bring those back together and we say, all right, here's68600:44:02.519 --> 00:44:03.880



here's what we have. We got we got kind of68700:44:03.880 --> 00:44:06.519



an outline we can start with, and we just hash68800:44:06.559 --> 00:44:09.039



it out right. That's the way it should That's.68900:44:08.800 --> 00:44:13.199



What I'm promulgating. That's my thesis. Let's sit down, let's69000:44:13.239 --> 00:44:16.440



hear each other, Let's understand what g need, what I need.69100:44:16.840 --> 00:44:18.559



Let's come up with a solution. You know, there was69200:44:18.599 --> 00:44:22.760



a time when when Congress worked that way for various69300:44:22.800 --> 00:44:26.320



other reasons. You know, I'll give you something for your farmers,69400:44:26.320 --> 00:44:30.800



you give me something for my industrial people, will bother69500:44:31.360 --> 00:44:32.719



us solutions together.69600:44:33.039 --> 00:44:36.079



We don't do that anymore, No, they don't. It's either69700:44:36.079 --> 00:44:40.400



this or nothing. Yes, especially how they pack everything with69800:44:40.440 --> 00:44:43.280



all this pork and try to sneakers in with these69900:44:43.280 --> 00:44:45.599



five thousand pages. They know nobody's going to read. Who70000:44:45.639 --> 00:44:47.360



has time for that? It's like, hey, we released a70100:44:47.360 --> 00:44:50.440



support here's Thursday. We're voting on a Friday. Who has70200:44:50.519 --> 00:44:53.280



time for that? Like this, it's ridiculous, you know. And70300:44:53.320 --> 00:44:57.039



it's always a one sided issue, always always one sided,70400:44:57.559 --> 00:44:59.320



and it's very ridiculous because it does leave a lot70500:44:59.360 --> 00:45:01.400



of people out, the needs of the actual people. That's70600:45:01.400 --> 00:45:02.960



what I'm getting tired of in America right now. I70700:45:02.960 --> 00:45:05.079



don't care who the president is, by the way, the70800:45:05.159 --> 00:45:08.599



reality is this country has not been looking out for70900:45:08.639 --> 00:45:12.000



its people. They've been playing on emotions. It's it's like71000:45:12.039 --> 00:45:14.440



you said earlier. I don't know if I'm correct on this,71100:45:14.519 --> 00:45:16.639



but it's kind of an example of what you're talking71200:45:16.639 --> 00:45:20.760



about earlier with Levi Strauss for example. Is that power71300:45:20.840 --> 00:45:23.800



over behavior? Right to me? I look at it from71400:45:24.320 --> 00:45:28.880



like a business owner. Okay, the government is playing a71500:45:28.920 --> 00:45:32.079



sigh up and they have an amazing marketing team, and71600:45:32.119 --> 00:45:35.000



they know how to pull on your emotions, pull on71700:45:35.039 --> 00:45:38.280



your heartstrings, to direct you where they want you to go.71800:45:38.320 --> 00:45:41.440



They're playing they're playing chess with us. Basically, that's exactly71900:45:41.440 --> 00:45:44.639



what they're doing. You know, we're the ponds, yes, and72000:45:44.719 --> 00:45:49.199



unfortunately we keep playing into their hand, they keep segreging.72100:45:50.360 --> 00:45:53.760



I don't know, just kind of just.72200:45:53.760 --> 00:45:56.480



Kind of happened. Well, your sensibility.72300:45:56.920 --> 00:46:00.440



I started with my brother, so he's been he's been72400:46:00.440 --> 00:46:04.719



a podcaster for probably nine eight nine years now, and72500:46:05.480 --> 00:46:08.000



I started on his show a little bit here and there.72600:46:08.239 --> 00:46:13.199



And I've always been into politics, philosophy, everything. I'm not72700:46:13.239 --> 00:46:14.599



as educated as you and it by the way, I72800:46:14.639 --> 00:46:16.920



can't just call people's names out in quotes, but you know,72900:46:16.960 --> 00:46:20.079



I do like I do like it, and I've been73000:46:20.079 --> 00:46:21.480



interest in politics for a very long time.73100:46:21.519 --> 00:46:21.679



Now.73200:46:21.719 --> 00:46:23.159



The reason I got into this is because I hear73300:46:23.199 --> 00:46:26.199



a lot of people talk. I hear these shows, I73400:46:26.239 --> 00:46:28.679



hear these talking heads that are just reading whatever script73500:46:28.760 --> 00:46:30.639



on is a teleprompter, and I hear a lot of73600:46:30.639 --> 00:46:33.639



these other podcasters, and I'm like, they don't know what73700:46:33.679 --> 00:46:35.559



they're talking about, or if they do make a point.73800:46:35.719 --> 00:46:38.480



I just got the I just got to a position73900:46:38.599 --> 00:46:40.000



in my life where I said, you know what, I74000:46:40.000 --> 00:46:42.000



have nothing to lose. Why don't I get on the74100:46:42.039 --> 00:46:44.360



mic and see if I can make a difference or74200:46:44.400 --> 00:46:47.079



at least vent or say what's on the top off74300:46:47.119 --> 00:46:49.760



the top of my head. But I'll admit I say74400:46:49.760 --> 00:46:52.400



some outlanda shit sometimes I know that I'll say something74500:46:52.440 --> 00:46:56.400



and later on go you know, probably should kind of74600:46:56.440 --> 00:46:59.320



reel that one back a little because we do this74700:46:59.360 --> 00:46:59.960



in real time.74800:47:00.480 --> 00:47:04.280



I like your sensibility. I hope that that you get74900:47:04.360 --> 00:47:06.679



heard by lots of people because you're making sense.75000:47:07.480 --> 00:47:12.960



I appreciate that, Thank you. But the problem with doing this,75100:47:13.039 --> 00:47:16.719



Evan is we respond in real time, right. And I've75200:47:16.719 --> 00:47:19.199



said this before with other people, and I've had YouTubers,75300:47:19.199 --> 00:47:21.880



I've speaked to people in the Intel community people in75400:47:21.920 --> 00:47:25.199



the military. Like I've had very various guests and people75500:47:25.239 --> 00:47:28.199



I connect with since i've been doing this, and you're75600:47:28.239 --> 00:47:32.800



always right today, wrong tomorrow. You can't keep up with75700:47:32.840 --> 00:47:35.039



the news cycle. You can't keep up with what's happening,75800:47:35.599 --> 00:47:37.960



you know, And we live in a world of sound75900:47:37.960 --> 00:47:40.440



bites and clips, you know, we always get just a76000:47:40.440 --> 00:47:43.440



snippet of the actual information. Right everything's on social media.76100:47:43.440 --> 00:47:45.880



You never see the full video clip. You just see76200:47:45.880 --> 00:47:49.000



that one moment where they see the white guy being racist,76300:47:49.320 --> 00:47:54.000



for example, or the brown guy getting arrested. I'm not76400:47:54.039 --> 00:47:56.239



going to say whether those particular situations are right wrong,76500:47:56.320 --> 00:47:57.800



But we don't see the we don't get the whole76600:47:57.800 --> 00:48:01.039



context of what's happening, and people just eat it up,76700:48:02.079 --> 00:48:04.760



and they're conditioning us, just as you said, they're conditioning76800:48:04.840 --> 00:48:06.960



us with this. It's a tool, you know.76900:48:07.239 --> 00:48:13.280



I go back a long way. I was a medic77000:48:13.360 --> 00:48:18.320



during the Vietnam War. I decided when I got out77100:48:18.360 --> 00:48:19.880



of the army, I was going to go to graduate77200:48:19.880 --> 00:48:24.360



school in psychology and do good. And some of the77300:48:24.400 --> 00:48:31.400



things that I worked on turned into such disasters. For example,77400:48:33.360 --> 00:48:36.000



I was part of a class action suit that took77500:48:36.719 --> 00:48:42.760



adolescents and children off adult psychiatric units so that they77600:48:42.760 --> 00:48:46.519



were being treated back in the nineteen sixties and seventies77700:48:47.639 --> 00:48:55.280



amongst adult crazies, and it was totally inappropriate. Then I77800:48:55.400 --> 00:49:00.360



was part of an action to close down mental hospitals. Well,77900:49:00.440 --> 00:49:04.079



we had a daily census in Massachusetts between thirty and78000:49:04.159 --> 00:49:10.119



fifty thousand patients in psychiatric hospital state hospitals back in78100:49:10.159 --> 00:49:12.679



that era. You know where they are now?78200:49:13.239 --> 00:49:14.960



No, they're homeless.78300:49:16.039 --> 00:49:20.079



Yeah, well it's the same number of people in Massachusetts78400:49:20.079 --> 00:49:21.119



who are on the streets.78500:49:21.360 --> 00:49:25.159



I was since you brought that up. I've had that78600:49:25.320 --> 00:49:30.559



opinion because I've I've known people who are in various78700:49:30.639 --> 00:49:36.800



organizations that would serve the homeless community. Yes, and I78800:49:36.840 --> 00:49:39.679



hate to say this, but the truth of the matter78900:49:39.760 --> 00:49:41.760



is exactly what you said. Most of these people have79000:49:41.840 --> 00:49:45.079



been abandoned by the state, the government. They're no longer79100:49:45.119 --> 00:49:47.280



getting funded, they're not getting their medication, not getting care,79200:49:47.440 --> 00:49:49.360



and they're left out in the cult to figure it out.79300:49:50.039 --> 00:49:54.639



They can't rejoint society because they're not they're not capable79400:49:54.719 --> 00:49:57.320



of it. Yeah, it's it's not that they're not smart.79500:49:57.320 --> 00:50:00.480



For example, what it was just they lacked social skills79600:50:00.559 --> 00:50:02.199



or whatever it is that will allow them to.79700:50:02.519 --> 00:50:07.440



They're truly sick people. And the fact is we, in79800:50:07.519 --> 00:50:12.320



doing our do gooding, close the mental hospitals. Well it's79900:50:12.400 --> 00:50:15.159



not by chance. That's the same number of people that80000:50:15.239 --> 00:50:18.440



today are on the street.80100:50:18.639 --> 00:50:22.679



What okay, let's get back to that. What was behind80200:50:22.760 --> 00:50:26.000



closing that? What was behind closing the mental hospitals? Did80300:50:26.039 --> 00:50:28.599



they claim it was financial? Was it like? What?80400:50:28.840 --> 00:50:31.880



No? They claimed that the people weren't being treated adequately,80500:50:31.960 --> 00:50:36.519



they weren't being treated humanly. Really well, again in retrospect,80600:50:36.599 --> 00:50:40.119



they were being treated more humanely in the mental hospital80700:50:40.159 --> 00:50:43.599



than they are today on the street sleeping in their fecings.80800:50:44.239 --> 00:50:46.920



So again, we thought we were getting them to a80900:50:47.000 --> 00:50:51.119



place where they could be treated within the community and81000:50:51.280 --> 00:50:54.480



cared for by the community. Community it didn't want them.81100:50:54.920 --> 00:50:57.559



So you know, we tried to set up halfway houses.81200:50:57.840 --> 00:51:01.119



Somebody wanted one in their neighborhood, not mine neighborhood. I81300:51:01.119 --> 00:51:02.559



don't want to be part of a solution.81400:51:03.480 --> 00:51:06.880



There's I mean, you know, because this is what you did.81500:51:06.960 --> 00:51:10.000



I don't. But from what I've read and what I've81600:51:11.079 --> 00:51:17.159



seen documentaries and whatnot, not an expert, but the mental81700:51:17.159 --> 00:51:22.280



hospitals were definitely an issue when psychology was in its81800:51:22.280 --> 00:51:25.000



infant stages, when it was very experimental. Still they're trying81900:51:25.000 --> 00:51:26.480



to figure that out. But it did get to a82000:51:26.519 --> 00:51:31.480



point where they got a handle on the abuse. But82100:51:31.599 --> 00:51:33.480



yet even after that it did get better, but they82200:51:33.519 --> 00:51:36.119



still decided this isn't good enough. Put these people out82300:51:36.159 --> 00:51:38.679



on the street. That's just crazy.82400:51:39.920 --> 00:51:43.280



I've worked with Yako Sekoa, for example, who's in Finland82500:51:44.199 --> 00:51:51.039



and back in the Scandinavian countries. The community works together82600:51:51.960 --> 00:51:55.639



to treat the people in the community who are sick.82700:51:56.920 --> 00:52:03.840



They pitch in, they all have roles. Small homogeneous communities82800:52:04.320 --> 00:52:08.599



that care for their own. Our communities are too diverse.82900:52:09.400 --> 00:52:14.039



There people don't care about what's happening down the street.83000:52:14.960 --> 00:52:23.039



It's unfortunate. Churches no longer. When I first started doing psychotherapy,83100:52:23.320 --> 00:52:26.320



I spoke at every church in my town. They all83200:52:26.360 --> 00:52:28.519



called me in to talk about how they can work83300:52:28.559 --> 00:52:31.599



together to do things in their own community. But people83400:52:31.599 --> 00:52:32.840



don't go to church anymore.83500:52:33.000 --> 00:52:35.719



No. Let me ask this, why do you think people83600:52:35.719 --> 00:52:37.519



don't care? Though? When it comes to the people on83700:52:37.559 --> 00:52:40.440



the streets and the homeless, like everyone, it's.83800:52:40.400 --> 00:52:45.079



Not me, it's them. It's us versus them. I'm not that.83900:52:45.159 --> 00:52:49.599



Problem understood, I get that, but what caused that? I84000:52:49.639 --> 00:52:52.559



remember a time where people were more generous, and then84100:52:52.760 --> 00:52:56.960



I think it was sometime in the nineties, it just84200:52:57.039 --> 00:52:58.960



kind of flipped, like all of a sudden, people just84300:52:59.039 --> 00:53:02.760



stopped caring. Yes, you know, they weren't giving them a84400:53:02.760 --> 00:53:06.800



dollar for example, or buying people food. I'm gonna say84500:53:06.800 --> 00:53:09.119



this because I've experienced this myself, and I know this84600:53:09.159 --> 00:53:11.519



from inside information with people who work in the missions84700:53:11.559 --> 00:53:15.960



and whatnot. There are literally people who gave up on society.84800:53:16.039 --> 00:53:17.519



Not just sick, but they just don't want to deal84900:53:17.559 --> 00:53:20.320



with anything and they find that living on the street85000:53:20.360 --> 00:53:22.880



suits them better. That's not the majority, by the way,85100:53:22.920 --> 00:53:26.800



but those people are there. Yeah, And I think that85200:53:26.840 --> 00:53:29.639



people stopped caring because they realized, you know, with all85300:53:29.639 --> 00:53:32.639



the stories coming out and they themselves just being scammed.85400:53:32.679 --> 00:53:35.480



Like even in my town, I we would see the85500:53:35.480 --> 00:53:39.239



same person pulled the same scam over and over for85600:53:39.400 --> 00:53:42.840



two three years, always pregnant, always just got dropped off85700:53:42.840 --> 00:53:46.400



at the bus. One year I recognized here and realized, Hey,85800:53:46.559 --> 00:53:51.039



weren't you just saying this like last year? Yeah, you're85900:53:51.039 --> 00:53:54.920



still pregnant with the same baby. And I think those86000:53:55.159 --> 00:53:59.880



unfortunate circumstances, those unfortunate examples, by the way, is what86100:54:00.280 --> 00:54:03.039



led people to stop caring. They just feel like, I'm86200:54:03.039 --> 00:54:04.679



not making a difference, and these people were just trying86300:54:04.719 --> 00:54:05.599



to take advantage of me.86400:54:06.800 --> 00:54:13.199



When I went to school back in I started college86500:54:13.199 --> 00:54:18.599



in nineteen sixty four and I went through to get86600:54:18.639 --> 00:54:23.880



my doctorate. Back then, all the smart people that I86700:54:23.920 --> 00:54:32.079



knew were going into professions like psychology or medicine, nursing, education, law.86800:54:34.360 --> 00:54:37.679



They all had a mission to make the community better.86900:54:39.400 --> 00:54:42.679



Sometime after the Vietnam War, sometime around the time of87000:54:42.800 --> 00:54:48.199



Ronald Reagan, the ethos changed to I'm going to make money.87100:54:48.679 --> 00:54:52.119



I'm going to be a successful business person. The smart87200:54:52.159 --> 00:54:58.519



people went to either business school or engineering. Yeah, and87300:54:59.320 --> 00:55:03.920



they know longer had a vested interest in making the87400:55:04.000 --> 00:55:07.599



community better. They came to the notion that they're going87500:55:07.679 --> 00:55:10.920



to make their own lives better. And I think that87600:55:11.039 --> 00:55:15.199



has persisted. I know with even my grandchildren saying to me,87700:55:15.679 --> 00:55:18.320



I have a grandson that graduated high school last week87800:55:18.920 --> 00:55:23.079



and he's going to go to the business school at87900:55:23.079 --> 00:55:25.800



Boston College. And I said, why are you doing that.88000:55:26.559 --> 00:55:28.119



He said, what I mean, why am I doing that?88100:55:28.159 --> 00:55:30.840



He said, I'm really smart. I'm going to be really successful.88200:55:30.880 --> 00:55:33.000



I'm going to make a lot of money. I said,88300:55:33.000 --> 00:55:36.559



but you know what, you are so smart, you are88400:55:36.960 --> 00:55:41.519



so capable of making the world a better place. Why88500:55:41.559 --> 00:55:45.320



aren't you thinking in those terms? He said? Come on, Granddad,88600:55:45.400 --> 00:55:50.159



come on, Grandpa, you're you're you're talking like those those88700:55:50.360 --> 00:55:52.599



hippies of the that you grew up with.88800:55:55.079 --> 00:55:58.159



I don't I mean now that you say it, I mean,88900:55:58.199 --> 00:56:02.719



I do see that there's been less interest in professions89000:56:02.719 --> 00:56:05.920



that actually serve the community or even consider the humanitarian89100:56:05.920 --> 00:56:09.639



effort right. And even the arts is on the decline,89200:56:09.679 --> 00:56:10.360



I believe.89300:56:10.599 --> 00:56:11.880



Yeah, even the arts.89400:56:12.599 --> 00:56:16.159



It's it's sad. And yes, the eighties was the age89500:56:16.280 --> 00:56:18.320



of business, you know, the power suit, the power tie89600:56:18.320 --> 00:56:20.119



of the whole deal. It was all about more and89700:56:20.119 --> 00:56:23.199



more money, you know, so when stock market just it89800:56:23.280 --> 00:56:28.440



was just crazy. Yeah, you may, I think you're onto89900:56:28.440 --> 00:56:30.920



something there, you know. Definitely was a me first attitude90000:56:31.480 --> 00:56:34.079



that really that really started went from.90100:56:33.760 --> 00:56:37.599



A community concern to me first.90200:56:37.800 --> 00:56:44.239



Yeah, absolutely, it was a me first attitude. Let's let's90300:56:44.239 --> 00:56:46.880



get back to California a bit and it's not just California.90400:56:46.920 --> 00:56:49.159



I mean there there was a big organized protest on90500:56:49.239 --> 00:56:53.199



June fourteenth, Trump's birthday or the Army's birthday. However you90600:56:53.239 --> 00:56:57.440



want to look at that, you know what? Good? Let90700:56:57.440 --> 00:56:59.000



me ask you this, what are your what are your90800:56:59.079 --> 00:57:03.320



thoughts of what happened in California? Though, I mean we90900:57:03.360 --> 00:57:08.079



did discuss some of it already, but the fighting, infighting91000:57:08.119 --> 00:57:14.800



between the governor, you know, Newsom, Karen Bass, the lack91100:57:14.840 --> 00:57:17.760



of response. Again, I'm not this isn't This isn't me91200:57:17.840 --> 00:57:21.159



saying right versus left, Trump versus whatever. This is literally91300:57:22.199 --> 00:57:25.159



pointing out I believe the error and the lack of91400:57:25.239 --> 00:57:30.039



response to a situation. What do you think the reasoning91500:57:30.159 --> 00:57:35.760



was behind that? Aside aside from political theater? Why did91600:57:35.800 --> 00:57:39.679



Karen Bass not respond with the police and it didn't91700:57:39.719 --> 00:57:41.239



have to be in a violent way, just to control,91800:57:41.639 --> 00:57:45.719



just have a presence. And why did Governor Newsom not91900:57:46.239 --> 00:57:49.400



respond either? What's your thoughts on that?92000:57:50.079 --> 00:57:52.599



Well? I don't know if I'm the right person to92100:57:52.719 --> 00:57:55.119



respond to that, but sure you are. I thought they92200:57:55.119 --> 00:58:00.960



did respond, Okay, I thought that they were concerned that92300:58:02.079 --> 00:58:04.320



and this is I'm concerned about it in my own community.92400:58:04.559 --> 00:58:11.039



I'm joining an action committee to protect immigrants. That you92500:58:11.119 --> 00:58:16.679



can't have ice come into your community and rip people92600:58:16.880 --> 00:58:19.239



out of their homes.92700:58:19.400 --> 00:58:22.000



We at their jobs. Yeah, we discussed. Agree.92800:58:23.159 --> 00:58:26.800



I think that it was a huge provocation on the92900:58:26.840 --> 00:58:33.840



part of the federal government to start mobilizing. We had93000:58:33.840 --> 00:58:37.239



a situation a couple of weeks ago in Nantucket with93100:58:37.400 --> 00:58:41.320



around that up forty four people who worked in hotels93200:58:41.480 --> 00:58:45.320



and restaurants in Nantucket and put them in a boat93300:58:45.360 --> 00:58:48.639



and took them away. They had no due process. So93400:58:48.679 --> 00:58:55.239



I think their first concern was that you can't you93500:58:55.360 --> 00:58:58.880



can't go into a community and do this without people93600:58:58.960 --> 00:59:05.079



being offended, without people being put in danger. And my93700:59:05.719 --> 00:59:09.519



sense is that there has been a response on the93800:59:09.559 --> 00:59:13.679



part of California government. There was enough police that were93900:59:14.000 --> 00:59:17.880



that kept it contained. There was some bad apples, but94000:59:18.639 --> 00:59:25.199



they mostly contained to a small area. The provocation provocators.94100:59:26.079 --> 00:59:34.239



So I think Trump came in with his guys, escalating94200:59:34.280 --> 00:59:38.159



the crisis to something that was way beyond what we94300:59:38.280 --> 00:59:43.039



really was called for. The National Guard, the Marines.94400:59:44.159 --> 00:59:48.239



The marine should never be deployed on us Soilian citizens period,94500:59:48.840 --> 00:59:50.519



that's not what they do.94600:59:50.360 --> 00:59:52.440



What they do and the same thing what are the94700:59:52.519 --> 00:59:55.960



National Guard doing? Two thousand National guardsmen are protecting the94800:59:56.000 --> 01:00:00.480



federal buildings. Come on, the police have to do this, And.94901:00:00.639 --> 01:00:05.639



That's a bit much, honestly. But the lack of response95001:00:05.719 --> 01:00:07.880



I was referring to was, Yes, the police were there,95101:00:09.239 --> 01:00:12.679



but they did not get deployed until Trump said he95201:00:12.719 --> 01:00:17.639



was going to send the National Guard. Yeah, and even95301:00:18.159 --> 01:00:22.000



Newsom refused to send in the National Guard. Now, I95401:00:22.039 --> 01:00:23.480



agree with you that I don't think there was a95501:00:23.519 --> 01:00:25.800



need for it. There's more more than enough law enforcement95601:00:25.800 --> 01:00:29.519



out there to handle the situation. It really is. Was95701:00:29.559 --> 01:00:32.199



a National Guard needed, I don't believe in this situation,95801:00:32.239 --> 01:00:34.400



But yet they were called in nineteen ninety two during95901:00:34.400 --> 01:00:37.159



the Rodden King riots. There were many examples of when96001:00:37.159 --> 01:00:39.960



the National Guard was called to control riots and protests96101:00:39.960 --> 01:00:43.159



that just got out of hand. Yes, the response to96201:00:43.239 --> 01:00:44.920



the National Guard being sent and taking over of the96301:00:44.960 --> 01:00:47.800



president is a lawful order. And actually, if you go96401:00:47.840 --> 01:00:49.559



to the National Guard's website even says it right there it96501:00:49.559 --> 01:00:51.320



can be called by any time by any governor and96601:00:51.360 --> 01:00:54.159



the president of the United States. So I'm just going96701:00:54.239 --> 01:00:56.000



to put that out there because that is fact. But96801:00:57.360 --> 01:00:59.760



was it needed. No, I don't think so.96901:01:00.039 --> 01:01:05.599



Again, I'm not saying it's illegal. I'm saying it was97001:01:05.679 --> 01:01:13.719



provocative today that the FBI handcuffed through Senator Padilla.97101:01:13.400 --> 01:01:15.079



To the girl. I got to look at that. That's97201:01:15.199 --> 01:01:15.800



that's crazy.97301:01:16.360 --> 01:01:20.239



It's all over the news today and and handcuffed him.97401:01:20.559 --> 01:01:24.360



That's that's not that's not how you treat people. If97501:01:24.360 --> 01:01:28.119



you treat a United States senator that way, how is97601:01:28.159 --> 01:01:32.679



the little guy who works at the local.97701:01:33.480 --> 01:01:37.480



How is it going to feel feel again, it'll be truated. Absolutely. So,97801:01:37.559 --> 01:01:38.960



I didn't see it. I didn't see the reports. You.97901:01:39.000 --> 01:01:40.599



I don't know why I did. This wasn't on my radar.98001:01:40.639 --> 01:01:43.079



It's what I do is it's crazy. So so what98101:01:43.079 --> 01:01:46.280



were the circumstances? Like he was doing nothing other than hey,98201:01:46.280 --> 01:01:48.159



I'm going to question you on what you're doing and98301:01:48.159 --> 01:01:49.480



what's happening. That was it.98401:01:49.599 --> 01:01:54.880



Yeah. Christy Nome, the Secretary of Homeland Security, was speaking98501:01:54.880 --> 01:02:00.000



and talking about how the Democrats failed society. Los Angeles98601:02:00.039 --> 01:02:03.480



would have been burnt down if it wasn't for their response,98701:02:04.280 --> 01:02:07.800



and he walked up and said, I want to ask98801:02:07.840 --> 01:02:12.719



you some questions, and they they man handled him, they98901:02:12.719 --> 01:02:13.480



threw him down.99001:02:13.679 --> 01:02:17.679



They yeah, that's that's not right.99101:02:17.800 --> 01:02:21.280



That's again, it's not right out of hand.99201:02:21.920 --> 01:02:24.360



And that's the problem right now with the Trump administration99301:02:24.679 --> 01:02:27.079



at this moment, they had an opportunity to do the99401:02:27.159 --> 01:02:29.880



right thing. The actions like this does not work in99501:02:29.880 --> 01:02:32.519



a favor. That's just this just supports what people are99601:02:32.519 --> 01:02:37.559



saying about him being authoritarian, tyrannical. It's not a good99701:02:37.559 --> 01:02:38.599



look period.99801:02:39.679 --> 01:02:39.760



No.99901:02:39.840 --> 01:02:42.679



I yeah, I got to look at that. That that100001:02:42.800 --> 01:02:44.880



is just crazy that they treated U Patia that way.100101:02:46.079 --> 01:02:48.599



And you know, even even in the Trump admint like100201:02:48.639 --> 01:02:52.800



my brother's very admin, we're not we're conservative. But even100301:02:52.840 --> 01:02:55.519



he always says on his show is like, I'm conservative,100401:02:55.519 --> 01:02:57.320



but I didn't vote for Trump. That's what he always says.100501:02:57.320 --> 01:02:59.320



He goes. I don't agree with how he handles himself.100601:02:59.320 --> 01:03:03.760



I don't think he's presidential. I don't think he's presidential either.100701:03:04.480 --> 01:03:07.039



And the reality is I like some of the stuff100801:03:07.039 --> 01:03:08.840



he does. But I mean, like I told you, eur100901:03:08.920 --> 01:03:11.760



last crushed my head on a lot, like I don't101001:03:11.800 --> 01:03:15.599



think this is the way, you know, I really don't.101101:03:16.559 --> 01:03:23.119



Again my senses, you need to see people as you101201:03:23.159 --> 01:03:27.400



see yourself, agreed. I mean that says ultimate golden rule, right,101301:03:27.840 --> 01:03:30.519



Tree deficis as you would have them treat you absolutely101401:03:31.000 --> 01:03:33.280



what will need to have a view of the world101501:03:33.320 --> 01:03:36.400



that I am not better or different than you are.101601:03:36.599 --> 01:03:39.239



We both have interests, we both have to take care101701:03:39.280 --> 01:03:39.719



of each other.101801:03:39.719 --> 01:03:41.599



Oh, I absolutely agree with you. I was going to101901:03:41.639 --> 01:03:44.800



say something about the Trump administration and that The other102001:03:44.840 --> 01:03:48.920



thing that stood out is the fumbling of many things102101:03:48.920 --> 01:03:52.679



that were promised that haven't been delivered. You know, we're102201:03:52.679 --> 01:03:55.880



still looking at Epstein files that are allegedly now there's102301:03:55.920 --> 01:03:57.719



no video, there's no evidence. Even though they have like102401:03:57.760 --> 01:04:02.840



a ten plus year investigation regarding Epstein, suddenly nothing exists,102501:04:02.920 --> 01:04:06.360



nothing's viable, we can't release anything. There's nothing there, which102601:04:06.400 --> 01:04:09.280



is ridiculous. And then they give the binders to a102701:04:09.280 --> 01:04:13.679



bunch of social media influencers. You know what kind of102801:04:13.719 --> 01:04:17.320



move was that that there's a lot of stupidity. I102901:04:17.360 --> 01:04:23.039



think that is not winning winning the people over. It103001:04:23.119 --> 01:04:27.639



really isn't. He has some people in his administration that103101:04:27.679 --> 01:04:30.280



should not be in the positions they're in. The one103201:04:30.320 --> 01:04:33.000



thing that was surprising to me is he does have103301:04:33.119 --> 01:04:35.800



some people that were from the Democrat Party that came over.103401:04:35.840 --> 01:04:38.239



But you know those people such as you know RF K.103501:04:38.360 --> 01:04:40.639



Junior and whatnot. Don't feel that they're part of that103601:04:40.639 --> 01:04:44.719



party anymore. But still some of his administration. Even he himself,103701:04:44.760 --> 01:04:48.480



by the way, is not necessarily a true conservative. I103801:04:48.480 --> 01:04:50.599



don't know where he is. I don't even know where103901:04:50.599 --> 01:04:51.039



he sits.104001:04:52.360 --> 01:04:55.920



I mean, where did he come up with this tariff idea?104101:04:57.840 --> 01:05:03.960



I mean it comes from Navarro. Navarro is not a104201:05:04.000 --> 01:05:10.159



credible economist, and he hires Navarro to make this tariff104301:05:10.199 --> 01:05:14.440



policy for him. Where does he come off? And picking104401:05:15.199 --> 01:05:19.480



Hexa as the Secretary of Defense agreed these guys have104501:05:19.639 --> 01:05:21.559



no credibility.104601:05:22.840 --> 01:05:28.920



I I might argue with you in that the whole104701:05:29.000 --> 01:05:30.960



terrif idea. I understand what he was trying to do.104801:05:31.039 --> 01:05:32.440



I'm not saying it was the right thing to do104901:05:32.639 --> 01:05:36.480



in modern times, Okay, but you know, we were a105001:05:36.519 --> 01:05:39.159



tariff nation. This is fact. We did make our money105101:05:39.199 --> 01:05:41.199



on teriffs. But there was also a different world back then.105201:05:41.280 --> 01:05:44.639



It was not as interwoven as it is now. You know,105301:05:44.760 --> 01:05:45.239



of course.105401:05:45.280 --> 01:05:48.159



I mean, you can't make an airplane with parts just105501:05:48.199 --> 01:05:49.280



from the United States.105601:05:49.360 --> 01:05:50.159



Not not gonna happen.105701:05:50.480 --> 01:05:56.599



It's a world economy. It's such a myopic response against simplistic.105801:05:56.199 --> 01:05:59.280



I think Trump's approach was literally, it's a tit for105901:05:59.360 --> 01:06:02.119



tat right, Hey, you're charging me two hundred percent. We've106001:06:02.119 --> 01:06:03.800



done nothing about it. Well, hell, I'm going to charge106101:06:03.800 --> 01:06:07.159



you two hundred percent now. Yeah. Over the countries he106201:06:07.199 --> 01:06:09.880



did that with it's a zero, right.106301:06:09.920 --> 01:06:15.119



Who sell vanilla? And and and agreed. Of course they106401:06:15.119 --> 01:06:17.599



buy more than them, We buy from them.106501:06:18.480 --> 01:06:23.599



Right, stupid. But it's it's a to me, it's a106601:06:23.679 --> 01:06:29.119



race to zero because it's it's meant, it's meant the intention,106701:06:29.519 --> 01:06:31.639



I could, I could read right through it. I understand106801:06:31.639 --> 01:06:34.079



the intention. Oh, this will get people to focus on106901:06:34.159 --> 01:06:37.920



domestic production, things made here in the USA. Yeah, but107001:06:37.920 --> 01:06:39.880



we're not set up for that yet. Like I said earlier,107101:06:39.880 --> 01:06:43.800



he uses a hammer without giving you know, a defined,107201:06:44.320 --> 01:06:47.719



guided step of how to get there. You can't just107301:06:47.719 --> 01:06:50.360



say we're gonna turn it off. Now. I can see107401:06:50.360 --> 01:06:52.880



this being a ten year plan, maybe even a fifteen107501:06:52.920 --> 01:06:55.199



year plan, but it can't be a tomorrow plan. And107601:06:55.199 --> 01:06:58.920



it's just hurting everybody in regards to what everybody says. Look,107701:06:59.800 --> 01:07:02.719



inflation might be dolistic, yeah, exactly.107801:07:02.559 --> 01:07:06.679



Plistic solution to complex problems.107901:07:06.360 --> 01:07:10.440



Agreed, and inflation may be down, But then the economy108001:07:10.480 --> 01:07:14.159



itself is not doing so good right now. You know,108101:07:14.239 --> 01:07:17.199



it really isn't even in my industry. It's like it's108201:07:17.280 --> 01:07:20.039



it's almost like they just suck the air out of it.108301:07:20.039 --> 01:07:22.800



It's it feels almost like pandemic level business right now,108401:07:22.840 --> 01:07:25.039



back in the COVID times for a lot of people108501:07:25.079 --> 01:07:27.920



in my industry and a lot of industries. It's it's108601:07:27.960 --> 01:07:29.559



not my industry too.108701:07:29.719 --> 01:07:34.599



I mean you as well again. Medicine and psychology, the108801:07:34.639 --> 01:07:42.280



whole ancillary medical field is being run by large corporations108901:07:42.280 --> 01:07:45.480



that are making money at the expense of the people109001:07:45.519 --> 01:07:50.039



who need a benefit from these services. Yeah, it's we109101:07:50.119 --> 01:07:51.559



need to rethink things.109201:07:51.719 --> 01:07:53.519



How is how is it to go?109301:07:53.639 --> 01:07:54.320



Unfortunately?109401:07:54.400 --> 01:07:58.840



Ah, I've enjoyed our talk. I was just going to109501:07:58.880 --> 01:08:01.400



get into the insurance part of it. But that's the fine. No,109601:08:01.559 --> 01:08:04.480



I appreciate your time. Tell everybody about your book, where109701:08:04.519 --> 01:08:06.480



they can get it and how they can find you.109801:08:06.559 --> 01:08:12.519



Yeah, it's on all the major outlets. Amazon, you can109901:08:12.559 --> 01:08:20.199



get on it. Most bookstores you can order it through110001:08:20.199 --> 01:08:25.439



their catalogs. I hope people who liked what I've had110101:08:25.479 --> 01:08:28.079



to say and the ideas that I've expressed will go110201:08:28.119 --> 01:08:31.239



out and buy the book. I think it's particularly relevant110301:08:31.239 --> 01:08:32.920



to today's community.110401:08:33.199 --> 01:08:35.239



No, it is, and I'd love to pick this up110501:08:35.239 --> 01:08:36.680



again because it sounds like you and I have a110601:08:36.720 --> 01:08:37.840



lot to talk about.110701:08:38.479 --> 01:08:40.680



Yeah, I'd love to talk with you more. Georgia. I110801:08:41.399 --> 01:08:44.960



think you're being sensible. It's nice to see sensible people110901:08:45.000 --> 01:08:49.159



who are not being driven by some alternative philosophy.111001:08:49.520 --> 01:08:52.000



I appreciate that, and same for you. I mean, it's111101:08:52.039 --> 01:08:53.199



all about what you said. We need to come to111201:08:53.199 --> 01:08:55.600



the table, we need to discuss these issues, and we111301:08:56.119 --> 01:08:57.800



need to live in reality. I mean, we need to111401:08:57.800 --> 01:08:59.439



be realistic about it, but.111501:08:59.439 --> 01:09:00.439



We also need to listen.111601:09:00.600 --> 01:09:04.560



Absolutely, we didn't listen to each other. I agree, absolutely.111701:09:05.000 --> 01:09:08.199



Thank you Evan, and thank you George again.111801:09:08.199 --> 01:09:08.840



It's a pleasure.111901:09:08.840 --> 01:09:12.000



I'm sure we'll talk again, all right, I'd okay, sir,112001:09:13.960 --> 01:09:16.920



all right, as usual, Thanks for sticking around and either112101:09:16.960 --> 01:09:20.920



listening or watching or both, and please like subscribe to112201:09:20.920 --> 01:09:24.720



share the show, and as always, have a great day112301:09:27.000 --> 01:09:31.079



days your content, feel attention.112401:09:31.600 --> 01:09:36.399



Deviltemption stands on my