Aug. 15, 2025

Deric Gilliard - 4 Long Years Working Under The Trump Administration

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Deric Gilliard - 4 Long Years Working Under The Trump Administration
Deric Gilliard - 4 Long Years Working Under The Trump Administration
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Deric Gilliard spent 4 years working for HHS under the Trump administration's 1st term. Deric wrote his book 'The Longest Four Years of My Life', where he details his experiences from the perspective of a Black Man.We had a great discussion which crossed barriers and tackled issues of the underserved communities to racism and racial stereotypes.

Watch the Video Episode:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLuNOPNg9R8&list=PL-wX3htUmL_HdCn1l45wuElnbB7fqs-B6

Chapters:

00:00:00 - Intro 
00:01:52 - Deric Gilliard - Why he wrote, 'The Longest Four Years Of My Life'
00:07:41 - Those in Need - Did Trump Cut Off Access to Healthcare?
00:09:11 - Trump's Assault on the Affordable Care Act
00:15:36 - Affordable Care Act - A Different Perspective
00:19:39 - Obama Care - An Imperfect Solution
00:21:24 - Trump's 1st Term - The Attack on Obama's Achievements
00:22:32 - Trump vs Obama - Truth Behind Cuts to Medicaid
00:25:02 - Working Under Trump - Red Flags and Ignoring those in Need
00:27:50 - Trump - Giving the Order to Abandon those in Need
00:34:12 - COVID Under Trump - Mismanagement and Misinformation
00:37:00 - Anti-Vax - Truth and Opinion
00:39:40 - COVID Vaccine and Distrust under Trump
00:40:39 - Truth about COVID Beginnings and the Lack of Urgency
00:42:04 - COVID Vaccine and the Anti-Vax Movement
00:43:13 - Pandemic Shit Show - Non-Partisan Mistakes
00:45:24 - Trump - A Cold Hearted Lizard
00:47:24 - Trump - No Filter
00:48:30 - Robert F. Kennedy Jr. - Health vs Harm
00:50:41 - Project 2025 - The Alleged Trump Connection
00:52:38 - Racism under Trump's Rule
00:57:37 - White America - Becoming the Minority and the Oppressed
00:58:45 - Middle Eastern People - The New Majority
00:59:19 - Growing Up White - I was the Minority
01:00:14 - America Becomes Racist Again - The Result of Distrust
01:02:32 - Racism - A Learned Behavior
01:03:52 - Angry White Man Syndrome - Cause and Effect
01:08:06 - Mass Shooters are Mostly White - Why?
01:14:55 - Parenting Past and Present - Discipline vs Feelings
01:16:33 - Dividing People through Politics
01:17:05 - Moving to the Center - Holding Presidents Accountable
01:18:20 - Presidential Elections - Qualifications vs Popularity
01:19:21 - Medicaid and SNAP Benefits - Abusing the System
01:19:55 - Big Beautiful Bill - Impact on Rural Hospitals
01:21:05 - Neglecting Rural Communities
01:22:00 - Healthcare Worker Shortages
01:22:59 - Social Security - Lies and the Mishandling of Funds
01:25:22 - Retirement Woes - Educating our Youth to Break the Cycle
01:28:57 - Republican vs Democrat - Finding Sanity in the Center
01:29:40 - Conversations vs Conflict
01:30:12 - Finding Common Ground through Discourse

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WEBVTT

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Where to go after a few few reschedules trying to

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make this happen. Absolutely technical difficulties in the beginning. Anyway,

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we're here. I appreciate your time, uh because you're time different,

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so you're ahead of me. I know you're more like

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in the evening right now, So appreciate that. Uh. You

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caught my attention because I saw that you had that

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new book that that's out. Obviously you see that right

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up there on your screen. However, my finger works, which

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is great because I think it's it's relevant to what's

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kind of been happening, and I really wanted to get

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a first time account from somebody who served under the administration. Uh,

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your tenure was during his first term, and we are

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talking about Trump as everybody should know that. It's where we're going.

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And it's also pretty much all over all over the

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back cover of your book and everything, uh, twenty five

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years and that you that you uh serve right, what

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was what? All this was interesting? I want to I

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want to touch on this too, Derek, if you're okay,

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was your time with HHS. I am going to want

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to get your opinion on Robert Kennedy. What do you

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think of that?

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Absolutely.

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We can go a lot of a lot of ways here,

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but anyway, I do appreciate your time, your your you're historian,

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you you you served in health and human Services, you

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served under the Trump term, You got a lot of experience,

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man a lot of knowledge. So I'm hoping we have

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a great conversation. I'm pretty sure I will. I've watched

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some of your other interviews. There are great a lot

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of a lot of knowledge, a lot of history. So

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that's awesome. But let's let's let's start. Let's start with

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why you felt behooved to write this book, and and

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I think it is relevant because with everything's going on

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right now, it seems like in the Maga movement to speak,

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so to speak, that there's a riff now, like people

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are losing a little bit of trust for maybe thinking, hey,

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promise is made not kept, et cetera. And you may

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have a little insight from your perspective serving under the administration.

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So if you can, why don't you expand on why

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you want to write the book? You already wrote it,

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but what was the motivator?

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Yeah, And to be honest, George, this wasn't something that

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I wanted to do. Now my first book was I

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would consider a labor of Love and just if you

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don't mind me mentioning. Before I went to AHHS, I

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served as the communications director for the organization started by

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doctor King, the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, and he led

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that until his assassination in nineteen sixty eight. And then

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my oldest son started having seizures out of the blue.

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We couldn't figure it out. There's a little organization that

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covered me and didn't give insurance for my family and kids.

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I had to go get coming out of the cold

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and get a job that did and that's what led

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me to AHHS. But this administration, George was very different

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than any of the others I began with Clinton. So

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I worked the last two years of Clinton, Bush, Obama, Trump,

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and Biden and this was a singular seminal experience and

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I could tell it was going to be very different immediately,

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and being a historian and a journalist, I said, I

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need to start writing this down. And it was tough

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for a lot of reasons. It was tough because it

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shook my belief and understanding and concept of who and

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what America is. Because it was just a very different animal,

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and so I knew that it was going to meet

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with a lot of challenges, a lot of people were

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not going to be happy with it, And I think

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he has this. I would say an arm of his

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support is fairly fanatical. I knew that there were imminent

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dangers that I would be risking personally and also the

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people that I cared about, you know, because hey, he

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released six thousand of them from from prison a few

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months ago.

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So lots of things that I thought about.

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But as somebody who again had been mentored under the

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UH the people that served for and with Doctor King,

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I understood I had I felt I had a responsibility,

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and I felt because I was in a unique position

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to write and tell some of the things that I

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experienced and seen and how some of his policies impacted

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people not in the DC Beltway, but out in the

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real world, particularly here in the eighth Southeastern States, where

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which is one of the heartland the center points of

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his support. You think because ike in examples, the way

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Obama had designed Obamacare, the Affordable Care Act, it was

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supposed to be something that all eight states would used

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to expand Medicaid to provide health insurance for people in

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many instances who never had it, and but seven of

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our governor eight governors were against it. They were conservative,

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they were Republican. Even though they had fantastic health insurance,

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they weren't concerned about getting their people health insurance. And

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in many of the instances, some of his base who

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were actually poor white people, and they're more poor white

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people on Medicaid than there are poor black people, quiet

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as it's kept and Latinos, you know, yeah, you know

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what I'm saying. So so they instead of voting, they

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voted against their own best interests to vote with the

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wealthy white guy that was in the governor's mansion, and

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so they didn't expand Medicaid. And so those are some

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of the kind of issues that I dealt with. And

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so I felt compelled as a as a historian and

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a journalist to chronicle this time because I thought it

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was unprecedented in the modern era. So I just started

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keeping a bunch of notes all the things I had

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to write, all of the people I interacted with, and

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I knew I couldn't write it while I was.

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In you know, still in the government.

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And so it's taken a long time because again I

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knew there will be a lot of challenges to it.

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So it's heavily footnoted and heavily resourced, and I think

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it's it's a pretty good viewpoint or encapsulation from three perspectives.

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And I write from the perspective of being a black

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man in America as being somebody who's a Christian, a

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person of faith, and thirdly, somebody who leans into justice

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and believes that you know, this, this, this country, this

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melting pot of a country we had, has been largely

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built by people who you know, have come from all over,

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whether they were brought here, brought here against their will,

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or they immigrants it here. And so I think that

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that's the true America. And I thought that for those reasons,

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and so the history, I thought this was a book

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that would basically be in history departments, African American studies,

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social studies, all these public policy departments. But of course,

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because of the current president's assault on DEI and blackness

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and other things, you know, colleges can't touch it. So

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I'm in a in a strange place. But I did.

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I did it because I thought it was an important

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thing to do, and I was well placed to do it.

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And so somebody had to gotcha. Well, that's a lot

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of reasons. Honestly, it's a lot of reasons. So did

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you did you feel that the administration of the time

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was literally going out of the way to put a

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stop to access to those in need at that time?

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Absolutely? Absolutely? Uh.

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You know, he had the Republicans and largely Donald Trump

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had tried over seventy times in courte to quote unquote

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to overturn the Affordable Care Act. Their whole thing was

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replace and repeal it. They got something better, then we're

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going to kill this and bring in something better.

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And they failed every time.

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And the most famous time was when John McCain got

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up out of his deathbed and you know, when he

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was suffering from cancer and came to vote and he

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did the infamous thumbs down and that was the deciding factor.

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But you know what we find, George, Historically, it's hard

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to take something away from people once you give it

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to him. I think when Medicare first came out people

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a little over sixty years ago, people didn't think it

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was going to be important, it was going to last then.

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And now, of course there's an assault on Medicare, just

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like there is Social Security and Medicaid. All of these

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things are up up in the air in terms of

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how much of there them are going to survive, and

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so I that that was a real big part of it.

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Got it.

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So the the the assault on Medicare. Let's because when

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this originally rolled out, Affordable Care Act, you you worked

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on the inside, So maybe you can enlighten me more

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and what exactly they didn't like. I mean, I have

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a great idea. I'm going to tell you from my

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perspective that I was an entrepreneur for many years and

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had to pay my own health insurance. So I have

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a different view on the whole Affordable Care Act. The

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way it affected someone like me was a lot different,

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But doesn't mean that I don't think everybody should have healthcare.

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So I just want to throw that out there. Just

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we may have different takes on this based on our experiences,

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is what I'm going to get at. So as far

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as as far as what happened there with the administration,

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I'm gonna admit this Trump is a hammer. He's not

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he's not He's not good at he's not good at

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putting a plan together and saying this is how we're

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going to get there. He's just like, no, we're doing

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this now, and this is happening, and then everybody just

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got to figure out how they're going to make it happen,

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and a lot of people do get left out. So

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you know, we have to we have to at least

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admit that, right. It's it's it's not a perfect way

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to run the country, admittedly, and it's not an easy

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thing to deal with, and you dealt with the firsthand.

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So while I can see what he's doing in this term,

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he's done some good things, but now it's like he's

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turning back the other way, and people are kind of like, hey,

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what's going on. I thought you said this, but now

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you're doing the other thing. And so that's why, you know,

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when when you had this book, I'm like, okay, I

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really need to know your perspective, like what did you see,

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Like what did you witness firsthand? And what you stated

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in terms of why you wanted to write the book.

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We're all very valid reasons. I mean, from your perspective,

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everything that you went through, I get it. Now, can

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you explain more to me though the attack on Obamacare,

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Like what was it specifically they were trying to do?

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Because I I was part of the whole thing. When

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we're we're all going through it, right. We want to repeal,

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we want it, we want we write it, we want

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to redo it. But do you know from your perspective

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from working, I mean you were at HHS at the time,

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I'm assuming, so what was it they didn't like?

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Like?

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What about it? Were they really trying to dismantle?

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So there were a couple of things in particular, I

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think one was everybody, whether you were male, even part

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of that. If you chose not to get your health insurance,

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you were assessed essentially, it's like attacks and a lot

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of men didn't like that because they felt like, well.

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I'm never going to get pregnant.

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So like there was something called ten essential Health Benefits,

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and one of them made sure that women's part of

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it was that women could get healthcare and have access

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to all that went into pre natal and postnatal. And

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the guy says, well, some of the guys said, well,

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I'm not going to have a baby, why should I

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pay to help support women do that? So that was

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one concern and people felt, like a lot of them

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that hey, I can choose not to have health care.

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I don't have to and so it was based on

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all these people in being part of the pot, and

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so if people could choose to pull out of the pot,

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they had to pay a penalty. And people felt like, well,

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nobody should be able to tell me I have to

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have health care. It's almost like with the vaccines. Okay,

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a lot of people said, well, look, you're telling me

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if I'm going to go here and be in this environment,

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I can't come there if I don't have a vaccine

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card that says that I had a shot. So I

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understand how people would have an issue on both of

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those fronts. I do because part of being American, I

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think a lot of people say is that you can't

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tell me what to do and what not to do.

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If I choose not to, then I have that right.

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Well, I do understand and have a respect for that perspective.

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I also know that the only way we can help see.

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One of the key things about the Affordable Care Act

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was the part of the tenant central health benefits. It

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was really designed to do preventative care because a lot

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of people in this country who are uninsured would wait

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until they were like half dead, and then they dragged

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themselves to the emergency room, and that care always costs

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three to four times as much because it was acute care.

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You were trying to keep people alive, whereas if you

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have preventative care, you can maybe catch cancer early.

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You can see signs.

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Where you can treat people for obesity, you can prevent

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strokes and heart attacks. So a lot of that was

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what that was designed to do. And you know, you

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have a lot of people, and I'm sure you have

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run across some of these. They're essentially the working for

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and they work every day. Maybe they have a couple

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of gig jobs. Maybe they park cars and they wait tables,

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or they do hair, you know, they do different things,

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but they don't make enough money to have a place

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to live, have transportation, you know, to have insure their car,

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and have health insurance. And so you're putting people in

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I'm not sure we're putting people, but people are in

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a position and in many instances, george' these are the people

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who who make our economy go. You know, they're the

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ones that do things that most of us don't want

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to do. And it makes me think about the immigrant population.

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You know, we're rounding up all these people and most

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of them have no criminal record, have you know, nothing

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that they've done wrong. But they're doing work that most

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Americans are unwilling to do. They're laboring out in the

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hot sun, you know, harvesting our crops, and they're you know,

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cutting our yards and building and doing all these things.

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And so, I you know, that's that's that's when you

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mentioned that, a lot of people said, well, I knew

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it's going to do this. I didn't expect him to

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do that. And I think that some of those are

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what's going on. But yeah, so those were the two

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big objections. Men didn't think that they some men didn't

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think it was fair for them to be charged to

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pay something that they couldn't they were never going to

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benefit from personally. I mean, they could have a wife

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or a girlfriend or something they got pregnant, but they

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weren't going to have to do that. And secondly, they

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didn't like the tax that they had to pay if

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they chose not to get it right.

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Yeah, well, and I think you're correct on that sentiments

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because look where nation were born on rebellions. So what

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you said earlier, I agree with you. And I think

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when Obama, I think when the Affordable Care Act became

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Obamacare when it first rolled out, I think intention was fine.

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I understood it, Uh perspective is what it did, and

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disagree what it did. What I noticed is it really

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eventually price fixed the insurance industry. And here's where I'm

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going with that. No matter where you go to try

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to get a quote, all of a sudden, your price

288
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is the same, no matter what market you go to.

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The only people that were able to benefit from Obamacare

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were those that met a certain threshold in where you

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were within a certain threshold of poverty level. If you're

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self employed, you're pretty much screwed. You didn't really get

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any benefit. It kind of changed that recently. I noticed

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you do get a little something now, even for your

295
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self employed, but it's nowhere near what it used to be.

296
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I remember before the Obamacare thing kicked in, and this

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is before my business was like full time kicked off.

298
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You know, I still had other jobs, but I remember

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my insurance used to be pretty low. Then after Obamacare,

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it was like, there's no way I can afford it.

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It made no difference to me. Now that was not

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everybody's situation. But I'm just giving the perspective from self employed,

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like entrepreneur and I understand why we needed it for

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those that didn't need it, Like if you're at a

305
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certain level of poverty, yeah, you know you need that.

306
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I get that, but it didn't really benefit everybody as

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a whole, and especially when it came down to the pricing.

308
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And again I'm not making this up. I mean, you

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can go to any marketplace right now, punch in your information.

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Doesn't matter if it's under you know, like a California

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government website. It doesn't matter if it's Obamacare or whatever

312
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it is. The insurance industry right now, no matter what

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when it comes to healthcare, you're going to get the

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same price for the package regardless. And that trickled into

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other parts of insurance. But we're talking healthcare right now.

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That's my perspective. By the way, it's just what I experienced.

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So this isn't really like an argument against you. It's

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just this is kind of what I went through. And

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I think a lot of people that were in my

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situation saw that. I think that's what they were opposed to.

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It didn't really seem like a free market anymore. It's

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what it was. I forgot what year it was when

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they were supposed to make it an open market, and

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that never really happened either, especially in California. So when

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we're in California, I was allegedly supposed to be able

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to say, Okay, well, if the markets are open, I'm

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going to go see how much health insurance is in Washington.

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For example, they have an insurance company in Washington. Great,

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I can get a quote from them if they'll still

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cover me where I live. Never happens. As soon as

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you put your information, the IP catches you, says, oh

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you're in California, kicks me right back to the other website.

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So where's the open market? So I think the frustrations

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were really more that stuff. I don't think anybody was

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really against you know, people in need getting actual care.

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I know I wasn't. I thought it was a great idea,

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Like I said, at first, I was like, yeah, this

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just makes a lot of sense. And from my perspective, yeah,

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if I didn't want health insurance, why should I have

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to pay a tax? Yeah, you know, I think that's

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a bit minor in comparison. But I think where the

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sticking point was is when people realize, like, this is

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supposed to be cheaper and more affordable, but I'm not

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really seeing it. And again, that was when you got

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past a certain threshold. So it wasn't applicable to everybody,

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but those that were in a certain spot where your

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employer regards so much we're getting paid, you weren't going

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to make you know, you weren't going to get affordable healthcare.

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School districts are a perfect example of that, right, a

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lot of school districts, they don't always get a good

351
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negotiation when it comes to healthcare. So it's like, okay,

352
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healthcare for you, great, this is how much it is.

353
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But if you want your spouse, it's literally double now.

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So it's a thousand for you, will cover eight hundred.

355
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But if you have your spouse, now it's sixteen hundred

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for her plus whatever you're paying. And people in that

357
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situation didn't really get the advantages. I don't believe. So again,

358
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just a counterpoint just.

359
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Makes sense because and I think that everybody sees it

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from their perspective first exactly you can see it beyond that,

361
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but I mean the main thing is how does it

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impact you and your family? And I get that, and

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so part of I think the problem too is it

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was imperfect. There's no question about it, I think, and

365
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I don't know if you realized this, but seven presidents

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before Obama had tried to pass some form of universal

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health care and for some reason it worked out with him.

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But then the goal should have been, Okay, let's all

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work together to make this better. Like you said, we're

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small businessmen and women are struggling here. What can we

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do to level upon a field so they benefit from

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it too? And but there wasn't that kind of collegiality.

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Like Mitch McConnell of Kentucky at the end of the

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Senate leader at the time, he said his mission was

375
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to make Obama one term president. So I'm saying instead

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of them coming together to work on making it better,

377
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you know, then there was this fight to kill it,

378
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to make it, you know, ineffective. And and that's and

379
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that's I'm not even saying that's a Republican or a

380
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Democratic name, but I'm saying that's something that that really

381
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because in the end, you want the people to benefit.

382
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Yeah, I agree with you, I do, and the and

383
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that's what we wont you, right, there were multiple presidents

384
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who tried to do this, but they weren't able to

385
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make it happen. But I thought it was a good idea.

386
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But like all good ideas, once it gets into play,

387
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you got other people start getting their fingers in their

388
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hands into it and it starts becoming something else. So

389
00:21:14.200 --> 00:21:16.079
I'm not even gonna blame Obama for any of it.

390
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He had a great idea, is just as time went on,

391
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it kind of became something else. I think that's kind

392
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of what led to it. But you know, I do

393
00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:28.960
see where the perspective is is that, yeah, he's attacking

394
00:21:29.200 --> 00:21:33.000
you know, Trump at the time was attacking it without

395
00:21:33.039 --> 00:21:35.359
any cause or just cause. Was just like, I just

396
00:21:35.359 --> 00:21:37.480
don't like Obama, so I'm just gonna repeal everything he did.

397
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And there was a lot of truth to that. By

398
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the way.

399
00:21:40.319 --> 00:21:43.039
Yeah, you remember, I don't know if you remember.

400
00:21:43.119 --> 00:21:46.599
At the well, they call it it's the dinner that

401
00:21:46.640 --> 00:21:48.119
the journalists have every year.

402
00:21:48.160 --> 00:21:48.960
It's a big dinner.

403
00:21:49.160 --> 00:21:55.119
I think, yeah, they spoofed the president, but he actually

404
00:21:55.119 --> 00:21:58.160
Trump was in the audience and he said he pointed

405
00:21:58.200 --> 00:22:00.240
out that Trump was the one that came up with

406
00:22:00.400 --> 00:22:04.279
the birther theory. You know that he wasn't born in America,

407
00:22:04.319 --> 00:22:06.680
and I think you could see trouble over there steaming

408
00:22:06.720 --> 00:22:09.799
at him, and I think he had. I guess I

409
00:22:09.839 --> 00:22:12.079
can say it's an adult program. I made a heart

410
00:22:12.160 --> 00:22:14.920
on to destroy Obama and his legacy after that. I

411
00:22:15.039 --> 00:22:17.960
just really do, because you can tell he's a punitive

412
00:22:18.119 --> 00:22:21.000
He's a kind of guy that's go. He's revenge as

413
00:22:21.079 --> 00:22:24.240
high on his priority list as we can see now

414
00:22:24.279 --> 00:22:27.240
with some of these people he's going after. So yeah,

415
00:22:27.279 --> 00:22:29.240
I think that was part of it. I really do.

416
00:22:30.200 --> 00:22:34.480
I hear you, man, that's but that aside. I mean

417
00:22:34.519 --> 00:22:38.480
that that that that was definitely I think a mis

418
00:22:38.960 --> 00:22:42.839
understood situation came to the Obamacare. My think, my thing

419
00:22:42.839 --> 00:22:45.839
with the whole deal is now everybody says, you know,

420
00:22:45.839 --> 00:22:50.480
they're gutting Medicaid, it's not really being gutted. It's they're putting.

421
00:22:50.599 --> 00:22:52.960
They're putting certain stipulations in there. Now you have to

422
00:22:52.960 --> 00:22:54.519
work so many hours if you want to keep it.

423
00:22:54.559 --> 00:22:56.440
For example, and it literally when it breaks down. I mean,

424
00:22:56.480 --> 00:22:58.720
I could work two hours a day and get Medicaid

425
00:22:58.839 --> 00:23:01.519
if I can. It was really forty hours a month.

426
00:23:02.079 --> 00:23:04.640
It wasn't a lot to ask, but you know it

427
00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:07.720
can be for those who literally are completely immobile. So

428
00:23:08.039 --> 00:23:10.759
what about those people? Right? Some people literally can't leave

429
00:23:10.759 --> 00:23:15.480
the house, So it does hit those people. When the

430
00:23:16.160 --> 00:23:20.920
Affordable Care Act came out, a lot of people don't

431
00:23:20.960 --> 00:23:23.279
even realize or think about this because people do have

432
00:23:23.319 --> 00:23:25.359
short memories and it's all about likes, clicks and whatever

433
00:23:25.359 --> 00:23:29.160
the news cycle is. But Obama actually, let me ver effect.

434
00:23:29.200 --> 00:23:32.559
I don't want to lie to you. Let me see. Yeah,

435
00:23:32.680 --> 00:23:35.119
seven hundred and fifty billion dollars was actually taken for

436
00:23:35.279 --> 00:23:38.960
Medicare when the Affordable Care Act was being rolled out,

437
00:23:39.039 --> 00:23:42.240
and then taxes were raised by a trillion pay for it.

438
00:23:42.599 --> 00:23:47.000
Now we understand why, right, you're trying to change things

439
00:23:47.400 --> 00:23:49.599
and morph it from you know, you're relying on this

440
00:23:49.880 --> 00:23:54.480
certain service, correct Medicaid, and they were trying to put

441
00:23:54.559 --> 00:23:56.920
some of what was offered there into Obamacare. So I

442
00:23:57.039 --> 00:24:00.200
understand it, but we also have to understand that, Know,

443
00:24:00.640 --> 00:24:05.640
it wasn't just one present presently Trump who's targeting Medicaid.

444
00:24:05.680 --> 00:24:07.759
I mean there was many presents before that tried to

445
00:24:07.799 --> 00:24:10.599
do something with medicator even with Social Security. I mean

446
00:24:10.599 --> 00:24:11.799
they're even trying to get rid of it. And it

447
00:24:11.880 --> 00:24:15.519
wasn't just Trump who did it. I'm not a trump Trumper,

448
00:24:15.559 --> 00:24:17.240
by the way, I'm just pointing things out, So I

449
00:24:17.240 --> 00:24:19.440
just want to understand that that I hope you don't

450
00:24:19.440 --> 00:24:22.160
feel that's what I'm doing here now. But I'm just

451
00:24:22.200 --> 00:24:24.759
trying to go over the facts, especially when it comes

452
00:24:24.799 --> 00:24:26.920
to the immigration side, which we can touch on later.

453
00:24:28.240 --> 00:24:29.720
But you know, I don't want to veer too far

454
00:24:29.799 --> 00:24:32.559
off from your book because I also want to get

455
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:35.160
to a lot of the information you have in what

456
00:24:35.240 --> 00:24:37.880
you experienced. We can touch on the other topics later

457
00:24:37.880 --> 00:24:40.680
if you'd like, but getting back to what you wrote,

458
00:24:40.720 --> 00:24:43.200
so I see what you were saying about how you

459
00:24:43.240 --> 00:24:44.599
know when he came in, he was just he was

460
00:24:44.599 --> 00:24:46.240
like a bull in a china shop. He's just like, no,

461
00:24:46.319 --> 00:24:49.200
we're doing this now, And you know, I get hit

462
00:24:49.240 --> 00:24:51.240
the intentions, but he was also leaving a lot of

463
00:24:51.240 --> 00:24:53.880
people to figure it out and go like, what's next? Right,

464
00:24:54.400 --> 00:24:57.279
all of a sudden, my healthcare it's in question, is

465
00:24:57.319 --> 00:24:58.799
it isn't it? Like a lot of people didn't know

466
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:03.440
what's going on. The other things that he did that

467
00:25:03.519 --> 00:25:06.440
you saw, like what else did you experience firsthand while

468
00:25:06.480 --> 00:25:09.920
working in the administration that was really like a red flag?

469
00:25:09.920 --> 00:25:12.599
Feel like, oh, this guy's this guy's nuts, right.

470
00:25:12.759 --> 00:25:13.519
Sure, he's sure.

471
00:25:13.920 --> 00:25:16.519
So one of the things they kept talking about how

472
00:25:16.559 --> 00:25:17.799
bad Obamacare was.

473
00:25:18.039 --> 00:25:19.000
It was terrible.

474
00:25:19.039 --> 00:25:22.680
It was terrible, and they waited till a couple weeks

475
00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:26.440
before open enrollment, so every year there's an open enrollment. Now,

476
00:25:26.480 --> 00:25:29.839
by the way, they cut open enrollment to less than

477
00:25:29.839 --> 00:25:33.079
half of what it was his first year. And the

478
00:25:33.119 --> 00:25:36.039
other thing they did they slashed all the advertising and

479
00:25:36.119 --> 00:25:40.000
promotion to between the third and a half of what

480
00:25:40.119 --> 00:25:44.480
it was, and they prevented our offices from being out

481
00:25:44.599 --> 00:25:49.279
supporting the navigators and the federally qualified health centers. The

482
00:25:49.960 --> 00:25:54.519
people who were out messaging and helping people. The real

483
00:25:54.720 --> 00:25:58.240
people who most needed to help George tended to be

484
00:25:59.000 --> 00:26:02.319
the elderly, the people who were less educated, who were

485
00:26:02.400 --> 00:26:07.440
less computer savvy. Those are the people because health insurance

486
00:26:07.480 --> 00:26:10.559
is pretty complex and so those people needed somebody to

487
00:26:10.640 --> 00:26:14.480
hold their hand and walk them through it. So those

488
00:26:14.480 --> 00:26:18.720
are the people who were going to suffer from not having,

489
00:26:19.039 --> 00:26:21.680
you know, some help from people. And then there were

490
00:26:21.720 --> 00:26:24.480
insurance agents too that help, and of course they were

491
00:26:24.480 --> 00:26:26.960
doing it and making money, but the other people were

492
00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:29.279
doing it because they were just contracted to do it

493
00:26:29.400 --> 00:26:31.880
or they thought it needed to be done. So that

494
00:26:32.079 --> 00:26:35.519
was a real problem because For example, I spent a

495
00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:38.200
lot of time in the state of Mississippi. We had

496
00:26:38.240 --> 00:26:41.079
eight states in the southeast. I was responsible at the

497
00:26:41.119 --> 00:26:44.519
time for four of them. Mississippi was our poorest state.

498
00:26:45.240 --> 00:26:48.440
It was a state that was the least educated, the

499
00:26:48.440 --> 00:26:54.079
most health disparities, It was the blackest state because and

500
00:26:54.119 --> 00:26:57.240
it had the deepest messiges of Jim Crow and slavery.

501
00:26:57.640 --> 00:27:01.799
So there were so many people there who had helped

502
00:27:01.839 --> 00:27:07.680
build over several generations the wealth in this country who

503
00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:10.680
had never had health insurance. And so for us to

504
00:27:10.720 --> 00:27:14.480
not be able to go in and support the mayors

505
00:27:14.559 --> 00:27:17.880
and the county commissioners and people like the Children's Defense

506
00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:23.599
Fund and the National Baptist Convention and the NAACP, those

507
00:27:23.640 --> 00:27:26.079
people who were out there helping people. A lot of

508
00:27:26.119 --> 00:27:28.640
those were doing and weren't getting paid, but they thought

509
00:27:28.680 --> 00:27:31.160
it was important. And so for them to tell us

510
00:27:31.200 --> 00:27:34.920
we couldn't go out and help those people, I thought

511
00:27:35.079 --> 00:27:37.759
was I thought there was problem because it was still

512
00:27:37.799 --> 00:27:40.119
the law of the land. Now, if you had overturned

513
00:27:40.160 --> 00:27:43.039
it and you said no, and hey, no, makes sense.

514
00:27:43.119 --> 00:27:47.359
But to me, how could we defy the law because

515
00:27:47.400 --> 00:27:50.559
you didn't believe or didn't support the system, but you

516
00:27:50.599 --> 00:27:53.400
couldn't overturn it. But you still told us we couldn't

517
00:27:53.680 --> 00:27:54.119
try it.

518
00:27:54.559 --> 00:27:58.119
Okay, So I'm trying to understand your so he at

519
00:27:58.160 --> 00:28:00.680
the time it was still as North Urn.

520
00:28:00.799 --> 00:28:01.599
So that's right.

521
00:28:02.400 --> 00:28:04.960
But at the time they were instructing you, guys.

522
00:28:04.599 --> 00:28:06.440
Not absolutely.

523
00:28:06.759 --> 00:28:10.400
In fact, In fact, one of the key moments, George

524
00:28:10.680 --> 00:28:16.160
was I had to write a letter an email after

525
00:28:16.200 --> 00:28:19.519
what they told us at a meeting. So there are

526
00:28:19.559 --> 00:28:22.079
ten regents in the country. Our region is based out

527
00:28:22.119 --> 00:28:25.480
of Atlanta, and we'd have a meeting usually every week,

528
00:28:25.519 --> 00:28:27.839
and they told us on this meeting they've been hinting

529
00:28:27.920 --> 00:28:30.920
at this, hinting at this, that we were not going

530
00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:33.000
to be able to support we were no longer to

531
00:28:33.079 --> 00:28:35.839
be able to travel and support the people who were

532
00:28:35.880 --> 00:28:39.599
doing it enrollment events and promotional events to help people

533
00:28:39.680 --> 00:28:43.200
understand what had changed. Every year there was some changes

534
00:28:43.279 --> 00:28:47.680
in the law in terms of eligibility, in terms of

535
00:28:48.799 --> 00:28:53.000
who could help you know all of these factors, and

536
00:28:53.079 --> 00:28:57.359
so people who weren't eligible last year were eligible this year.

537
00:28:57.400 --> 00:29:00.200
And by the way, one thing everybody loved about it

538
00:29:00.039 --> 00:29:02.079
it was that you could keep kids on their health

539
00:29:02.079 --> 00:29:06.119
insurance up until a certain age. I can't remember now

540
00:29:06.160 --> 00:29:08.799
that so the people who are still in college could

541
00:29:08.799 --> 00:29:11.480
still be on their parents' health insurance. And that was

542
00:29:11.519 --> 00:29:14.640
something that was loved by both sides of the aisle, remember,

543
00:29:14.720 --> 00:29:15.720
So that's what they did.

544
00:29:15.920 --> 00:29:18.039
Yeah, I remember sixteen, then it went to eighteen, and

545
00:29:18.079 --> 00:29:20.240
then I think it went up to like twenty two.

546
00:29:21.119 --> 00:29:23.359
Yeah, twenty two or twenty three. Yeah, it was, yeah,

547
00:29:23.359 --> 00:29:25.880
it was. It was in the twenties, that was. It

548
00:29:25.920 --> 00:29:30.039
was in the twenties, and so everybody loved that basically.

549
00:29:30.119 --> 00:29:32.880
But so so they told us, for example, I would

550
00:29:32.920 --> 00:29:36.279
have a call in several of our markets. So for example,

551
00:29:36.319 --> 00:29:39.160
I'd have a call with the with the group out

552
00:29:39.160 --> 00:29:43.039
of Montgomery called Alabama Rise, and all of these sister

553
00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:45.799
communities in the whole state would be on that call.

554
00:29:46.319 --> 00:29:50.519
And along with me, I'd have the experts from CMS

555
00:29:50.960 --> 00:29:56.680
from PERSA, the Health ret Resources Services Agency. They fund

556
00:29:57.359 --> 00:30:00.599
and undergird the federally Qualified Health Centers at people don't

557
00:30:00.599 --> 00:30:03.400
know in America, forty percent of the primary health care

558
00:30:03.920 --> 00:30:08.160
provided in this country comes through the federally Qualified Health centers,

559
00:30:08.440 --> 00:30:12.240
and there's some in most communities, and people can go

560
00:30:12.359 --> 00:30:17.079
there even if they're unemployed or underemployed and get primary

561
00:30:17.079 --> 00:30:20.319
health care services based on a sliding ski. If you

562
00:30:20.559 --> 00:30:22.839
fee scale, if you make a little money, you pay

563
00:30:22.839 --> 00:30:23.359
a little money.

564
00:30:23.359 --> 00:30:24.640
If you don't make any money, you.

565
00:30:24.640 --> 00:30:29.559
Still get served and it helps not overwhelm the hospitals.

566
00:30:29.920 --> 00:30:31.920
So these people would be on the phone and if

567
00:30:31.920 --> 00:30:34.400
they ran into a problem, there was a glitch on

568
00:30:35.319 --> 00:30:39.200
a healthcare dot gov or something wasn't working, then my

569
00:30:39.359 --> 00:30:42.039
experts would be there with me and they'd hear it

570
00:30:42.119 --> 00:30:44.240
and they'd take it down and then the problems was

571
00:30:44.319 --> 00:30:46.480
we'd get back to the people with a fix or

572
00:30:46.559 --> 00:30:49.279
go back and fix it on our end. So there

573
00:30:49.400 --> 00:30:52.359
was that kind of communication, and we'd have that every week,

574
00:30:52.960 --> 00:30:55.680
because every week there was a different three theme this

575
00:30:55.799 --> 00:30:59.960
week or let's say this month maybe Latin American money

576
00:31:00.160 --> 00:31:03.359
next to me might bee lgbt Q plus month next

577
00:31:03.440 --> 00:31:07.160
May maybe UH focus on veterans of me, you know,

578
00:31:07.319 --> 00:31:10.559
focus on small businesses, and focus on African American.

579
00:31:11.400 --> 00:31:13.720
So all of these kind of different.

580
00:31:13.559 --> 00:31:18.200
UH the the UH the various like the aai P,

581
00:31:18.480 --> 00:31:25.119
the Native American and Asian American Pacific segment of the community,

582
00:31:25.160 --> 00:31:28.440
and so all that communication was stopped. In fact, I

583
00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:31.799
worked with the lady at CMS centers for Medicare and Medicaid,

584
00:31:31.839 --> 00:31:35.880
and they funded a lot of the they funded the navigators.

585
00:31:36.480 --> 00:31:39.920
And she told me because she wouldn't even they would

586
00:31:40.000 --> 00:31:42.400
send her stuff that we were supposed to send out

587
00:31:42.440 --> 00:31:45.200
to our partners, all of these partners, I tell you

588
00:31:45.240 --> 00:31:47.599
that will be on these calls. And she told me,

589
00:31:47.799 --> 00:31:50.359
I'm not sending anything out because I got two kids

590
00:31:50.400 --> 00:31:53.000
at home who like to eat. Now, I send it

591
00:31:53.000 --> 00:31:55.440
out anyway, because I said, if I'm going to get

592
00:31:55.440 --> 00:31:59.240
fired for obeying the law law the land, then I'm

593
00:31:59.319 --> 00:32:00.720
just gonna have to get fired.

594
00:32:01.480 --> 00:32:03.440
Almost got fired a few times.

595
00:32:03.160 --> 00:32:06.000
And everybody, everybody back then felt like they were working

596
00:32:06.079 --> 00:32:08.440
under threat threat of losing their.

597
00:32:08.839 --> 00:32:11.960
Absolutely absolutely so is a lot of the same things

598
00:32:12.000 --> 00:32:15.640
that are happening now, but this is on steroids. In fact,

599
00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:20.960
one time they told our CMS counterparts in Atlanta that

600
00:32:21.119 --> 00:32:24.359
run the regional office that supply work with all of

601
00:32:24.359 --> 00:32:28.319
these eight Southeastern states, and that would be nursing homes,

602
00:32:28.400 --> 00:32:32.759
that would be assisted living facilities, all of the hospitals

603
00:32:32.799 --> 00:32:35.440
come under their care, all of those any any of

604
00:32:35.480 --> 00:32:41.640
those entities, And they told somebody called her office run

605
00:32:41.680 --> 00:32:44.680
the Trump administration and told them to throw everything out

606
00:32:44.759 --> 00:32:48.119
that said had Obamacare on it. We were to destroy it,

607
00:32:48.319 --> 00:32:51.920
all of the materials that we passed out and used

608
00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:55.079
to help educate people and inform people. So what we

609
00:32:55.160 --> 00:32:57.799
had to do, George. We had to call everybody in

610
00:32:57.839 --> 00:33:01.480
the Metro Atlanta sister community and said if you meet

611
00:33:01.599 --> 00:33:05.640
us down here on the corner, because we'd rather give

612
00:33:05.680 --> 00:33:08.519
it to you and let you use it than to

613
00:33:08.680 --> 00:33:14.119
destroy it. And it was perfectly good, but they didn't

614
00:33:14.119 --> 00:33:16.079
want to have it. So those are the kind of

615
00:33:16.119 --> 00:33:20.640
things that in terms of that that we had to

616
00:33:20.680 --> 00:33:21.160
deal with.

617
00:33:21.559 --> 00:33:23.880
And I'll tell you this is interesting, George.

618
00:33:23.960 --> 00:33:29.799
The day the Healthcare DOCTUV website launched, the first, very

619
00:33:29.839 --> 00:33:37.079
first day of the Affordable Care Act was live, was

620
00:33:37.119 --> 00:33:41.000
the very same day that the government shut down, and

621
00:33:41.039 --> 00:33:44.240
so the website you probably don't remember this, but it

622
00:33:44.279 --> 00:33:47.559
was crashing left and right. It was just being overwhelmed

623
00:33:47.880 --> 00:33:51.240
and the Republicans were loving it because it was looking bad.

624
00:33:51.319 --> 00:33:53.799
It was terrible, and so of course.

625
00:33:53.599 --> 00:33:56.480
I was at the time had a designation that we

626
00:33:56.599 --> 00:33:58.000
still had to work everybody.

627
00:33:58.079 --> 00:33:59.759
Most of our employees were sent home.

628
00:34:00.079 --> 00:34:02.240
We had to work through it, and of course we

629
00:34:02.279 --> 00:34:05.720
couldn't tell our side of the story or the supportive

630
00:34:05.839 --> 00:34:08.079
side of the story, and so they were just getting

631
00:34:08.159 --> 00:34:11.679
lambassad But that was that was one of the crazy things.

632
00:34:11.719 --> 00:34:15.920
And another crazy thing, if we can go here was

633
00:34:16.079 --> 00:34:19.440
I think that he terribly mismanaged COVID.

634
00:34:21.960 --> 00:34:23.159
Uh you know what I mean, I mean.

635
00:34:23.119 --> 00:34:26.239
Go wherever you want. Yeah, I mean, I'm not one

636
00:34:26.280 --> 00:34:27.800
that will not talk about stuff.

637
00:34:27.960 --> 00:34:31.519
I mean, so I think that we when we really

638
00:34:31.559 --> 00:34:34.480
needed a statesman in the White House, we needed somebody

639
00:34:34.559 --> 00:34:37.440
like church Hill or FDR. Because you know, in the

640
00:34:37.559 --> 00:34:41.480
darkest of moments in this country, you need a statesman

641
00:34:41.519 --> 00:34:44.199
who will say, listen, we're in for a hell of

642
00:34:44.239 --> 00:34:47.880
a fight. This is going to be you know, we're

643
00:34:47.880 --> 00:34:50.000
going to lose a lot of people. We got to

644
00:34:50.000 --> 00:34:53.440
come together, there was one and deal with this. But

645
00:34:53.760 --> 00:34:57.119
you remember, he kept saying, well, it's just going to disappear.

646
00:34:57.239 --> 00:35:00.679
It's not that bad. You know, you can check bleach

647
00:35:00.800 --> 00:35:03.440
and you know, you can do all these kind of things.

648
00:35:03.440 --> 00:35:07.440
And so hundreds of thousands of people died that shouldn't

649
00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:15.880
have died because he wouldn't take COVID seriously. And of course,

650
00:35:15.920 --> 00:35:19.119
you know when he finally got COVID, you know, we

651
00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:21.440
know he had the very best of medicine and the

652
00:35:21.599 --> 00:35:24.280
very best of care as a president, and so, yeah,

653
00:35:24.320 --> 00:35:27.119
he's a president, and so I just thought he was

654
00:35:27.239 --> 00:35:32.840
extremely irresponsible. So so much of my book focuses on

655
00:35:32.920 --> 00:35:38.360
these communities, particularly the ones the least, the most vulnerable communities.

656
00:35:38.800 --> 00:35:42.559
In many instances, they were like the margareant workers who

657
00:35:42.679 --> 00:35:45.719
already you know, most of them, many times they lived

658
00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:48.719
in a you might have six or eight of them

659
00:35:48.760 --> 00:35:51.920
in a one or two bedroom apartment. You know, they'd

660
00:35:52.000 --> 00:35:55.280
ride to work together. So they had no protection, and

661
00:35:55.320 --> 00:35:57.239
they didn't A lot of them didn't have health care,

662
00:35:57.280 --> 00:36:00.039
They didn't have a place they could go, and so

663
00:36:00.159 --> 00:36:03.000
they were ravaged people that worked in these meat plants

664
00:36:03.119 --> 00:36:07.840
and these supermarkets. You know, they they just didn't but

665
00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:10.760
they had to be. They weren't like me because I

666
00:36:10.760 --> 00:36:12.360
got to where I could go home and work and

667
00:36:12.400 --> 00:36:14.559
sit in front of my computer like we're doing now.

668
00:36:14.599 --> 00:36:17.119
You know, they were the privileged people and they were

669
00:36:17.159 --> 00:36:20.960
the most vulnerable. And also the people that trusted him,

670
00:36:21.079 --> 00:36:23.400
who said that, well, this isn't real, this isn't going

671
00:36:23.480 --> 00:36:27.880
to happen. So I chronicled dozens of stories, some of

672
00:36:27.920 --> 00:36:31.960
them are best deathbed confessions because they people have said, well,

673
00:36:32.039 --> 00:36:33.679
you know, I didn't think this was real. I didn't

674
00:36:33.719 --> 00:36:36.000
think this was going to have could actually happen to me,

675
00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:39.960
And so I just thought he was very irresponsible in that.

676
00:36:40.119 --> 00:36:43.119
And and what we're going to have in the next

677
00:36:43.159 --> 00:36:45.239
couple of years, and I think it's going to start

678
00:36:45.239 --> 00:36:48.000
this year, George, because all of these people that have

679
00:36:48.119 --> 00:36:52.239
been fired at the CDC, all these people at the

680
00:36:52.360 --> 00:36:57.039
NIH who've been sent packing, and asif the organization that

681
00:36:57.920 --> 00:37:06.599
that of doctors, who who suggests what kind of vaccines

682
00:37:06.960 --> 00:37:11.000
are viable and safe? All of those people, twelve or

683
00:37:11.079 --> 00:37:14.239
thirteen have been replaced. He fired all them, and most

684
00:37:14.280 --> 00:37:16.639
have been replaced. We're talking about Robert Kenned. He had

685
00:37:16.679 --> 00:37:20.199
been replaced by all these vaccine skeptics. And so what

686
00:37:20.239 --> 00:37:23.239
I'm saying is you've seen we've had a resurgence of

687
00:37:23.679 --> 00:37:26.840
measles that's worse than thirty years we thought we had

688
00:37:26.840 --> 00:37:30.280
eradicated measles. That's just the beginning of it. Wait till

689
00:37:30.320 --> 00:37:33.920
the flu and covid comes back with a vengeance in

690
00:37:34.000 --> 00:37:38.039
the fall and you have nobody messaging against it and

691
00:37:38.119 --> 00:37:42.440
telling you to protect yourselves and the vaccines are safe.

692
00:37:42.480 --> 00:37:46.280
And that's an option, so it's gonna be interesting. And

693
00:37:46.320 --> 00:37:47.400
this is just year one.

694
00:37:47.719 --> 00:37:52.280
It is the thing with see Robert Kennedy, he's flip

695
00:37:52.320 --> 00:37:55.320
flopped a lot two on vaccines. You know, he was

696
00:37:55.360 --> 00:37:57.400
completely anti vACC and then he was like, well, no,

697
00:37:57.480 --> 00:38:00.320
I'm four vaccines that are proven. I just don't want

698
00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:06.840
unproven vaccines or untested which makes sense. And then, uh,

699
00:38:06.880 --> 00:38:09.599
the COVID vaccine was was a strange one because it

700
00:38:09.719 --> 00:38:13.000
was very rushed. Okay, and now I'm not an anti VAXX.

701
00:38:13.039 --> 00:38:15.880
If it works and it's proven, then yeah, give it

702
00:38:15.880 --> 00:38:19.599
to me. But the thing with the vaccine, and I

703
00:38:19.599 --> 00:38:20.880
know you know it's because you live through this and

704
00:38:20.920 --> 00:38:23.159
you're on the other side of it, but it was

705
00:38:23.239 --> 00:38:25.599
it was very unproven. It was rushed, and I'm gonna

706
00:38:25.599 --> 00:38:27.360
tell you right now, I know people who died from

707
00:38:27.400 --> 00:38:30.519
getting the vaccine. I know people in the military that

708
00:38:30.800 --> 00:38:32.719
took the Johnson and it was like it was like

709
00:38:32.760 --> 00:38:36.840
a hot shot. So yeah, there was problems with the vaccine.

710
00:38:36.920 --> 00:38:38.920
And now we have studies that are released to actually

711
00:38:38.960 --> 00:38:42.320
say well, now, if you get it, you are under

712
00:38:43.039 --> 00:38:47.719
a risk of myocardar myochi dieters. I can't even talk

713
00:38:47.760 --> 00:38:51.039
right now, but basically the enlarge heart syndrome right, which

714
00:38:51.079 --> 00:38:53.320
a lot of young people are getting. I do not

715
00:38:53.400 --> 00:38:55.159
know why I can't pronounce that word, was so strange,

716
00:38:55.480 --> 00:38:58.559
But anyway, so these things are true. And then Fizer

717
00:38:58.719 --> 00:39:01.440
just had a settle not in the US, but with

718
00:39:01.519 --> 00:39:05.559
multiple countries overseas due to the adverse effects that they

719
00:39:05.920 --> 00:39:09.639
completely denied. So, yeah, there were issues with the vaccine.

720
00:39:09.679 --> 00:39:13.800
But did the vaccine work in some cases? Sure, I

721
00:39:13.880 --> 00:39:16.280
just don't think it was thoroughly tested and that was

722
00:39:16.320 --> 00:39:19.599
what the apprehension was for most people. The problem, though,

723
00:39:19.880 --> 00:39:22.639
which is what I agree with you with, is that

724
00:39:22.800 --> 00:39:26.239
this did. This did stir up the whole anti vax

725
00:39:26.960 --> 00:39:30.000
movement in general, and now we're dismissing things that do work.

726
00:39:30.039 --> 00:39:32.079
Like you said, the measles vaccine. Well, I'm sorry, but

727
00:39:32.119 --> 00:39:34.800
that does work. You know, the flu vaccine works. There's

728
00:39:34.840 --> 00:39:37.079
things that do work but we can't get rid of.

729
00:39:37.159 --> 00:39:38.800
I mean, what do we want to do reintroduce polio

730
00:39:38.840 --> 00:39:40.599
because we don't want to take a vaccine. That's stupid,

731
00:39:40.960 --> 00:39:44.719
makes no sense. But I think the apprehension was like, hey,

732
00:39:44.800 --> 00:39:49.599
here's COVID. Never had it pandemic? I mean, happens every

733
00:39:49.639 --> 00:39:51.360
what every so many hundred a year. Last one was

734
00:39:51.360 --> 00:39:54.119
a Spanish flu, and then here we are, we don't

735
00:39:54.159 --> 00:39:55.760
have a solution. Then all of a sudden, it's like

736
00:39:56.199 --> 00:40:00.559
send it out. Okay, we could put some of that

737
00:40:00.599 --> 00:40:02.599
in the Trump administration for not vetting it, But at

738
00:40:02.599 --> 00:40:05.199
the same time, it was like the whole world needed something,

739
00:40:05.599 --> 00:40:07.679
and we can't deny that a lot of everything that

740
00:40:07.760 --> 00:40:10.039
was going on was also under the advisement of Fauci.

741
00:40:10.119 --> 00:40:12.760
I'm not gonna even not talk about that because that

742
00:40:12.840 --> 00:40:16.559
was a truth. But as the president, he could have

743
00:40:16.559 --> 00:40:19.159
put his foot down. So I don't really have an

744
00:40:19.159 --> 00:40:21.119
answer for that. You know, It's like there's it's a

745
00:40:21.119 --> 00:40:23.159
double edited sword here. It's like, on one hand you

746
00:40:23.159 --> 00:40:24.920
have some truth. On the other hand, like both things

747
00:40:24.920 --> 00:40:27.679
could be true at the same time, right, but both

748
00:40:27.679 --> 00:40:29.599
of them don't necessarily mean they were the right solution.

749
00:40:31.000 --> 00:40:32.400
It was not a good time for any way to

750
00:40:32.400 --> 00:40:34.920
live through. So you did have the people who caught

751
00:40:34.920 --> 00:40:39.519
it that they got the bad version of COVID, and yeah,

752
00:40:40.119 --> 00:40:43.519
people did die. I have a story on COVID because

753
00:40:43.639 --> 00:40:46.000
I'm I'm my business. I'm in the entertainmentdustry. I do

754
00:40:46.039 --> 00:40:49.880
I do a vent production okay, and we all got

755
00:40:49.920 --> 00:40:52.800
it before. We got it in twenty nineteen. Okay, we

756
00:40:52.840 --> 00:40:56.360
got it in about October, because I remember this. Everyone

757
00:40:56.440 --> 00:40:58.360
was getting sick. Everyone was like, hey, it's this weird

758
00:40:58.400 --> 00:41:00.639
flu going around, and everybody's flying in over so we're

759
00:41:00.639 --> 00:41:03.719
like doing like these conventions for like just throwing like

760
00:41:03.719 --> 00:41:06.360
Sam Sung, Sony whatever, and so they're flying people in

761
00:41:06.400 --> 00:41:09.079
from overseas, and then all of a sudden, these large

762
00:41:09.079 --> 00:41:12.239
conventions that are like they're scheduled out a year in advance,

763
00:41:12.239 --> 00:41:13.760
all of a sudden they're just dropping off. And was like,

764
00:41:13.840 --> 00:41:16.920
what's going on, And everybody's saying, well, there's this flu

765
00:41:17.000 --> 00:41:19.599
going around. Well I got it, and I got it,

766
00:41:19.679 --> 00:41:20.679
and I didn't know I had it. I thought it

767
00:41:20.760 --> 00:41:22.880
was a regular flu, and I worked through it on

768
00:41:23.079 --> 00:41:25.199
every damn medication you think you would take for cold

769
00:41:25.199 --> 00:41:28.719
from October through December. I had it for that long.

770
00:41:28.760 --> 00:41:31.119
I just couldn't shake it. And then all of a sudden,

771
00:41:31.400 --> 00:41:35.239
the announcement comes from January, well really around February, right,

772
00:41:35.519 --> 00:41:38.239
and they're like, oh, by the way, this is what's

773
00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:40.960
going on. It's a pandemic. We're like, what you know,

774
00:41:41.039 --> 00:41:43.159
we're already going through this and nobody knew it. But

775
00:41:43.199 --> 00:41:46.199
we're working so hard and busting, you know, working through

776
00:41:46.199 --> 00:41:48.800
it that we didn't we didn't even like register what

777
00:41:48.840 --> 00:41:54.079
it was or what was happening. Uh So once it hit, Yeah,

778
00:41:54.280 --> 00:41:56.400
I you know the way Trump handled his shirt, like,

779
00:41:57.840 --> 00:41:59.639
could he have put his foot down? Could he have

780
00:41:59.679 --> 00:42:02.440
been more apprehensive instead of just trying to say, hey,

781
00:42:02.480 --> 00:42:04.519
this is nothing. Everybody did think it was a flu

782
00:42:04.599 --> 00:42:06.639
back then, but at the same time, it was evident

783
00:42:06.679 --> 00:42:08.119
that it was more than a flu because the whole

784
00:42:08.119 --> 00:42:11.519
world was getting infected by this virus. So yeah, he

785
00:42:11.519 --> 00:42:13.519
could have definitely taken it a lot more serious at

786
00:42:13.519 --> 00:42:18.880
that particular time. And the speed of getting the vaccine out.

787
00:42:19.239 --> 00:42:22.000
We can argue whether that was necessary or not. I mean,

788
00:42:22.079 --> 00:42:25.360
but the reality is it wasn't vetted, it wasn't tested,

789
00:42:26.199 --> 00:42:28.960
and that's why people were apprehensive. That's why a lot

790
00:42:29.000 --> 00:42:32.639
of us were. But from my perspective, I'm not anti vacs.

791
00:42:32.840 --> 00:42:35.239
I'm not going to be that idiot. Right, there's vaccines

792
00:42:35.280 --> 00:42:37.920
that are proven that you just take. They work. When

793
00:42:37.960 --> 00:42:41.320
it came to Robert Kennedy, I get what he was

794
00:42:41.320 --> 00:42:43.599
coming from in terms of health because there are a

795
00:42:43.639 --> 00:42:46.679
lot of adverse health conditions or things that can happen

796
00:42:47.320 --> 00:42:50.800
from certain vaccines. I mean, the biggest part we have.

797
00:42:50.840 --> 00:42:52.480
I don't think it is really our vaccines are food,

798
00:42:52.599 --> 00:42:58.119
quite honest. But because of that, combined with what Robert

799
00:42:58.199 --> 00:43:00.760
Kennedy was saying in the beginning, is what led to

800
00:43:00.760 --> 00:43:04.800
this anti vaxx movement. It's a stupid thing, it really is.

801
00:43:05.440 --> 00:43:07.360
And things are happening. Like you said, all of a sudden,

802
00:43:07.559 --> 00:43:12.559
we have measles. You know what's next, Olio, Like these

803
00:43:12.559 --> 00:43:14.559
are things we shouldn't have. We have proven vaccines that

804
00:43:14.559 --> 00:43:16.440
can take care of it. So I'm in agreeance with you,

805
00:43:16.880 --> 00:43:19.880
But I also needed to, from my perspective, clarify a

806
00:43:19.920 --> 00:43:22.920
little bit of what happened during that period. And I

807
00:43:22.920 --> 00:43:24.920
mean we're not even to talk about health. We can

808
00:43:24.960 --> 00:43:27.800
even get into people who lost their businesses, lost their jobs,

809
00:43:27.800 --> 00:43:30.719
their livelihood. You know, the way the government acted even

810
00:43:30.760 --> 00:43:35.599
after Trump under Biden. So that whole time period was

811
00:43:36.239 --> 00:43:38.760
excuse the wording, but was a shit show for everybody

812
00:43:38.800 --> 00:43:43.079
on all aspects. It really was. But I think you're correct,

813
00:43:43.119 --> 00:43:46.679
and Trump could have been a lot more cautious about

814
00:43:46.679 --> 00:43:48.760
things in the beginning and taking a little bit more serious.

815
00:43:49.079 --> 00:43:51.079
I mean, I understand he didn't want to create panic,

816
00:43:51.199 --> 00:43:53.480
because that's when you're in the government, that's what you

817
00:43:53.519 --> 00:43:55.559
want to do, I think, right, but you don't want

818
00:43:55.559 --> 00:43:58.039
to create panic. If he was to say, hey, this

819
00:43:58.119 --> 00:44:01.400
is very serious, we all can possibly diet, et cetera,

820
00:44:01.519 --> 00:44:03.800
it would have been it would have been just instant,

821
00:44:04.239 --> 00:44:06.480
like forget about it, like we were just been upended.

822
00:44:07.239 --> 00:44:09.599
I would disagree. I would disagree because a lot of

823
00:44:09.800 --> 00:44:12.880
a million people died. Yeah, I've COVID, like I said,

824
00:44:14.079 --> 00:44:18.519
so it was very serious, and particularly for people who

825
00:44:18.519 --> 00:44:21.960
were highly vulnerable, and some of us had some protections,

826
00:44:22.079 --> 00:44:27.119
and so we I think they were sacrificed, honestly. And

827
00:44:27.280 --> 00:44:30.360
I think as a leader, your responsibility is to say,

828
00:44:30.519 --> 00:44:34.480
this is the real situation. We need to do ABC

829
00:44:34.679 --> 00:44:36.760
and D. And they say, I don't have all the answers,

830
00:44:36.760 --> 00:44:39.360
but I want everybody to know that this is serious.

831
00:44:39.519 --> 00:44:43.079
I just don't think that was there because and and

832
00:44:43.199 --> 00:44:47.760
you know, I understand people and their businesses, and so

833
00:44:48.000 --> 00:44:51.639
at some point we have to decide what's the most important.

834
00:44:51.679 --> 00:44:56.480
Is it saving lives or is it is it keeping

835
00:44:56.519 --> 00:44:59.360
businesses open? Or is there a balance that we have

836
00:44:59.480 --> 00:45:04.000
to seek that can preserve both, and there was a

837
00:45:04.119 --> 00:45:07.679
there were funding too, and and there's questions and you know,

838
00:45:07.760 --> 00:45:08.519
we can tell.

839
00:45:08.400 --> 00:45:10.599
That's that's a little bit of a different conversation. But

840
00:45:11.079 --> 00:45:13.199
I agree, I agree with what you said. You know,

841
00:45:13.280 --> 00:45:16.280
he could have been let's just say presidential, because he's

842
00:45:16.320 --> 00:45:19.559
not presidential. He he could have he could have done

843
00:45:19.559 --> 00:45:21.559
a lot better in his messaging.

844
00:45:23.239 --> 00:45:25.199
But you have to care, You have to care about

845
00:45:25.239 --> 00:45:27.880
people for that. Do you think he cares about people?

846
00:45:28.320 --> 00:45:30.440
It's hard to tell, you know, one one day he's

847
00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:32.719
the most carrying guy in the nexus, like, hey, you know,

848
00:45:32.840 --> 00:45:33.679
screw you.

849
00:45:33.679 --> 00:45:35.880
You know, I would love to see one of those

850
00:45:35.920 --> 00:45:38.840
instances where he's the most carrying guy, because I personally

851
00:45:38.920 --> 00:45:41.679
haven't seen that. And if you can, you can know,

852
00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:47.320
I know, really I don't see compassion in this man,

853
00:45:47.480 --> 00:45:48.719
and I could be wrong.

854
00:45:49.639 --> 00:45:53.159
Well we can only hope, uh that you're wrong, you know,

855
00:45:53.199 --> 00:45:56.599
because if he is really as an incompassionate, if he's

856
00:45:56.679 --> 00:45:59.840
if he's basically just some cold hearted lizard, that that

857
00:46:00.039 --> 00:46:02.360
could be a very bad thing in certain situations for sure,

858
00:46:02.719 --> 00:46:06.119
you know, And if if he becomes reactionary, especially what's

859
00:46:06.159 --> 00:46:10.000
going on in the geopolitical stage right now, uh, we

860
00:46:10.039 --> 00:46:13.400
can get into a whole lot of trouble, right, you know.

861
00:46:13.480 --> 00:46:16.280
And and right now he was trying to avoid wars.

862
00:46:16.440 --> 00:46:18.400
He's not we're not really in one, but we are,

863
00:46:18.480 --> 00:46:20.480
but we're not, like that's that's a whole different deal.

864
00:46:21.000 --> 00:46:23.119
But but two wars.

865
00:46:23.159 --> 00:46:26.960
Actually, yeah, well this is my wheelhouse. So we can

866
00:46:27.000 --> 00:46:29.599
go on with this for a long time. But let's

867
00:46:29.679 --> 00:46:33.119
let's let's let's both agree on this. I think in

868
00:46:33.159 --> 00:46:35.280
the beginning he didn't take it serious enough when kme cover,

869
00:46:35.840 --> 00:46:38.159
I agree with you, And I think the whole anti

870
00:46:38.280 --> 00:46:43.400
vaccine came from the apprehension of taking something that wasn't tested,

871
00:46:43.679 --> 00:46:46.119
is what it was. We can't deny we didn't need

872
00:46:46.199 --> 00:46:47.159
something though we did.

873
00:46:47.760 --> 00:46:51.960
But and it actually west tested, but they didn't have

874
00:46:52.960 --> 00:46:56.199
a year, right right, you know. And and I'll tell

875
00:46:56.239 --> 00:46:58.079
you this, George, you probably wouldn't know this. We have

876
00:46:58.199 --> 00:47:00.199
been preparing for a pandemic.

877
00:46:59.719 --> 00:47:03.800
For you years. It's always part of the of the plane.

878
00:47:03.880 --> 00:47:06.199
It's always part of Yeah.

879
00:47:05.599 --> 00:47:07.360
You do, but a lot of your listeners won't.

880
00:47:07.360 --> 00:47:10.000
Oh no, yeah, correct, Yeah, a lot of people don't

881
00:47:10.000 --> 00:47:13.639
realize that. Yeah, it was interesting, man, it was definitely interesting.

882
00:47:14.039 --> 00:47:14.199
You know.

883
00:47:14.239 --> 00:47:16.519
I can't imagine how it was working under the administration

884
00:47:16.599 --> 00:47:18.679
at that time. I mean, and especially God, Like I said,

885
00:47:18.719 --> 00:47:20.880
some guy who's I mean, you're used to You're used

886
00:47:20.920 --> 00:47:23.480
to very stately people, and then this person comes in.

887
00:47:23.559 --> 00:47:26.000
It's it's like, what are you doing?

888
00:47:26.480 --> 00:47:30.119
You'll appreciate this George Uh every morning, So I'm a

889
00:47:30.199 --> 00:47:32.960
late night person, I'm using that an early morning person.

890
00:47:33.199 --> 00:47:35.360
About four.

891
00:47:36.000 --> 00:47:40.079
Uh, this thing would go off and I subconsciously start

892
00:47:40.440 --> 00:47:44.760
groping for my phone on my nightstand to look to

893
00:47:44.800 --> 00:47:46.679
see what he's tweeted out that night.

894
00:47:46.760 --> 00:47:49.000
And I'm gonna have to react to the next day.

895
00:47:49.400 --> 00:47:50.000
You know what I'm saying.

896
00:47:50.840 --> 00:47:54.159
That was what he did, right, That was how he communicated. Yeah,

897
00:47:54.239 --> 00:47:56.840
and usually when you think about it, let's let's bring

898
00:47:56.920 --> 00:48:01.760
in the history has done that as a nobody nobody

899
00:48:01.800 --> 00:48:04.559
And guess what, I think he'll agree with this. Had

900
00:48:04.679 --> 00:48:08.760
had they been able to take his twitter, his phone,

901
00:48:09.119 --> 00:48:12.800
he would have had two consecutive presidencies because I mean,

902
00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:18.519
he created enough turmoil himself to lose narrowly that first time.

903
00:48:18.719 --> 00:48:21.559
You know, he would have had to, you know, because

904
00:48:21.559 --> 00:48:24.239
he shot himself in the foot, like in Georgia when

905
00:48:24.239 --> 00:48:27.800
he called up and said, I just need eleven thousand

906
00:48:27.920 --> 00:48:31.480
and how many votes? Yeah, so you know these these

907
00:48:31.840 --> 00:48:36.360
and the thing about Kennedy to me is he's not

908
00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:41.360
taking a medical course, has no medical degrees. And he

909
00:48:41.559 --> 00:48:47.320
told the Republican Senator Kennedy out of Louisiana that he

910
00:48:47.320 --> 00:48:51.199
would not dismantle this task force, and one of the

911
00:48:51.199 --> 00:48:53.519
first he just did it. A couple of weeks ago.

912
00:48:53.559 --> 00:48:56.360
He dismantled that task force. So he straight up lied

913
00:48:56.559 --> 00:48:59.280
about what he was going to do. And I don't know,

914
00:48:59.320 --> 00:49:02.679
we've never had that's somebody that had no medical pack background.

915
00:49:02.719 --> 00:49:04.440
I'm not saying that he doesn't know anything, and I

916
00:49:04.440 --> 00:49:09.280
don't I'm not saying that some of his beliefs don't

917
00:49:09.280 --> 00:49:12.760
have some truth to them. I think that, you know,

918
00:49:12.920 --> 00:49:16.800
everything doesn't have to be one hundred percent straight scientific

919
00:49:16.840 --> 00:49:17.880
and medical.

920
00:49:18.039 --> 00:49:20.960
But you can't be able to rely on people smarter

921
00:49:21.079 --> 00:49:24.039
than you, right, absolutely, Yeah, you know I'm with you

922
00:49:24.079 --> 00:49:26.079
on this. I mean, you've got to rely on your advisors.

923
00:49:26.079 --> 00:49:28.559
You can, you can have the ability to manage and supervise,

924
00:49:28.639 --> 00:49:30.079
but if you don't have people around to them know

925
00:49:30.119 --> 00:49:33.880
more than you there or are specialists that you refer

926
00:49:33.960 --> 00:49:37.400
to or defer to. What's the point, yes, it doesn't

927
00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:39.239
make any sense. You need to take all the information

928
00:49:39.480 --> 00:49:41.599
and you need to get it together. You need to

929
00:49:41.639 --> 00:49:44.280
go through it, extrapolate it, and go all right, based

930
00:49:44.280 --> 00:49:47.119
on everything's going on. Even using scientific method as you will,

931
00:49:47.800 --> 00:49:50.199
you can go based on the patterns and everything we're

932
00:49:50.199 --> 00:49:52.119
getting out of all these tests, this is the direction

933
00:49:52.199 --> 00:49:56.000
we need to go. It's but you can't wing it.

934
00:49:56.159 --> 00:49:56.719
You can't.

935
00:49:57.119 --> 00:49:59.199
It's like, I don't know if you remember this is

936
00:49:59.320 --> 00:50:01.960
about to it months ago, but the city of Milwaukee

937
00:50:02.039 --> 00:50:05.480
called the CDC because they were having this huge land

938
00:50:05.559 --> 00:50:08.360
outbreak in their school systems.

939
00:50:08.760 --> 00:50:09.800
They called the CDC.

940
00:50:10.559 --> 00:50:14.239
Okay, they called the CDC, and the CDC couldn't send

941
00:50:14.280 --> 00:50:17.719
anybody because he had come in and fired everybody that

942
00:50:17.800 --> 00:50:23.519
does lead remediations. So those are the kind of things.

943
00:50:23.880 --> 00:50:26.480
You know, our safety nets are just being ripped away

944
00:50:26.519 --> 00:50:29.000
from us, and there's gonna be a price to pay

945
00:50:29.280 --> 00:50:32.039
because in the end, we're still gonna have to end

946
00:50:32.119 --> 00:50:35.800
up paying for all these people who just yeah, but

947
00:50:36.480 --> 00:50:38.920
there's nothing preventative going on.

948
00:50:39.480 --> 00:50:41.440
And so those are some of the issues.

949
00:50:42.440 --> 00:50:44.679
And then it's like what was happening Dan is we're

950
00:50:44.679 --> 00:50:48.639
getting repeated now under his term they didn't learn the lesson.

951
00:50:48.559 --> 00:50:51.880
And on steroids because now he has a roadmap project

952
00:50:51.880 --> 00:50:54.639
twenty twenty five. Do you know that the guy that's

953
00:50:54.679 --> 00:50:56.760
over oh PM and I'm trying to remember his name,

954
00:50:56.800 --> 00:51:00.960
who's the principal architect of Project twenty twenty five wrote

955
00:51:01.000 --> 00:51:03.960
that every time a federal employee walked in the door,

956
00:51:04.079 --> 00:51:05.840
he wanted them to feel terror.

957
00:51:07.400 --> 00:51:10.920
Now what kind of human being says something like that.

958
00:51:11.199 --> 00:51:13.679
Yeah, I'm I'm familiar with Uh. I didn't read through

959
00:51:13.719 --> 00:51:15.599
the whole twenty twenty five, but when all this was

960
00:51:15.639 --> 00:51:18.400
going around, I looked into it and it's like, on

961
00:51:18.440 --> 00:51:20.840
the surface, the whole thing was it has this landing

962
00:51:20.880 --> 00:51:23.039
page like oh, we're training the future leaders, and then

963
00:51:23.039 --> 00:51:25.960
it was really a book or roadmap of how to

964
00:51:26.000 --> 00:51:31.280
turn everything conservative and keep power. And yeah, I don't

965
00:51:31.360 --> 00:51:33.159
I don't agree with the book or at tactics. I

966
00:51:33.159 --> 00:51:35.639
know J. D Vance just says that he the stones

967
00:51:35.760 --> 00:51:38.159
or doesn't doesn't support it. I don't know if there

968
00:51:38.199 --> 00:51:40.400
was an actual connection between what Trump's went in twenty

969
00:51:40.400 --> 00:51:42.719
twenty five, though they've never really made that connection.

970
00:51:43.639 --> 00:51:46.400
But I mean, I think I think you, I must

971
00:51:46.440 --> 00:51:49.039
suggest you go back and read it and you will

972
00:51:49.039 --> 00:51:52.280
see a clear connection, because I think that's a roadmap

973
00:51:52.320 --> 00:51:53.119
that they're following.

974
00:51:53.679 --> 00:51:55.079
It could be I'll look at it.

975
00:51:55.239 --> 00:51:55.480
You know.

976
00:51:55.519 --> 00:51:58.079
I'm not opposed to it, you know, I just don't

977
00:51:58.239 --> 00:52:01.039
think that they've ever made that connection. But at the

978
00:52:01.039 --> 00:52:03.519
same time, who knows, Man, you definitely could be correct.

979
00:52:03.559 --> 00:52:05.559
I I could look into that and see what's happening.

980
00:52:06.280 --> 00:52:09.519
So hey, it's all about learning things to get educated, right,

981
00:52:09.679 --> 00:52:10.840
I don't want to stay in the dark.

982
00:52:10.719 --> 00:52:12.519
Here, That's right, That's right.

983
00:52:12.639 --> 00:52:18.440
Yeah, Let's let's move on to what else you experienced.

984
00:52:18.559 --> 00:52:21.400
And you know, obviously everything everything that happened with the

985
00:52:21.440 --> 00:52:24.239
way they were handling health care, for example, which greatly

986
00:52:24.519 --> 00:52:26.519
impacted you because that's what you did. We're working for

987
00:52:26.679 --> 00:52:30.000
HHS and trying to help people through this time period

988
00:52:30.039 --> 00:52:34.800
this change. What about the and I'm bring this up

989
00:52:34.800 --> 00:52:36.920
because I did see it on some of your description

990
00:52:37.079 --> 00:52:40.400
and your about the book. What what was going on

991
00:52:40.480 --> 00:52:43.559
in terms of how you thought or how while a

992
00:52:43.559 --> 00:52:47.199
lot of people did that the Trump Trump himself maybe

993
00:52:47.199 --> 00:52:48.960
I don't know if it was the entire administration, they

994
00:52:48.960 --> 00:52:52.119
were actually believed to be racist or a lot of

995
00:52:52.119 --> 00:52:54.760
things they said were racist or came across that way.

996
00:52:55.519 --> 00:52:55.679
And.

997
00:52:57.159 --> 00:52:59.639
I see how because he has no damn filter, he

998
00:52:59.679 --> 00:53:03.000
doesn't ye And I can see how that was taken

999
00:53:03.119 --> 00:53:05.920
back then because look, there's a lot of times we're like,

1000
00:53:06.599 --> 00:53:08.800
what did you say? And then now he's trying to

1001
00:53:08.800 --> 00:53:11.920
turn the corner. But then I don't know. You can

1002
00:53:11.960 --> 00:53:14.559
explain it better I think than I can. But because

1003
00:53:14.559 --> 00:53:18.320
you've experienced it from your perspective, what did you what

1004
00:53:18.440 --> 00:53:22.840
did you experience, what did you feel? And what did

1005
00:53:22.840 --> 00:53:24.800
people tell you? More important, because I'm sure you got

1006
00:53:24.840 --> 00:53:27.920
feedback from people that you worked with and what they

1007
00:53:27.920 --> 00:53:29.679
heard and how things were happening and what they what

1008
00:53:29.719 --> 00:53:30.800
they heard in the communities.

1009
00:53:31.480 --> 00:53:33.880
Sure, yeah, I'll say this.

1010
00:53:35.159 --> 00:53:40.280
You know, when the justice marches really grew in intensity

1011
00:53:40.519 --> 00:53:49.039
after George Floyd's killing h Breonna Taylor arm Marbury, a

1012
00:53:49.159 --> 00:53:53.639
much of largely unarmed black men and police stops, and

1013
00:53:53.719 --> 00:53:58.159
particularly the public execution of George Floyd nine minutes and

1014
00:53:58.199 --> 00:54:05.039
forty seven seconds captured broad daylight, which brought a broad

1015
00:54:05.159 --> 00:54:10.079
range of Americans out into the streets. Well, for us,

1016
00:54:10.199 --> 00:54:14.960
we had the only all black career staff, the four

1017
00:54:15.000 --> 00:54:19.280
of us that worked for the appointee, and I've worked

1018
00:54:19.280 --> 00:54:25.800
with three different appointees under the Trump administration, and he

1019
00:54:27.280 --> 00:54:32.559
made that the Justice Marches be about patriotism in the flag.

1020
00:54:32.719 --> 00:54:35.199
And it was not about patriotism in the flag. It

1021
00:54:35.320 --> 00:54:39.519
was about the overpolicing of honor on black men. And

1022
00:54:39.599 --> 00:54:43.159
so when like Kaepernick took a knee and that became

1023
00:54:43.199 --> 00:54:46.079
a thing in the NFL, what did he say, Fire

1024
00:54:46.119 --> 00:54:47.159
those sons of bitches?

1025
00:54:47.239 --> 00:54:47.440
You know?

1026
00:54:47.599 --> 00:54:50.480
He said, And he said when you arrested people, he

1027
00:54:50.639 --> 00:54:54.519
wanted them to be treated roughly. And so that's why

1028
00:54:54.719 --> 00:54:59.119
I questioned his humanity. I don't know if you know

1029
00:54:59.239 --> 00:55:02.719
that back in to day his family has been charged

1030
00:55:03.519 --> 00:55:09.360
numerous times for discrimination in housing in some of their

1031
00:55:09.400 --> 00:55:14.800
properties in terms of how they you know, discriminated against

1032
00:55:14.920 --> 00:55:18.239
against black people. I think he and so for us,

1033
00:55:18.559 --> 00:55:22.320
for me, some of the things I saw, I could

1034
00:55:22.360 --> 00:55:24.159
not help. But I had a job to do and

1035
00:55:24.199 --> 00:55:25.960
I did it. I did it well, but I could

1036
00:55:26.039 --> 00:55:29.079
not help but take some of that. Personally, I think

1037
00:55:29.119 --> 00:55:32.039
he's the most divisive president that we've had in the

1038
00:55:32.039 --> 00:55:37.440
modern era. Latinos were rapists in THEEVESE and the China

1039
00:55:37.519 --> 00:55:42.960
virus and the this thing against the squad and the

1040
00:55:43.000 --> 00:55:45.920
black the black led black black bron cities.

1041
00:55:45.960 --> 00:55:48.239
He was very, very divisive.

1042
00:55:48.800 --> 00:55:51.800
I don't remember anything that he did or said that

1043
00:55:52.000 --> 00:55:56.519
was unifying. And he was he was people want to

1044
00:55:56.519 --> 00:55:59.280
say stupid. I think he's brilliant in what he does.

1045
00:55:59.360 --> 00:56:04.920
He's he's magnificent in being divisive and othering, making people

1046
00:56:05.719 --> 00:56:09.519
see the other as the enemy, somebody else's enemy. And

1047
00:56:09.599 --> 00:56:11.599
so for us, for example, one of the job of

1048
00:56:11.760 --> 00:56:17.159
responsibilities we had was to try and locate and vet

1049
00:56:17.679 --> 00:56:22.039
places that were willing to house these unaccompanied children in

1050
00:56:22.079 --> 00:56:26.159
these camps from people that were separated from their families

1051
00:56:26.199 --> 00:56:28.880
at the border. And I can see both sides of

1052
00:56:28.920 --> 00:56:32.039
the immigration issue, I really can. I do think there

1053
00:56:32.079 --> 00:56:36.639
needs to be a process and a procedure, but I

1054
00:56:36.679 --> 00:56:40.519
also think that we can treat people as human beings.

1055
00:56:40.800 --> 00:56:42.719
And I think that people who want to come here

1056
00:56:43.000 --> 00:56:46.679
ninety plus percent of them, probably ninety five percent of them,

1057
00:56:46.800 --> 00:56:50.199
only want to work hard, live a free life, and

1058
00:56:50.280 --> 00:56:53.320
make some money they can send home to their families.

1059
00:56:53.320 --> 00:56:56.480
That's most people. And so we're rounding up them up

1060
00:56:56.519 --> 00:57:00.400
in the they're running in the fields away from police now,

1061
00:57:00.440 --> 00:57:03.440
and they're just they're at parks and they're you know,

1062
00:57:03.599 --> 00:57:08.079
at landromats, working in car washes and they're getting rounded up.

1063
00:57:08.079 --> 00:57:10.199
And most of these people and they don't get a

1064
00:57:10.199 --> 00:57:12.840
lot of the benefits, but they still have to pay taxes.

1065
00:57:13.199 --> 00:57:16.920
So for me, when I saw the treatment of some

1066
00:57:16.960 --> 00:57:22.079
of these people, it reminded me too much of slavery.

1067
00:57:22.159 --> 00:57:24.599
It reminded me too much of the Jim.

1068
00:57:24.400 --> 00:57:29.280
Crow era where people were mistreated because they look differently.

1069
00:57:29.360 --> 00:57:33.840
And to me, what makes America great is the diversity

1070
00:57:33.880 --> 00:57:36.920
that we have. And it really is a multi melting pot.

1071
00:57:37.000 --> 00:57:40.000
And I'll tell you this, George. I think a lot

1072
00:57:40.039 --> 00:57:41.719
of white America and not a lot of it, not

1073
00:57:41.800 --> 00:57:44.440
most of it by any means, maybe a third of

1074
00:57:44.480 --> 00:57:48.559
it is really concerned because this is becoming a minority

1075
00:57:48.639 --> 00:57:52.880
majority country and supposedly right around twenty forty two ish

1076
00:57:53.400 --> 00:57:55.840
it's going to be that. And I think that for

1077
00:57:55.960 --> 00:58:02.239
some people who live in these monogamous, these homogeneouses, they

1078
00:58:02.280 --> 00:58:05.280
live in a society that's all white or all black

1079
00:58:05.400 --> 00:58:08.880
or all you don't ever have an interaction with other people,

1080
00:58:08.880 --> 00:58:12.719
and it's easy to demonize him and make them out

1081
00:58:12.800 --> 00:58:15.000
to be the boogeyman and the bad guy. And I

1082
00:58:15.039 --> 00:58:18.159
think that there is this element of white America that

1083
00:58:18.400 --> 00:58:24.239
is afraid that they will be treated like other people

1084
00:58:24.559 --> 00:58:27.880
have been treated in the last you know, one hundred

1085
00:58:27.880 --> 00:58:32.039
and fifty two hundred, four hundred years. And so there's

1086
00:58:32.079 --> 00:58:37.119
that fear and nobody wants to share power or share

1087
00:58:38.360 --> 00:58:42.880
you know, control. But that's the country where we're moving

1088
00:58:42.920 --> 00:58:43.880
towards rapidly.

1089
00:58:45.440 --> 00:58:49.840
Gotcha, Well, there is a there is a there is

1090
00:58:49.840 --> 00:58:53.039
a power dynamic. There's going to be a shift. But

1091
00:58:53.119 --> 00:58:55.760
I don't think it's kind of come from the black

1092
00:58:55.800 --> 00:58:58.039
community or the Latino community. Is going to be coming

1093
00:58:58.079 --> 00:59:00.599
from those from the Middle East that are coming into

1094
00:59:00.639 --> 00:59:06.039
the United States. Just look at statistics. They're birthing at

1095
00:59:06.119 --> 00:59:08.440
a rate that it was two to five times more

1096
00:59:08.480 --> 00:59:09.719
than any other culture or.

1097
00:59:09.760 --> 00:59:14.360
Race period, really more than Oh yes they are. So

1098
00:59:14.960 --> 00:59:17.599
I'm learning to see we got all big will.

1099
00:59:17.760 --> 00:59:20.599
Yeah, if anything, it's gonna come from from that side.

1100
00:59:20.639 --> 00:59:23.239
But you know, what you said earlier is very correct.

1101
00:59:23.239 --> 00:59:26.760
If you're if you're living in a community that is

1102
00:59:27.159 --> 00:59:30.760
all white, all brown, you're not doing yourself a service

1103
00:59:30.800 --> 00:59:34.000
because you're not you're not really connecting with other cultures

1104
00:59:34.000 --> 00:59:35.440
and other communities whatsoever.

1105
00:59:36.119 --> 00:59:36.320
You know.

1106
00:59:36.400 --> 00:59:39.559
I I've always had a different take because you know,

1107
00:59:39.760 --> 00:59:44.039
white there you go. But you know, when I grew up,

1108
00:59:44.079 --> 00:59:46.239
I I was a minority. So the schools I went to,

1109
00:59:46.639 --> 00:59:49.039
I was around all the gangs, all the Mexican gangs.

1110
00:59:49.360 --> 00:59:51.400
My friends were black, they were brown. I didn't have

1111
00:59:51.440 --> 00:59:54.039
a lot of white people around me. I was the

1112
00:59:54.119 --> 00:59:56.119
one in fights every day. I was the one getting jumped.

1113
00:59:56.199 --> 00:59:57.719
I was the one going through all that stuff. But

1114
00:59:57.719 --> 00:59:59.960
it didn't make me hate anybody. You know, my friends

1115
01:00:00.000 --> 01:00:02.480
we're all Indian, they're all they're all people from Mexico.

1116
01:00:02.719 --> 01:00:05.360
I have black friends, Like, it doesn't really matter to

1117
01:00:05.400 --> 01:00:07.119
me your skin color. But I also think that's a

1118
01:00:07.159 --> 01:00:08.599
lot that has to do with a lot of the

1119
01:00:08.679 --> 01:00:10.840
gen X, the way they grew up, the way I

1120
01:00:10.880 --> 01:00:15.119
grew up. Our generation didn't care. We we we were

1121
01:00:15.199 --> 01:00:19.639
all thrown together because at that time we interacted with everybody.

1122
01:00:19.679 --> 01:00:21.840
We didn't we we didn't we didn't grow up to

1123
01:00:21.960 --> 01:00:24.559
think that we should treat anyone else differently because of

1124
01:00:24.599 --> 01:00:28.039
how you looked. But somehow we got back to that

1125
01:00:28.719 --> 01:00:31.360
now and I don't understand why or how that happened.

1126
01:00:31.639 --> 01:00:34.599
Well, I think it's very comp fosters that kind of

1127
01:00:36.079 --> 01:00:39.960
belief and kind of again, there's it's fear mongering. It's

1128
01:00:40.039 --> 01:00:45.400
like with the Willie Lynt back during the President Reagan era.

1129
01:00:45.639 --> 01:00:49.039
You know, you you can you can demonize people, and

1130
01:00:49.079 --> 01:00:52.400
you can put fear in people. There's this element anyway,

1131
01:00:52.480 --> 01:00:55.000
and especially one of the things about you and and

1132
01:00:55.199 --> 01:00:57.840
and as you grew up, George, you'll you'll say this,

1133
01:00:57.840 --> 01:01:01.239
It is true. I'm sure because you spent time with

1134
01:01:01.280 --> 01:01:02.559
all these different kind of people.

1135
01:01:02.679 --> 01:01:04.079
You all saw each other's people.

1136
01:01:04.159 --> 01:01:06.719
You I mean, you all pretty much basically all wanted

1137
01:01:06.760 --> 01:01:10.039
the same thing. And you see the humanity and other people.

1138
01:01:10.079 --> 01:01:12.639
But if you don't know them, it's easy for somebody

1139
01:01:12.679 --> 01:01:15.400
to paint them a different way. And one of the

1140
01:01:15.440 --> 01:01:20.800
things that became normalized during the Trump administration was do

1141
01:01:20.840 --> 01:01:28.480
you remember Mikelly and conwell way she talked about alternative facts. Now,

1142
01:01:28.519 --> 01:01:32.199
things are true or they're not true, but you know so,

1143
01:01:33.119 --> 01:01:35.159
but that that was you know what I'm saying, Come on,

1144
01:01:35.239 --> 01:01:36.920
what the hell is an alternative?

1145
01:01:38.159 --> 01:01:39.679
I agree with you, that doesn't make me sense.

1146
01:01:40.000 --> 01:01:43.519
And so yeah, so so I'm saying now you almost

1147
01:01:43.639 --> 01:01:45.559
don't know who or what to believe.

1148
01:01:45.679 --> 01:01:46.599
And think about it.

1149
01:01:46.639 --> 01:01:50.400
Back during the Spanish Flu just over one hundred years ago,

1150
01:01:50.480 --> 01:01:53.719
now one hundred and five years ago, you could see

1151
01:01:53.719 --> 01:01:56.639
pictures in New York and big cities where people were

1152
01:01:56.679 --> 01:02:01.800
lined up for miles to get that because they believe

1153
01:02:01.920 --> 01:02:05.519
their government and they trusted Who do we trust Now?

1154
01:02:05.880 --> 01:02:08.760
I'm saying we got the where you don't trust anybody,

1155
01:02:08.840 --> 01:02:12.280
and that's a scary thing to be. And so what

1156
01:02:12.320 --> 01:02:17.920
we found historically, George, is that great societies usually aren't

1157
01:02:17.960 --> 01:02:21.800
destroyed from without, it's from within. And I can see

1158
01:02:21.800 --> 01:02:25.079
you can see us headed that way.

1159
01:02:25.360 --> 01:02:28.719
Yeah, they killed themselves. Same thing with the Greeks, you

1160
01:02:28.760 --> 01:02:32.960
know it was it wasn't outside influence. Yes, the uh.

1161
01:02:33.360 --> 01:02:36.199
The thing that's crazy to me about racism, this is

1162
01:02:36.239 --> 01:02:38.360
what I hate is you see it all the time.

1163
01:02:38.639 --> 01:02:41.320
You can get two babies, you can film them different

1164
01:02:41.320 --> 01:02:44.280
skin colors. They're babies. They will play and interact, they

1165
01:02:44.280 --> 01:02:44.920
don't even care.

1166
01:02:45.119 --> 01:02:46.760
Yeah, absolutely, it's.

1167
01:02:46.639 --> 01:02:49.280
The influence as they grow up that makes them that way.

1168
01:02:49.320 --> 01:02:52.360
And it's sad that as humans that that even still exists,

1169
01:02:52.400 --> 01:02:55.599
that we would even have these biases and and and

1170
01:02:55.639 --> 01:02:59.280
inflect into a young mind that you're supposed to look

1171
01:02:59.320 --> 01:03:01.679
at this other person and different. But I can understand

1172
01:03:01.679 --> 01:03:04.840
it too, because if you're if you're unfortunate to be

1173
01:03:05.440 --> 01:03:08.679
of the race where you're always getting beaten and looked

1174
01:03:08.719 --> 01:03:11.119
down on your whole life, and throughout generations, it kind

1175
01:03:11.159 --> 01:03:13.760
of does carry over. You have that distrust. So it's

1176
01:03:13.800 --> 01:03:16.000
like trying to fix that. I don't even know how,

1177
01:03:16.079 --> 01:03:18.159
but it's it's just as a There's a topic that

1178
01:03:18.599 --> 01:03:23.119
I discussed with another person a few months back, and

1179
01:03:23.159 --> 01:03:25.320
we went down this whole road and we were just

1180
01:03:25.559 --> 01:03:28.239
scratching our heads as like why can't why can't we

1181
01:03:28.280 --> 01:03:32.800
get rid of this way of thought? Like why it

1182
01:03:32.960 --> 01:03:35.039
just it would be so much better if we just

1183
01:03:35.400 --> 01:03:39.000
looked at people as people, period. And I'm really just

1184
01:03:39.119 --> 01:03:40.880
tired of you know, when I just when I think

1185
01:03:40.880 --> 01:03:43.159
things are settled, I open up, you know, acts for

1186
01:03:43.239 --> 01:03:45.679
the news is like headline you know, another racial like

1187
01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:48.760
come on, or are we still doing this? It's it's

1188
01:03:48.760 --> 01:03:51.559
so stupid. Are we not past that? It doesn't make

1189
01:03:51.599 --> 01:03:52.119
any sense to me?

1190
01:03:53.599 --> 01:03:55.760
I'd like to ask something to you that you would

1191
01:03:55.800 --> 01:04:00.119
have better insight than me, maybe, And that is there

1192
01:04:00.199 --> 01:04:03.400
seems to be this singer syndrome of this angry young

1193
01:04:03.400 --> 01:04:03.880
white man.

1194
01:04:04.440 --> 01:04:05.400
Yeah you know what I mean.

1195
01:04:05.559 --> 01:04:11.599
And and I think that it's like, for example, black

1196
01:04:11.599 --> 01:04:14.719
people in this country, and I'm talking in broad terms,

1197
01:04:14.840 --> 01:04:19.199
but have been uncomfortable for kind of forever in a

1198
01:04:19.239 --> 01:04:21.639
lot of ways. You know, nobody comes over this country

1199
01:04:22.199 --> 01:04:24.719
to be like a black American.

1200
01:04:24.800 --> 01:04:25.079
We're not.

1201
01:04:25.320 --> 01:04:29.119
We're only the model if it's athletics or entertainment in

1202
01:04:29.159 --> 01:04:32.079
some instances, but nobody cut that's not the goal. But

1203
01:04:32.800 --> 01:04:36.880
I'm saying, but yeah, so now though, when things might

1204
01:04:36.920 --> 01:04:40.760
get a little tough for young white men who basically

1205
01:04:40.920 --> 01:04:44.119
have been at the top of the pecking order for

1206
01:04:45.559 --> 01:04:48.599
you know, ever since Custer Road out west.

1207
01:04:48.920 --> 01:04:50.559
You know, it's it's, it's it.

1208
01:04:51.119 --> 01:04:54.800
And then I think you see that raige being exposed

1209
01:04:55.039 --> 01:04:59.039
in some of these incidents that we have, And I

1210
01:04:59.159 --> 01:05:03.000
just wondered if you any thoughts about that, because it's it's.

1211
01:05:02.639 --> 01:05:05.639
I kind of well, I do, and I don't because

1212
01:05:05.679 --> 01:05:08.159
I'm not necessarily young anymore. I guess I'm in that

1213
01:05:08.239 --> 01:05:11.519
mid mid part right right. But I could see the

1214
01:05:11.559 --> 01:05:13.880
frustration from both sides. I mean, the same thing that

1215
01:05:14.039 --> 01:05:17.639
frustrated the black men for being, you know, held back.

1216
01:05:18.199 --> 01:05:20.880
You know, think about the time when you know, black

1217
01:05:20.920 --> 01:05:22.840
men were very successful. There was a time they were

1218
01:05:22.880 --> 01:05:25.159
able to do whatever they wanted to do. And make money,

1219
01:05:25.480 --> 01:05:27.880
and then the mortgage companies were redlining them, so you

1220
01:05:27.880 --> 01:05:30.039
couldn't even buy a house, you know, or you couldn't

1221
01:05:30.039 --> 01:05:32.920
get in a certain district or in a certain area,

1222
01:05:33.119 --> 01:05:36.280
you know. So I think the frustrations are are shifting.

1223
01:05:36.320 --> 01:05:38.639
Now it's not as bad for white people. But I

1224
01:05:38.679 --> 01:05:43.280
think what happened, and what you're saying is that I

1225
01:05:43.320 --> 01:05:47.800
think the newer generations, they weren't brought up under that. Okay,

1226
01:05:47.840 --> 01:05:50.239
they're just being exposed to what they're told is going

1227
01:05:50.239 --> 01:05:53.679
on or what happened, and I think there's an older

1228
01:05:53.719 --> 01:05:57.199
generation that will not let it go and all of

1229
01:05:57.239 --> 01:06:00.000
these these these these feelings and everything just getting drug

1230
01:06:00.400 --> 01:06:02.239
and they don't know how to deal with it. And

1231
01:06:02.320 --> 01:06:07.159
so it's I think that possibly not speaking for everybody,

1232
01:06:08.239 --> 01:06:10.119
possibly some of the some of the younger white men,

1233
01:06:10.119 --> 01:06:13.480
as you're saying, maybe they do feel frustrated because they're

1234
01:06:13.480 --> 01:06:15.400
trying to do the right thing, but every time they do,

1235
01:06:15.519 --> 01:06:18.119
they're being reprimanded for not doing the right thing the

1236
01:06:18.280 --> 01:06:22.599
right way, and and there's no place for them, they feel,

1237
01:06:23.119 --> 01:06:26.360
you know. But then that's also the sentiment for anybody

1238
01:06:26.360 --> 01:06:29.599
of any color economically right now, you know, you can't

1239
01:06:29.599 --> 01:06:31.679
afford to buy a home no matter who you are.

1240
01:06:32.199 --> 01:06:34.920
But when when it comes to the racial argument of

1241
01:06:34.920 --> 01:06:37.280
what we're talking about in terms of race, I think

1242
01:06:37.360 --> 01:06:39.559
I think what it is, they just they just feel

1243
01:06:39.599 --> 01:06:43.760
that there's nothing they can do that'll be right. Okay,

1244
01:06:44.360 --> 01:06:46.440
if if if you want to confront a person of

1245
01:06:46.480 --> 01:06:48.880
color about something, if they have a let's let's just

1246
01:06:48.880 --> 01:06:50.280
be on. I don't care what color. If you're doing

1247
01:06:50.280 --> 01:06:52.880
something stupid, why can't you be corrected? Why can't you

1248
01:06:52.880 --> 01:06:56.239
just say hey, you know what? And and I don't

1249
01:06:56.239 --> 01:06:59.119
think a white, young white kid can do that. They

1250
01:06:59.159 --> 01:07:02.199
if they see a black or a brown person or whoever,

1251
01:07:02.320 --> 01:07:04.679
did you see a mexicanos like, well, ma, way guy,

1252
01:07:04.800 --> 01:07:06.440
I don't know if I could actually comfortably go over

1253
01:07:06.440 --> 01:07:08.559
there and you know, say something, because all of a

1254
01:07:08.559 --> 01:07:10.639
sudden it's like, oh, you're being a racist? What are

1255
01:07:10.639 --> 01:07:13.440
you doing? And that's what's been going on. So I

1256
01:07:13.440 --> 01:07:14.000
can see.

1257
01:07:14.599 --> 01:07:19.599
And I think that's I think that's partly a generational thing, George.

1258
01:07:19.679 --> 01:07:22.519
And what I mean by that example, like say, if

1259
01:07:22.559 --> 01:07:25.800
I'm riding downtown to an event or something on the

1260
01:07:25.800 --> 01:07:29.400
bus and if I see these young guys and they're

1261
01:07:29.480 --> 01:07:33.320
usually black, guys in where I live in Atlanta, you know,

1262
01:07:33.360 --> 01:07:37.199
one of the black cultural mecas, and they're you know,

1263
01:07:37.519 --> 01:07:39.960
pants are halfway down their butt and they're cutting. And

1264
01:07:40.360 --> 01:07:43.199
I'm there with my wife or my daughter. I wanted

1265
01:07:44.039 --> 01:07:48.280
to ask them to can you have some respect? But

1266
01:07:48.480 --> 01:07:51.239
you know, I might get shot or cut, you know,

1267
01:07:51.280 --> 01:07:56.880
and so I where As thirty years ago they say

1268
01:07:56.800 --> 01:07:58.960
it is there my bad too and so, but today

1269
01:07:59.039 --> 01:08:01.639
I may get cussed out or jumped on or anything.

1270
01:08:01.719 --> 01:08:05.599
So yeah, I mean, you're right, that's the society that

1271
01:08:05.639 --> 01:08:06.679
we have devolved to.

1272
01:08:06.840 --> 01:08:10.119
Unfortunately. But well, I will say, and I'll ask you this.

1273
01:08:12.159 --> 01:08:15.840
I haven't seen It does happen every once in a while,

1274
01:08:15.880 --> 01:08:19.439
but you don't usually see young black guys going into

1275
01:08:19.720 --> 01:08:25.840
grocery stores killing twelve people in the churches, in the kmarts,

1276
01:08:26.199 --> 01:08:29.680
into these places that's into synagogues.

1277
01:08:30.159 --> 01:08:31.960
That's what I'm talking about.

1278
01:08:32.319 --> 01:08:35.039
That whereas you know, I'm not happy, and and hell

1279
01:08:35.119 --> 01:08:38.000
I'm gonna you're gonna you're not gonna be happy either.

1280
01:08:38.079 --> 01:08:39.720
That's a yeah.

1281
01:08:39.600 --> 01:08:43.880
I can address that a bit. First off, we already

1282
01:08:43.880 --> 01:08:51.199
know white people are crazy, so whatever. But no, I

1283
01:08:52.159 --> 01:08:53.760
don't know if this is true in the black community.

1284
01:08:54.479 --> 01:08:57.079
But with white people, let's just be honest, they're hooked

1285
01:08:57.119 --> 01:09:01.760
on pills. Period. I think think pharmaceuticals is the issue.

1286
01:09:02.279 --> 01:09:06.640
You for saying that, because that's that's relevatory to me.

1287
01:09:07.359 --> 01:09:10.680
Every kid, most any white family. You go to a

1288
01:09:10.720 --> 01:09:14.359
doctor if they have if they're not interested in what

1289
01:09:14.399 --> 01:09:16.039
you're showing them, or they're not doing some a certain

1290
01:09:16.039 --> 01:09:18.039
way right now, they all of a sudden they got ADHD,

1291
01:09:18.039 --> 01:09:19.960
they have something else. They want to put them on

1292
01:09:20.000 --> 01:09:22.199
a pill. Then that that pill has another effect, and

1293
01:09:22.239 --> 01:09:23.960
they want to put them on another one. I think

1294
01:09:23.960 --> 01:09:29.800
we're in this, this this very strange cycle, a perpetual

1295
01:09:30.319 --> 01:09:33.399
manipulation of the chemistry of your brain. To be honest,

1296
01:09:33.960 --> 01:09:36.640
and this this goes way. I mean, this goes back

1297
01:09:37.520 --> 01:09:39.239
a long time. And I'm sure you know this. You

1298
01:09:39.319 --> 01:09:41.600
probably already know this. You're just letting me talk. But

1299
01:09:41.960 --> 01:09:44.760
the reality is, I think that's what's going on when

1300
01:09:44.720 --> 01:09:46.239
you when you're talking about like, why is it always

1301
01:09:46.239 --> 01:09:49.199
the white person these young white kids. I think they're

1302
01:09:49.239 --> 01:09:51.960
just medicated. They're so medicaid and their brains are just

1303
01:09:52.000 --> 01:09:55.479
so rewired from being all these medications. I don't recall

1304
01:09:55.520 --> 01:10:00.359
personally from the black friends I have. They traditionally aren't

1305
01:10:00.399 --> 01:10:03.920
really about medicating with pills. From my record, like, I

1306
01:10:03.960 --> 01:10:05.800
don't know if I'm right on that, but I never

1307
01:10:05.880 --> 01:10:07.960
saw a bunch of bottles like if it was diabetes

1308
01:10:08.039 --> 01:10:10.079
or maybe a heart pill. But it wasn't like, hey,

1309
01:10:10.119 --> 01:10:11.760
you need to take this for your attention deficit or

1310
01:10:11.760 --> 01:10:13.640
you need to take that. I didn't really see that,

1311
01:10:15.039 --> 01:10:16.840
And I'm not sure if I'm correct. I mean, maybe

1312
01:10:16.880 --> 01:10:18.640
you can tell me, but I think it was more

1313
01:10:18.760 --> 01:10:20.960
on the white side that they were just like, oh, yeah,

1314
01:10:20.960 --> 01:10:22.800
I give me that pill, I need this. Oh my

1315
01:10:22.840 --> 01:10:25.520
son is crazy. He just he won't sit still, he

1316
01:10:25.560 --> 01:10:27.279
won't read the book. He doesn't want to do math. Well,

1317
01:10:27.319 --> 01:10:29.520
who wants to do math? Like come on, you know?

1318
01:10:29.960 --> 01:10:31.600
But I think that was part of it. I think

1319
01:10:31.600 --> 01:10:33.520
that's a big part of it. And then you combine

1320
01:10:33.560 --> 01:10:35.760
that with what we were talking about earlier to where

1321
01:10:35.920 --> 01:10:38.479
they're feeling like where's my place. I can't be a

1322
01:10:38.479 --> 01:10:43.039
white man anymore. I'm feminized, right, I can't. I can't

1323
01:10:43.039 --> 01:10:44.840
be a man. I have to act this way. I

1324
01:10:44.880 --> 01:10:47.399
have to be a feminized person. I'm not talking about transfer,

1325
01:10:47.479 --> 01:10:51.319
just saying like how you act, and it's I think

1326
01:10:51.359 --> 01:10:53.399
all of that just comes to a head. It really does.

1327
01:10:53.439 --> 01:10:54.800
And I think that's why you see more like the

1328
01:10:54.840 --> 01:10:58.399
white kids going crazy. It's it's a combination of the pharmaceuticals.

1329
01:10:58.600 --> 01:11:01.479
They're over medicated, they don't don't know their place, They

1330
01:11:01.520 --> 01:11:03.840
got to be super careful on how they interact with everybody.

1331
01:11:03.880 --> 01:11:06.640
They don't have anywhere to turn, and then boom, you know,

1332
01:11:07.000 --> 01:11:09.439
fu was ignites and then they just blow up. So

1333
01:11:11.119 --> 01:11:15.239
it's not always just specific to white kids. But we

1334
01:11:15.479 --> 01:11:17.680
got admit, I mean the majority, yeah, I mean that's

1335
01:11:17.680 --> 01:11:20.560
what's been happening. But we just we just had, you know,

1336
01:11:20.600 --> 01:11:22.159
a group of Middal Easterns to go ahead and shoot

1337
01:11:22.199 --> 01:11:26.640
up a Christians Christian church. We just had a guy

1338
01:11:26.640 --> 01:11:29.760
from Iran try to burn Jewish people in Colorado. You know,

1339
01:11:30.840 --> 01:11:34.000
there's crazy everywhere. But what you're talking about with the schools, yeah,

1340
01:11:34.000 --> 01:11:36.279
you're right. I mean, you can't deny that it's always

1341
01:11:36.279 --> 01:11:39.359
a white kid with a gun. Why. I think a

1342
01:11:39.359 --> 01:11:40.800
lot of it has to do with what I said,

1343
01:11:41.319 --> 01:11:44.760
I really do you know, the white child, the white

1344
01:11:44.880 --> 01:11:48.399
kid going back. I think it's all the pill stuff

1345
01:11:48.399 --> 01:11:50.920
I started later in my generation. I think it just

1346
01:11:51.000 --> 01:11:55.279
came down to just being in this cycle of we

1347
01:11:55.319 --> 01:11:59.479
need to medicate them. We can't deal with this kid. No,

1348
01:11:59.479 --> 01:12:02.000
nobody really did long term studies of the side effects,

1349
01:12:02.000 --> 01:12:03.520
and now that they know them, they don't really want

1350
01:12:03.520 --> 01:12:05.600
to back off because now the pharmaceutical industry is making

1351
01:12:05.600 --> 01:12:07.079
too much money on it that I could stop it.

1352
01:12:07.600 --> 01:12:11.279
I I had, I had another guy on here that

1353
01:12:11.479 --> 01:12:14.520
was a DEA agent, and we actually had a discussion

1354
01:12:14.520 --> 01:12:18.039
about this, and he echoed everything I said and more. Uh,

1355
01:12:18.119 --> 01:12:20.840
everything started with a big pharma and and we actually

1356
01:12:20.840 --> 01:12:22.720
had some of the same discussion, you know, in terms

1357
01:12:22.760 --> 01:12:24.560
of what you just asked me, and he believed the

1358
01:12:24.560 --> 01:12:27.199
same thing. He's like, it's it's medication, you know, it

1359
01:12:27.239 --> 01:12:29.079
really is. He said, if you look at the if

1360
01:12:29.119 --> 01:12:34.439
you look at the statistics of when certain diagnoses of

1361
01:12:34.600 --> 01:12:38.880
conditions came out, it all started way back when the

1362
01:12:38.880 --> 01:12:42.520
pharmaceutical industry took hold. You know, it's all started during

1363
01:12:42.600 --> 01:12:46.960
during the opioid epidemic and ever since then. Sorry, white

1364
01:12:47.000 --> 01:12:47.520
kids are crazy.

1365
01:12:47.600 --> 01:12:48.199
It just happened.

1366
01:12:48.640 --> 01:12:51.880
Just what happened. And and he discussed this whole thing.

1367
01:12:52.239 --> 01:12:54.960
And I don't know if this this necessarily crossed over

1368
01:12:55.000 --> 01:12:57.279
into to to the black culture or you know, the

1369
01:12:57.279 --> 01:12:59.800
Black community or or the Asian community, I'm not sure

1370
01:12:59.800 --> 01:13:03.159
that they are on medication and pills as much as

1371
01:13:03.359 --> 01:13:04.359
the families are.

1372
01:13:04.560 --> 01:13:05.840
Yeah, you're right, You're right.

1373
01:13:06.119 --> 01:13:08.039
And I will say one of the things that I

1374
01:13:08.119 --> 01:13:11.079
think Trump did try to do well and put a

1375
01:13:11.119 --> 01:13:16.439
lot of energy in to was addressing the opioid epidemic.

1376
01:13:17.600 --> 01:13:20.319
I mean, it's just totally out of control, and COVID

1377
01:13:20.960 --> 01:13:27.119
exacerbated it because people were alone, and it made a

1378
01:13:27.159 --> 01:13:31.000
lot of things worse, even like human trafficking because you know,

1379
01:13:31.520 --> 01:13:34.039
you couldn't go out and interact and so it was

1380
01:13:34.079 --> 01:13:37.880
easier to keep people controlled and keep people medicated and

1381
01:13:37.920 --> 01:13:40.479
all of those things were kind of on steroids.

1382
01:13:40.920 --> 01:13:45.000
Well, everybody was depressed. Yeah, they were turning too something.

1383
01:13:45.000 --> 01:13:47.520
If they weren't turned to alcohol, they were turned to pills.

1384
01:13:47.760 --> 01:13:51.199
You know, for the it's either that or marijuana, right,

1385
01:13:52.159 --> 01:13:55.680
you pick your poison. But alcohol is more than poison.

1386
01:13:55.720 --> 01:13:58.760
But you know what I'm saying. And so it really

1387
01:13:58.880 --> 01:14:01.720
that did exacerbate. It really did not make things better

1388
01:14:01.880 --> 01:14:04.880
at all. So that was that was a very bad period.

1389
01:14:04.920 --> 01:14:07.319
But yeah, I think I think we have a real

1390
01:14:07.399 --> 01:14:11.520
opioid epidemic. I think that the reality is you know,

1391
01:14:12.199 --> 01:14:15.399
one one pill literally it chemically rewires your brain. It

1392
01:14:15.439 --> 01:14:19.039
does it either is meant to suppress something or it's

1393
01:14:19.119 --> 01:14:22.600
meant to add and make your brain produce more period

1394
01:14:22.800 --> 01:14:25.279
you know, is it made to affect your nervous system

1395
01:14:25.359 --> 01:14:27.760
or suppress your nervous system. Like everything you do to

1396
01:14:27.800 --> 01:14:30.079
your body, when it comes to this, there's going to

1397
01:14:30.119 --> 01:14:33.119
be a reaction that may not be positive over time,

1398
01:14:33.199 --> 01:14:35.039
and now you have to take another pill to counteract

1399
01:14:35.079 --> 01:14:38.039
that one. There's just too much junk in our bodies,

1400
01:14:38.119 --> 01:14:40.000
you know, all the way from our food to to

1401
01:14:40.000 --> 01:14:42.359
to Like I said, OPI ways, and I don't want

1402
01:14:42.359 --> 01:14:44.720
to get stuck on this, but I'm I'm thinking that

1403
01:14:44.720 --> 01:14:48.760
that is a very valid reason as to why you're

1404
01:14:48.800 --> 01:14:51.960
seeing people act the way they do. I really do.

1405
01:14:52.079 --> 01:14:54.520
Oh, thank you that that that's helpful. That's helpful.

1406
01:14:54.960 --> 01:14:56.560
It's just like some of them might come down that

1407
01:14:56.680 --> 01:14:58.359
some of that may come down to parenting.

1408
01:14:58.399 --> 01:15:00.239
And of course there's lots of there is that too.

1409
01:15:00.560 --> 01:15:04.279
Yeah, there's lots of things to challenge on parenting, certainly

1410
01:15:04.359 --> 01:15:07.439
I know in the black community. So but yeah, a

1411
01:15:07.479 --> 01:15:09.720
lot of that because it's like, well, let me just

1412
01:15:09.760 --> 01:15:12.439
do this. I don't have to deal with that. Yeah,

1413
01:15:12.439 --> 01:15:13.520
I'll tell you what.

1414
01:15:14.600 --> 01:15:16.560
I'm sorry, I was gonna say, we can't deny the

1415
01:15:16.640 --> 01:15:20.720
kids lately, uh or or even in honestly, even in

1416
01:15:20.760 --> 01:15:23.039
the white Community's just be quite honest, a lot of

1417
01:15:23.079 --> 01:15:25.279
parents when they were working, they really weren't giving the

1418
01:15:25.359 --> 01:15:27.960
kid as much attention as as they wanted. And then

1419
01:15:28.000 --> 01:15:30.840
there was also, you know from my general gen X right,

1420
01:15:30.880 --> 01:15:32.960
and then all of a sudden Millennials. It's like the

1421
01:15:33.079 --> 01:15:37.279
gen xers when they had kids, didn't raise them the

1422
01:15:37.279 --> 01:15:39.399
same way, same way like let's say we were raised

1423
01:15:40.239 --> 01:15:42.079
and then it was like, well now you're now you're

1424
01:15:42.079 --> 01:15:45.119
caddling and panpering your child. Now you're not supposed to

1425
01:15:45.119 --> 01:15:47.520
punish them. You can't hit them. Look, because there's between

1426
01:15:47.560 --> 01:15:51.000
hitting and beating, all right, a little smack that's a

1427
01:15:51.039 --> 01:15:52.359
lot different than taking the belt.

1428
01:15:52.399 --> 01:15:55.359
And I mean, this is brutalized and we're not talking

1429
01:15:55.359 --> 01:15:57.720
about brutal no, no, no, no, no, talking about correcting.

1430
01:15:58.159 --> 01:16:01.680
We know what's wrong and what's right. And so combine

1431
01:16:01.720 --> 01:16:05.039
that with the timeouts, the count to ten, the thirties,

1432
01:16:05.520 --> 01:16:07.920
then you have the kids because there was no punishment,

1433
01:16:07.920 --> 01:16:10.880
there was no correction. Then they're challenging the parent. The

1434
01:16:10.920 --> 01:16:14.600
parent can't correct the kid. Now you have CPS come

1435
01:16:14.640 --> 01:16:16.680
in and take you away if you even raise your time,

1436
01:16:16.800 --> 01:16:18.920
if you even say that your kid's not the gender

1437
01:16:18.960 --> 01:16:21.239
they believe, they separate you from your kid. Now, at

1438
01:16:21.319 --> 01:16:23.119
least in California they can do. I don't know if

1439
01:16:23.119 --> 01:16:26.399
it's that way in all fifty states, but it's insanity.

1440
01:16:26.600 --> 01:16:28.760
I mean, what's the point of being a parent if

1441
01:16:28.760 --> 01:16:30.640
you can't be a parent, you know? And then now

1442
01:16:30.680 --> 01:16:32.840
you have the school system that is the parent. The

1443
01:16:32.840 --> 01:16:35.199
state wants to be the parent, you know. And all

1444
01:16:35.239 --> 01:16:38.520
the things that we're talking about are not Republican or Democrat.

1445
01:16:38.880 --> 01:16:42.119
And the one things, Derek, that I am very tired of,

1446
01:16:42.399 --> 01:16:46.920
is politicizing everything. Can we just talk about people and Americans? Like,

1447
01:16:47.119 --> 01:16:48.960
I don't care what side drew on, It's not a

1448
01:16:49.000 --> 01:16:53.680
team sport what you guys want to get another point? Democrats? Okay, Republicans,

1449
01:16:53.720 --> 01:16:56.840
Look what I did, slammed. Who gives a damn doesn't

1450
01:16:56.840 --> 01:16:59.079
benefit the American people. We all have to live in

1451
01:16:59.119 --> 01:17:04.840
the same damn country. Tree does the policy work? Yeah,

1452
01:17:04.920 --> 01:17:06.720
And that's the way I look at it. You know,

1453
01:17:07.119 --> 01:17:09.560
I'm not Democrat anymore. I was a long time ago.

1454
01:17:09.640 --> 01:17:12.399
But I think when the party started going too far

1455
01:17:12.560 --> 01:17:15.439
off the deep end, I was like, it's never really

1456
01:17:15.439 --> 01:17:18.000
not for me. And then you know, I became more conservative,

1457
01:17:18.479 --> 01:17:20.840
But then again, I'm not. I'm not far right mag either,

1458
01:17:20.880 --> 01:17:23.039
you know. I'm like, you know, you got to have

1459
01:17:23.119 --> 01:17:24.479
check some bounds. You got to be able to hold

1460
01:17:24.479 --> 01:17:27.479
people accountable. Did I like some of the Trump things

1461
01:17:27.520 --> 01:17:29.640
Trump did? Yeah? Most people do like some things he does.

1462
01:17:29.680 --> 01:17:30.600
Do we like everything he does?

1463
01:17:30.600 --> 01:17:30.680
No?

1464
01:17:30.800 --> 01:17:31.600
Is he presidential?

1465
01:17:31.680 --> 01:17:32.039
Hell? No?

1466
01:17:32.560 --> 01:17:36.000
You know, honestly, you could lover hate Obama. But the

1467
01:17:36.079 --> 01:17:39.359
guy was great at his presentation. He knew how to speak,

1468
01:17:39.359 --> 01:17:42.000
he knew how to present himself. You know, there's things

1469
01:17:42.000 --> 01:17:43.960
he did that I can't agree with, especially when it

1470
01:17:44.000 --> 01:17:47.520
came to these USAG drones indiscriminately killing people overseas getting

1471
01:17:47.520 --> 01:17:49.880
the wrong targets. He killed entire family that was getting wet,

1472
01:17:49.960 --> 01:17:52.640
you know, married, you know, kids in cages. I'll just

1473
01:17:52.640 --> 01:17:54.920
just be honest to start with him, acl you tried

1474
01:17:54.960 --> 01:17:58.079
to sue him for that? So what did he do?

1475
01:17:58.119 --> 01:18:01.199
Bad stuff? Sure? But we did we ever have a

1476
01:18:01.199 --> 01:18:05.399
perfect president? No? Absolutely not. You know that nobody's infallible.

1477
01:18:05.399 --> 01:18:07.760
We're all human. We're all going to be human, We're

1478
01:18:07.800 --> 01:18:13.479
all going to be subject to influence, right, we're all

1479
01:18:13.520 --> 01:18:15.720
going to cave in. Hopefully not. But I mean, let's

1480
01:18:15.720 --> 01:18:17.399
be honest, if someone waves one hundred million dollars in

1481
01:18:17.439 --> 01:18:19.319
your face, most people are just saying, I'm I can say, no,

1482
01:18:20.640 --> 01:18:23.159
we don't have a perfect person. I mean, the presidency

1483
01:18:23.239 --> 01:18:27.640
is a popularity contest. Seriously, a lot of people that

1484
01:18:27.640 --> 01:18:30.119
are that are getting elected don't have the credential they

1485
01:18:30.159 --> 01:18:33.800
need to lead an actual nation. Like literally, so what

1486
01:18:33.840 --> 01:18:35.520
you're a mayor for a little bit doesn't mean you

1487
01:18:35.520 --> 01:18:37.239
could lead an entire nation. And all of a sudden

1488
01:18:37.239 --> 01:18:39.840
you're talking to putin no, no hold on. You know,

1489
01:18:40.199 --> 01:18:42.520
it's ridiculous how we elect our presidents.

1490
01:18:43.000 --> 01:18:47.079
Or you are you had a popular TV show right

1491
01:18:47.600 --> 01:18:47.840
or that?

1492
01:18:48.079 --> 01:18:52.199
Yeah, I'm in agree with you. It's it's it's crazy.

1493
01:18:52.199 --> 01:18:54.920
It's like everybody is like, we took our politics and

1494
01:18:54.960 --> 01:18:59.720
how we elect our present based on high school popularity.

1495
01:19:00.079 --> 01:19:01.640
Just what it really feels like. It's like we didn't

1496
01:19:01.640 --> 01:19:04.640
really evolve past that. It just doesn't make any sense

1497
01:19:04.640 --> 01:19:07.439
to it really doesn't. I hope that we can evolve,

1498
01:19:08.399 --> 01:19:11.079
hopefully soon, given given all the tension out there in

1499
01:19:11.119 --> 01:19:14.720
the world. We can we can hopefully like grow up

1500
01:19:15.800 --> 01:19:18.399
and and and treat everything like actual adults instead of

1501
01:19:18.840 --> 01:19:20.840
you know, figuring like kids in the playard.

1502
01:19:21.199 --> 01:19:24.119
I really do, yeah, And I agree with you about

1503
01:19:24.159 --> 01:19:26.119
something you mentioned on medicaid.

1504
01:19:26.199 --> 01:19:27.319
I think if you.

1505
01:19:28.960 --> 01:19:31.880
Are in your right mind and physically you're capable, you

1506
01:19:31.920 --> 01:19:34.399
should work. Because I don't want to go to the

1507
01:19:34.439 --> 01:19:36.319
grocery store and I got to pick out a few

1508
01:19:36.319 --> 01:19:38.520
items because I got a little bit of money, and

1509
01:19:38.560 --> 01:19:41.239
I see somebody come up with a full cart and

1510
01:19:41.359 --> 01:19:44.560
they whip out there be meat guard and you know

1511
01:19:44.640 --> 01:19:48.640
they're sitting at home and fully capable. But I do

1512
01:19:48.680 --> 01:19:52.119
think we need to make provisions further vulnerable and for.

1513
01:19:52.119 --> 01:19:54.439
Those who, yes, are are at risk.

1514
01:19:54.760 --> 01:19:58.079
But one of the things that that that unfortunately we're

1515
01:19:58.119 --> 01:20:01.479
going to see unless there are some real changes in

1516
01:20:01.560 --> 01:20:04.479
the big beautiful Bill, is that we're going to see

1517
01:20:04.520 --> 01:20:08.159
a lot of rural hospitals close, because we've already been

1518
01:20:08.239 --> 01:20:13.119
seeing that, and now that's what every state is saying

1519
01:20:13.159 --> 01:20:15.880
in some states are a lot more rule than others. California,

1520
01:20:15.920 --> 01:20:18.680
I know you have your areas of rural areas, but

1521
01:20:18.760 --> 01:20:21.439
I know you can like you can drive like from

1522
01:20:21.479 --> 01:20:25.319
city to city to city and just like almost yeah

1523
01:20:25.760 --> 01:20:29.159
in some places, but you think about where you know,

1524
01:20:29.239 --> 01:20:32.640
and and I'm not criticizing this, I'm wishing this wasn't

1525
01:20:32.640 --> 01:20:36.560
the case. But much of President trump space is in

1526
01:20:36.600 --> 01:20:42.319
these rural, mostly rural states like Mississippi and Alabama out west.

1527
01:20:42.479 --> 01:20:46.720
And these people already have so few hospitals and if

1528
01:20:46.720 --> 01:20:48.720
some of those clothes, what are they going to have

1529
01:20:48.760 --> 01:20:51.560
to do? Drive two hundred miles And women have to

1530
01:20:51.720 --> 01:20:55.319
cross state lines because of the laws against you know,

1531
01:20:55.399 --> 01:21:00.119
to prevent women from getting healthcare. And so these are

1532
01:21:00.119 --> 01:21:01.880
some of the things that are I think are gonna

1533
01:21:02.079 --> 01:21:04.439
unfortunately get worse before they get better.

1534
01:21:04.520 --> 01:21:06.359
And well they'll test us.

1535
01:21:06.600 --> 01:21:09.520
Did you experience any of that in any degree during

1536
01:21:09.520 --> 01:21:10.920
his first tren Oh?

1537
01:21:10.960 --> 01:21:13.520
Absolutely absolutely, yeah, absolutely.

1538
01:21:13.720 --> 01:21:16.920
Uh there's a I know here in our region we

1539
01:21:17.079 --> 01:21:21.720
lost well us here in our state, like three three

1540
01:21:21.840 --> 01:21:26.119
rural hospitals, and I know that there were well over

1541
01:21:26.159 --> 01:21:29.359
a dozen that have clothes in our eight southeastern states

1542
01:21:29.439 --> 01:21:32.720
and several right now, all right, risk and the cuts

1543
01:21:32.720 --> 01:21:36.479
in medicare are gonna they're gonna make several more clothes

1544
01:21:37.079 --> 01:21:40.000
and so it's it's gonna be it's gonna be a

1545
01:21:40.079 --> 01:21:45.159
challenge for an area that already were challenged. And a

1546
01:21:45.199 --> 01:21:48.640
lot of times public transportation, you know, is not there

1547
01:21:48.680 --> 01:21:50.520
for people. You can't get on the bus to go

1548
01:21:50.600 --> 01:21:55.359
downtown to the Level five trauma hospital. That's the safety

1549
01:21:55.399 --> 01:21:58.760
in that hospital with your you know, eighty miles from

1550
01:21:58.840 --> 01:21:59.960
your nearest hospital.

1551
01:22:00.159 --> 01:22:02.479
So yeah, those those were some of the issues. And

1552
01:22:02.520 --> 01:22:04.119
one of the other things that he did.

1553
01:22:03.960 --> 01:22:07.239
Have a real focus on was like on workforce development,

1554
01:22:07.319 --> 01:22:11.960
trying to to to see where there were nursage, shortages

1555
01:22:12.039 --> 01:22:15.880
of nurses and shortages of obg y ns and these

1556
01:22:15.960 --> 01:22:19.359
kind of kind of issues. And that's something that we're

1557
01:22:19.399 --> 01:22:22.399
going to continue to struggle with and to struggle within

1558
01:22:22.439 --> 01:22:24.720
the last and with the Biden administration, they're going to

1559
01:22:24.720 --> 01:22:27.239
continue to struggle with. But I think that there has

1560
01:22:27.319 --> 01:22:33.159
to be a lot of intentionality and a desire to

1561
01:22:34.359 --> 01:22:37.399
plug some of those gaps. And that's what where my

1562
01:22:37.560 --> 01:22:41.520
concern is is is that even on the radar, because

1563
01:22:42.359 --> 01:22:44.760
you know, it's gonna be a lot of cuts to Medicaid,

1564
01:22:44.880 --> 01:22:46.960
a lot of cuts. I mean they're talking about if

1565
01:22:46.960 --> 01:22:49.720
you if you cut social Security, you know, people work

1566
01:22:49.840 --> 01:22:53.439
your whole lives on the premise that this is what

1567
01:22:53.479 --> 01:22:56.520
you're going to get at the end. So we'll see

1568
01:22:57.000 --> 01:23:00.079
that's that's you know, there's an insistence.

1569
01:22:59.520 --> 01:23:05.279
That solid security has been mishandled by every administration, Okay,

1570
01:23:06.039 --> 01:23:09.520
and that's the unfortunate truth. You know, it was supposed

1571
01:23:09.520 --> 01:23:11.119
to be a safety in it when it was first enacted,

1572
01:23:11.920 --> 01:23:16.119
and it became people's retirements because honestly, you know, throughout

1573
01:23:16.119 --> 01:23:17.600
the years pensions went away.

1574
01:23:17.640 --> 01:23:22.159
You can't even very few people have a pensiancy these days.

1575
01:23:21.920 --> 01:23:24.520
Right, and so your four owing k ain't could to

1576
01:23:24.560 --> 01:23:27.239
pay out forever if you have thirty more years to live,

1577
01:23:27.279 --> 01:23:29.399
good luck on stretching three or four hundred thousand dollars

1578
01:23:29.520 --> 01:23:32.279
is not going to happen. Just do the math. So

1579
01:23:32.279 --> 01:23:34.319
solid security is a big issue. But the big issue

1580
01:23:34.319 --> 01:23:36.960
we have with it is the government or Congress decided

1581
01:23:36.960 --> 01:23:38.880
to use a slush fund. They reached into it too

1582
01:23:38.920 --> 01:23:42.000
much thinking nobody would notice. And let's just be honest,

1583
01:23:42.039 --> 01:23:43.680
over your lifetime, I mean, I'm not gonna do the

1584
01:23:43.680 --> 01:23:45.079
math in front of because I'm horrible at it on

1585
01:23:45.119 --> 01:23:48.399
the spot, but you know, let's just say, over your lifetime,

1586
01:23:48.439 --> 01:23:50.439
you paid you know, over a million or two million

1587
01:23:50.439 --> 01:23:54.680
dollars right over over your lifetime. You didn't, you didn't

1588
01:23:54.680 --> 01:23:58.560
earn any interest on it. Yeah, and then the government

1589
01:23:58.560 --> 01:24:01.760
tells you what you're allowed to take on, how much,

1590
01:24:01.920 --> 01:24:03.840
at what age, and if you take it at a

1591
01:24:03.840 --> 01:24:06.039
certain age too early, they penalize you and take more

1592
01:24:06.039 --> 01:24:06.680
away from you.

1593
01:24:06.880 --> 01:24:07.359
That's right.

1594
01:24:07.840 --> 01:24:09.560
Tell me how that works, because you know, damn well,

1595
01:24:09.600 --> 01:24:14.119
they're earning interest on those accounts, they're not just holding it.

1596
01:24:14.760 --> 01:24:17.159
But yet we don't benefit from it, and we don't

1597
01:24:17.159 --> 01:24:18.840
have a sales to whether or not we can put

1598
01:24:18.880 --> 01:24:22.119
into it or not. That doesn't make any sense.

1599
01:24:22.560 --> 01:24:23.800
Yeah, I agree, I agree.

1600
01:24:23.920 --> 01:24:27.000
And then not to give people the option of going

1601
01:24:27.600 --> 01:24:30.159
the private route where they know they can invest their

1602
01:24:30.199 --> 01:24:33.000
money and make more, that's that's terrible.

1603
01:24:33.199 --> 01:24:34.800
And and and I believe me I have.

1604
01:24:35.079 --> 01:24:38.079
I'm in that boat because I started collecting such security

1605
01:24:38.079 --> 01:24:39.319
a couple of years ago.

1606
01:24:39.439 --> 01:24:40.720
So my father too.

1607
01:24:40.840 --> 01:24:43.840
Yeah, yeah, you know, yeah, because all of us we

1608
01:24:43.920 --> 01:24:46.600
think about our parents and our aunts and uncles and

1609
01:24:47.039 --> 01:24:51.119
people who you know, who trusted that system, and so

1610
01:24:51.159 --> 01:24:54.760
the system is failing us, no question.

1611
01:24:54.479 --> 01:24:57.800
It's unfortunate. I don't even know how we fix it

1612
01:24:57.880 --> 01:24:59.680
at this point. Is if you even fix.

1613
01:24:59.600 --> 01:25:03.479
A well, I think one thing we can certainly do,

1614
01:25:03.560 --> 01:25:05.800
and you're right, it may not be, but is at

1615
01:25:05.880 --> 01:25:10.680
least give people an option of investing in their money

1616
01:25:10.720 --> 01:25:14.760
in that system, or at least or maybe part of

1617
01:25:14.760 --> 01:25:17.439
it in the system, and giving them some flexibility to

1618
01:25:17.520 --> 01:25:20.119
do some things in the in the in the marketplace,

1619
01:25:20.239 --> 01:25:23.279
you know, to uh and and I think if we

1620
01:25:23.319 --> 01:25:25.119
don't do that, but yeah.

1621
01:25:24.960 --> 01:25:26.479
It's it's gonna take a lot.

1622
01:25:26.560 --> 01:25:29.159
It's gonna take a lot of agreement, which is something

1623
01:25:29.199 --> 01:25:31.880
that we have very little of, right, I think a lot.

1624
01:25:31.720 --> 01:25:35.239
Of that Derek started in the school system because I mean,

1625
01:25:35.279 --> 01:25:38.920
they don't even teach homech anymore in most places, that's true.

1626
01:25:39.079 --> 01:25:40.920
I mean most kids don't even get out and knowing

1627
01:25:41.000 --> 01:25:43.359
how to cook, wash your clothes unless her parents teach them.

1628
01:25:43.800 --> 01:25:44.239
That's right.

1629
01:25:44.279 --> 01:25:45.720
You know what my mom would tell you if she

1630
01:25:45.800 --> 01:25:47.800
was here, She goes, I wouldn't letter touch my clothes.

1631
01:25:47.800 --> 01:25:50.479
I washed my unclothes, you know, I'm so big about it.

1632
01:25:51.000 --> 01:25:52.640
And I loved cooking, you know, was just it was

1633
01:25:52.680 --> 01:25:55.239
just a weird thing. But but in school I did

1634
01:25:55.279 --> 01:25:57.520
have some homech like I was introduced to, like it

1635
01:25:57.600 --> 01:25:59.880
was required to take a class you can choose for

1636
01:26:00.000 --> 01:26:03.000
regardless whether you liked it. So I was always drawn

1637
01:26:03.079 --> 01:26:05.720
to cook, and so you know, hey, I became decent

1638
01:26:05.760 --> 01:26:09.119
at that. But what they also didn't do, even though

1639
01:26:09.119 --> 01:26:11.520
they had on me in my time and I'm sure

1640
01:26:11.520 --> 01:26:16.760
in your time, is they never taught finances though. So

1641
01:26:17.600 --> 01:26:19.840
you know the option, as you said, to be able

1642
01:26:19.880 --> 01:26:24.119
to invest in an account outside that you could put

1643
01:26:24.159 --> 01:26:27.279
into and let it grow and mature over time. You know,

1644
01:26:27.279 --> 01:26:29.199
there's many ways you can do it. And I'm not

1645
01:26:29.199 --> 01:26:30.840
gonna advise anybody. I'm just saying there's ways you can

1646
01:26:30.880 --> 01:26:34.880
do it. Look into it yourself. But they don't teach that.

1647
01:26:35.159 --> 01:26:36.920
They don't even teach you how to balance your checking,

1648
01:26:37.439 --> 01:26:40.239
you know, your bank account. We have a society of

1649
01:26:40.319 --> 01:26:42.600
kids coming out that don't have a real concept of

1650
01:26:42.640 --> 01:26:47.279
how to handle and manage money, and so how are

1651
01:26:47.279 --> 01:26:49.600
we gonna how are we going to be able to

1652
01:26:51.039 --> 01:26:53.119
assume that they would be able to make the right

1653
01:26:53.159 --> 01:26:55.920
decisions for themselves. I'm not saying the government should do

1654
01:26:55.920 --> 01:27:00.680
it for them, but there's no reason at all that

1655
01:27:00.960 --> 01:27:03.279
this should not be part of their education. They should

1656
01:27:03.359 --> 01:27:06.960
understand that there's a thing called taxes, and this is

1657
01:27:06.960 --> 01:27:10.279
how this works. You know, this is what happens when

1658
01:27:10.279 --> 01:27:12.680
you're earn a wage this think about budgeting, like they

1659
01:27:12.680 --> 01:27:14.920
don't teach that anymore. And I know it sounds very elementary,

1660
01:27:15.399 --> 01:27:17.800
but you know, our kids are a future, right, as

1661
01:27:18.199 --> 01:27:20.560
I said, If they're not coming out together end with

1662
01:27:20.600 --> 01:27:22.960
this knowledge, If your parents aren't teaching them because they're

1663
01:27:23.000 --> 01:27:24.479
too busy working and trying to keep up with the

1664
01:27:24.520 --> 01:27:26.560
bills they have just to make sure the kids can eat,

1665
01:27:27.479 --> 01:27:30.560
then they're just going to come out of the household

1666
01:27:30.840 --> 01:27:32.359
and they're gonna be stuck in the same cycle that

1667
01:27:32.399 --> 01:27:34.680
most of us were. Because most of us didn't know anybody.

1668
01:27:34.680 --> 01:27:37.319
We're just like, oh, yeah, this is what happens. You

1669
01:27:37.359 --> 01:27:40.199
take it out automatically. Great, it's going to be their formulator. Cool,

1670
01:27:40.439 --> 01:27:42.760
I got so many hours and we earned this much. Okay,

1671
01:27:42.760 --> 01:27:45.039
you go to retire. Then wait a minute, what happened?

1672
01:27:45.039 --> 01:27:46.479
Why I'm only getting a quarter? What you told me

1673
01:27:46.880 --> 01:27:49.560
doesn't make any sense. So I think I think a

1674
01:27:49.560 --> 01:27:51.640
lot of what you said is correct, But we need

1675
01:27:51.680 --> 01:27:54.640
to start teaching it at schools. They got to be

1676
01:27:54.680 --> 01:27:56.199
exposed to the idea of it.

1677
01:27:58.279 --> 01:28:03.079
Yep, you're right. It's like up and.

1678
01:28:03.680 --> 01:28:07.520
Some auto mechanics, some basic classes that that just don't

1679
01:28:07.520 --> 01:28:12.800
get taught anymore. Some some instances where that's changing because

1680
01:28:12.840 --> 01:28:14.600
a lot of kids they don't even know how to

1681
01:28:14.680 --> 01:28:17.079
do basic maths. It's like if you put them if

1682
01:28:17.079 --> 01:28:19.039
they're going to work at Burger King or one they's

1683
01:28:19.479 --> 01:28:23.000
they can't even give you the proper change if she

1684
01:28:23.159 --> 01:28:26.840
doesn't tell them because they're so used to the calculator

1685
01:28:26.880 --> 01:28:28.079
doing it everything for them.

1686
01:28:28.159 --> 01:28:29.760
Yeah, it tells you, tells you what to do. It's like,

1687
01:28:29.760 --> 01:28:31.119
here's your mountain, here's what you get back.

1688
01:28:31.479 --> 01:28:34.640
Don't even have mom and Dad's phone number because it's

1689
01:28:35.039 --> 01:28:37.560
it's not the machine that.

1690
01:28:37.159 --> 01:28:41.560
So yeah, well I'm reliant. Yeah well, yeah, me too.

1691
01:28:41.760 --> 01:28:43.680
I have a good friend that tells me, yeah, don't

1692
01:28:43.720 --> 01:28:45.239
don't be so reliant on that.

1693
01:28:45.720 --> 01:28:48.319
So, yeah, we've got work to do, George.

1694
01:28:48.119 --> 01:28:48.600
Yeah we do.

1695
01:28:49.680 --> 01:28:49.960
Well.

1696
01:28:50.239 --> 01:28:52.840
Look, I don't know if you want to keep going

1697
01:28:52.880 --> 01:28:55.399
on on all of this, but I I personally think

1698
01:28:55.439 --> 01:28:56.880
we covered a lot of grounds.

1699
01:28:56.960 --> 01:28:59.800
We did. We did, we did. I'll tell you this

1700
01:29:00.199 --> 01:29:02.039
probably about twenty years of my life.

1701
01:29:02.199 --> 01:29:02.960
Sure, I vote.

1702
01:29:02.960 --> 01:29:05.920
I voted Republican more than I did Democrat. I believe

1703
01:29:05.960 --> 01:29:10.640
in a lot of Republican principles. I believe in. I mean, hell,

1704
01:29:11.079 --> 01:29:14.239
Lincoln was a Republican and he wasn't flawless, but he

1705
01:29:14.279 --> 01:29:17.640
did flip free the slaves. And it was the Dixiecrats

1706
01:29:17.760 --> 01:29:21.840
that the Southern Democrats that fought against integration and.

1707
01:29:23.520 --> 01:29:24.399
Inequality.

1708
01:29:24.560 --> 01:29:27.399
But and then I finally got to the point where

1709
01:29:27.920 --> 01:29:30.439
it dawned on me that you can't just care about

1710
01:29:30.479 --> 01:29:32.600
the kid and the womb and not care about them

1711
01:29:32.600 --> 01:29:34.880
once they get here. So I think it's you know,

1712
01:29:34.960 --> 01:29:37.800
there's there's there's there's issues on both sides, and I

1713
01:29:38.800 --> 01:29:42.000
see those issues too. So I think we're we're a

1714
01:29:42.000 --> 01:29:45.319
really good country when we can move more towards the

1715
01:29:45.359 --> 01:29:49.079
middle where there's uh, you know, I mean there's always

1716
01:29:49.159 --> 01:29:52.920
room for debate. But yeah, extremism on either side is

1717
01:29:52.960 --> 01:29:54.039
not good for us.

1718
01:29:54.359 --> 01:29:57.720
I think it takes people doing what we're doing, just yeah,

1719
01:29:57.800 --> 01:30:00.960
talking and having the conversation and not being afraid to

1720
01:30:00.960 --> 01:30:01.560
say things.

1721
01:30:01.600 --> 01:30:02.359
You know, that's right.

1722
01:30:02.560 --> 01:30:04.720
I mean, you need to be respectful, but we should

1723
01:30:04.760 --> 01:30:07.319
be able to at least discuss it absolutely, you know,

1724
01:30:07.359 --> 01:30:09.039
and if it's defensive, hey, you let me know. I'll

1725
01:30:09.079 --> 01:30:10.560
let you know. Good, you know, we'll deal with it.

1726
01:30:10.640 --> 01:30:13.359
But there's no reason not to have the conversation.

1727
01:30:13.760 --> 01:30:16.159
And usually when we talk, we find that we have

1728
01:30:16.199 --> 01:30:19.640
a lot more in common than we do. Uh that

1729
01:30:19.640 --> 01:30:22.159
that that that the things that divide us.

1730
01:30:22.800 --> 01:30:24.680
No, this has been good. I appreciate it to it.

1731
01:30:24.760 --> 01:30:26.840
Yeah, And you know why I think that is the

1732
01:30:26.880 --> 01:30:30.239
case they're Derek, is because I think in the end,

1733
01:30:30.359 --> 01:30:32.239
you know, just just humans in general, we all want

1734
01:30:32.279 --> 01:30:35.039
the same things. We want to say, Shelter. We want

1735
01:30:35.039 --> 01:30:35.680
to be able to live.

1736
01:30:35.920 --> 01:30:39.079
Yeah. Yeah, I want to earn a decent living and

1737
01:30:39.159 --> 01:30:42.720
live and be able to respect one another. And you know, yeah,

1738
01:30:42.800 --> 01:30:46.039
that's that's that's the real American dream right there.

1739
01:30:46.359 --> 01:30:47.640
That's what we need to get back to.

1740
01:30:47.760 --> 01:30:50.079
I mean, that's right, that's right, that's right where there's

1741
01:30:50.079 --> 01:30:52.000
a lot of self correcting that needs to be that.

1742
01:30:52.520 --> 01:30:55.079
Well, hey, you know what, you've had it on the

1743
01:30:55.119 --> 01:30:57.439
screen the whole time. I'm horrible at this. My brother's good.

1744
01:30:57.520 --> 01:30:59.880
He does the finger thing. But just tell everybody about

1745
01:30:59.880 --> 01:31:02.840
your book where you can get it and uh, where

1746
01:31:02.840 --> 01:31:05.479
it's available, because I mean, I think I think it's

1747
01:31:05.479 --> 01:31:08.239
worth reading. I mean we need to we need to

1748
01:31:08.279 --> 01:31:09.920
hear these perspectives. We really do.

1749
01:31:11.079 --> 01:31:14.039
Sure, well, thank you, George. Yeah, you can get my book.

1750
01:31:14.119 --> 01:31:16.880
I would suggest that, and I don't know, maybe you

1751
01:31:16.920 --> 01:31:22.920
can put this like overview on your on your site

1752
01:31:23.000 --> 01:31:25.239
or something, but I would tell people to go to

1753
01:31:25.600 --> 01:31:27.880
h Of course, you can google me and it'll take

1754
01:31:27.920 --> 01:31:31.359
you when the options will be my website, which is

1755
01:31:31.560 --> 01:31:36.479
www dot Derekgilliard dot com, and you can find out

1756
01:31:36.479 --> 01:31:38.399
a little bit more about me there. You can also

1757
01:31:38.439 --> 01:31:42.640
get it in Amazon at Barnes and Noble. Uh pretty much.

1758
01:31:42.760 --> 01:31:45.520
Uh yeah, those would those would be the real good places.

1759
01:31:45.560 --> 01:31:47.920
But go to my website. Google, just google me. It'll

1760
01:31:47.960 --> 01:31:50.920
take you to my website and you'll learn about what

1761
01:31:51.000 --> 01:31:53.600
motivates me and why I thought this was an important

1762
01:31:53.680 --> 01:31:56.560
story to tell. And we'll watch it and see how

1763
01:31:56.560 --> 01:31:58.960
it unfolds, and it's it's gonna be interesting.

1764
01:31:58.960 --> 01:32:01.279
But I've enjoyed it. Awesome.

1765
01:32:01.399 --> 01:32:03.960
I appreciate your time. I do and and again, it

1766
01:32:04.000 --> 01:32:07.000
took a while to get this to happen, but I

1767
01:32:07.039 --> 01:32:08.720
think it was worth it. It was a great conversation.

1768
01:32:08.800 --> 01:32:11.479
I think everybody that Jesus is going to get something

1769
01:32:11.520 --> 01:32:14.000
out of it for sure. And I'm gonna encourage people

1770
01:32:14.039 --> 01:32:16.840
to buy your book. And yes you could. You can

1771
01:32:17.479 --> 01:32:20.439
just google Derek and you can easily find. It comes

1772
01:32:20.520 --> 01:32:22.399
right up, so he's not hidden.

1773
01:32:23.159 --> 01:32:25.520
Absolutely, absolutely, thank you, my friend.

1774
01:32:25.640 --> 01:32:28.560
You are welcome. Thank you, sir, Appreciate you, right, sir,

1775
01:32:28.680 --> 01:32:29.079
thank you.

1776
01:32:29.680 --> 01:32:45.279
Great night. Your content feel attention behind redemption UH stance

1777
01:32:45.600 --> 01:33:10.479
on do